PHX-Europe & 767-200 Range

[Dont call me Shirley]

The topic of PHX-Europe flights came up on another board and so did the question of US aircraft having the range for such routes.US Airways' 767s (both PI and US deliveries) are -200ER models; according to Boeing's website*, the aircraft are indeed capable of such routes. It has been said, both on this board and elsewhere, that in order for US to make use of the aircrafts' full range, the airline would have to pay some sort of fee to Boeing.

Does anyone "in the know" have solid information on this topic?



*
http://boeing.com/commercial/767family/pf/...losangeles.html
http://boeing.com/commercial/767family/pf/pf_200prod.html

 

[700UW]

There are not enough 767s for the Eastcoast to Europe flights, you won't see a 767 flying from PHX to Europe anytime soon.

 

[FWAAA]

Other than BA to LHR, what other nonstop European service is there at PHX?

Seems to me that if airlines thought it profitable to fly nonstop Europe to/from PHX, someone would already be doing it.

 

[bigbusboy]

PHX/FRA I believe is what's being considered. We could feed it in PHX and LH/Star Alliance could feed it in FRA. It would be a nice additional connection to the Star Alliance. BA has no feeder potential out of PHX and only its' own network out of LHR. It probably would work well but the 767 would be marginal at best. We also are robbing peter to pay paul with them all of the time here in PHL....just not enough of them.

 

[BuffaloJoe]

PHX/FRA I believe is what's being considered. We could feed it in PHX and LH/Star Alliance could feed it in FRA. It would be a nice additional connection to the Star Alliance. BA has no feeder potential out of PHX and only its' own network out of LHR. It probably would work well but the 767 would be marginal at best. We also are robbing peter to pay paul with them all of the time here in PHL....just not enough of them.

A PHX-FRA route would need 1 or 2 planes to do the route daily?

 

[AstroLounge]

I seriously think London and Frankfurt would be successful out of PHX, maybe LAS too. Europeans LOVE to travel and if the region really promoted itself abroad the English, Germans and other SUN Worshippers would head RIGHT to The Desert and forget all about a SWAMP named Florida. The Desert Southwest is one of the most intriguing geographical areas in the country and the residents are VERY hospitable. The sun,heat,eats and "hotties" need to be enjoyed Worldwide.

 

[PHL]

...would head RIGHT to The Desert and forget all about a SWAMP named Florida. The Desert Southwest is one of the most intriguing geographical areas in the country and the residents are VERY hospitable. The sun,heat,eats and "hotties" need to be enjoyed Worldwide.

Too bad there are no beaches or Disneyworlds in the desert. Clearly, there isn't enough O&D traffic to warrant the service - especially that which is driven by leisure travelers alone. And the connection traffic to points further West seems to be a stretch since all the major Euro hubs already have West coast nonstop service. Why add a PHX stopover for such a route?

 

[luvn737s]

Too bad there are no beaches or Disneyworlds in the desert. Clearly, there isn't enough O&D traffic to warrant the service - especially that which is driven by leisure travelers alone. And the connection traffic to points further West seems to be a stretch since all the major Euro hubs already have West coast nonstop service. Why add a PHX stopover for such a route?

Phoenix is 5th largest city in the US and growing. PHL is shrinking. Money goes where the action is.

 

[BuffaloJoe]

Too bad there are no beaches or Disneyworlds in the desert. Clearly, there isn't enough O&D traffic to warrant the service - especially that which