Nothing Beats an ACE

[jimcfs]

I was just reading the latest "About US" on JustPlaneNews. Front page story mentioned the new internal ACE program, "Accessing our Customer's Experience".

Why can't WTF use real CUSTOMERS to help here?

Anyway, does anyone know anything about this program? They mention the scorecard which is accessible through the employee site. Could someone tell us (or send me a copy) so we have an idea what is being looked at? I just flew a ROA-SNA trip this week and would like to score it based on these parameters.

TIA!

 

[Crzipilot]

Haven't seen the score card....but I did notice the little detail. It's employees flying on company business that will be doing the rating. Supposedly it's non-jeopardy, just a way to pinpoint or find areas that need improvement.

The gotcha that I saw was, "However, as with any performance
observation, if an individual incident is severe enough or if behavior
has reached a level that warrants discipline, it could lead to disciplinary progression."
So now we will have the management and professional employees of the Aiport Services Department, doing secretive observations that could lead to disciplinary actions?????????? sounds gestapo to me. What's the Union's takes on these things??? As far as inflight etc, I thought it was required by the contracts that any observation that could be considered a jeopardy event, must be announced ???

 

[tadjr]

From what I've heard from the CWA people I talk to, they were ok with it being a learning experience, but they do not want the company to be able to do discipline off of the report. Too many factors involved that could be inaccurate to do discipline and it would be a one time snapshot of an event.
MPO- If the report comes back that bad to begin with, I'm sure the company already knows there is a problem and should already be handling things regarding the agent and not waiting on an ACE report to do anything anyway.

 

[Crzipilot]

That would make sense, but the comment in quotes came right from the announcement of the ACE program.......

 

[UWCactus]

The observations are supposed to be done by people trained on the observations. For Inflight, it's not so much "were they nice?" It has a lot to do with service procedures, regulatory compliance, announcements etc,. These are generlly not things that the average traveler can observe for compliance.

 

[PHX-F/A]

If it's like some of the previous HP programs, it does not have a place on the form for employee names. But that can be easily traced by flight numbers and dates.

In some cases, we might have to push hard to hold them to their own "standards" for the program.

 

[jerseyfinn]

. . . So now we will have the management and professional employees of the Aiport Services Department, doing secretive observations that could lead to disciplinary actions?????????? sounds gestapo to me. . .

From a pax perspective ( speaking only to the issue of unacceptable employee behavior ), is the issue a badly acting employee or when and who determines that the badly acting employee is acting badly?

It's an incongrous argument to suggest there are qualifying circumstances to take the same bad behavior and throw out the evidence because no one warns the employees that the boss is going to be watching them do it. Bad behavior is bad behavior, plain and simple ( bad being defined as unacceptable). And for that, there is no excuse, and the cards should fall where they may. We all know that the children behave better when they know that mom and dad is watching. I fly enough to have seen a few bad apples. Fortunately they never impacted me directly, so I remain mute.

Now I do hear you loud and clear if the fear is that management might utilize clandestine observation to leverage an employee for minor miscues, or minor breeches of policy. This is counterproductive & ultimately does not improve performance or relationships between people. This provides opportunity for individuals to carry out a grudge or agenda against other individuals. But if you're quoting an official statement when you say "it could lead to disciplinary progression", I take "could" to mean something possible, but not necessarily certain or assurred.

Folks who are doing the job should have nothing to fear. And if someone is caught way out of hand, then they should be dealt with appropriately, for the sake of other employees and the customers. Of course I make these earnest remarks as someone who is not intimately familiar with the inner workings of management/employee relationships at USA. So please take my words as those of an uninitiated pax who simply wants a smooth flying experience.

I guess that my point is that if these management observations should by chance catch a true bad apple in the act, is it more important to fight precedent, or to discipline the bad apple and hopefully improve the product?

respectfully,

Barry

 

[tadjr]

A truly bad apple should be written up, and probably has been at some point in time. I think the problem most employees would have is not knowing what exactly the company is going to consider bad enough to get disciplinary on. Is it going to be up to the manager to decide? If so, then those agents who dont get along with the manager may have a problem. Is there going to be some consistency in how ACE reports are handled or again, up to the manager? If I dont greet the customer by name (or cant say it correctly) two or three times while they are there taking notes, is that bad? Or does it have to be something more dramatic? Unless there is an ironclad wording of the discipline steps and what is and isnt going to be considered and who is going to consider it, I see too much room for abuse against certain employees. Not that some of them wouldnt deserve some observation and correction, but maybe have the manager take the ACE report in hand, discuss with the employee and have the Supv/Manager OBSERVE the employee on their own to get a personal and better one on one understanding of their work. Then, discipline could be dealt with. I just think that there are too many variables in what people observe and think to have lots of ACES taking notes and using them against the employees in discipline. Look at how many opinions there are here on the same issue and how varied they are. Something that could affect the employees future should be handled in a more controlled environment I think. I think the overall program is good and if used correctly could be a great learning tool, just not for discipline.

 

[USCREW]

. . . So now we will have the management and professional employees of the Aiport Services Department, doing secretive observations that could lead to disciplinary actions?????????? sounds gestapo to me. . .

I have never heard of the "Airport Services Department" but I have done many observation rides for the east side. They're not a big deal and they are non-punitive. We gather information on preprinted questionaires and send them in to the special projects department. We are supposed to debrief the crew on safety matters only. The results are published and they help inflight fine tune problem areas. We don't announce ourselves so we can see what really happens on random flights. It's nothing as dramatic as "CLANDESTINE or SECRETIVE". Now... a check-ride is another matter.

 

[Crzipilot]

I agree, bad behavior is bad behavior......and should be corrected. Though as you said, your not in the airline biz....and well if you look back through history, (meaning past 30+ years) and see how management has interacted with the labor equation to the airlines, you'll understand why so many are gun shy on anything that "could" lead to disciplinary action....

 

[PITbull]

Do you really think that if Teddy were still employed and went back to flying she wouldn't be one of the first ones "Observed"

Exactly the point. And trust that management would be looking to terminate if given the opportunity. The company can not disciplne a f/a for unannounced check ride. All observation flights must be announced. The passenger is the supervisor on the flight. If customer service does not meet expectation, than the customer can write to the company via consumer affairs with the f/a name and flight number, date. That will warrant a discussion with the supervisor and discipline if warranted.

Management has no one to blame but its arrogant self for creating the situation where in most circles the industry is reviled and often deservedly so. Management has no one to blame for the attitudes of Labor. If Management had fostered good relations it makes one wonder if the Christmas Meltdown would have ever occurred.

Don't want to rehash this...but,

You know well Bob, that the Christmas meltdown was related to understaffing crews and ramp; not related to labor relations. There wasn't even enough folks to cater the a/c months before the meltdown, indicating shortages, and there were interoffice memos that went out among senior management reflecting such. These memos were sent by yours truly to the DOT as part of their investigation along with many other interoffice e-mails showing shortages of personnel throughout 2004 along with staffing on christmas, back as far as 2001 when the first 2,100 f/as were furloughed on Dec. 2. You remember those horrific shortages and 180 flights cancelled because the knuckleheads didn't have enough f/as for the christmas traffic. AT that time Wolf blamed labor. But Labor would NOT take the blame again for managment's failures...no way, not in 2004! Management got ratted out.

Management was not focused on customers or the needs of the operation. Management was at the table with all labor groups extracting another $1 Billion from labor along with the 21% immediate emergency (1113e) extraction of wages. None of management in any department was looking to recall more folks back to the airline to handle the increase in traffic with the down-grading status of PIT HUB to help with this increase and connections and baggage tranfers.

Lets remember to call an Ace an Ace and the Spade a Spade.

 

[john john]

The 70+ new shift managers will have a fun with this there new existents will be tested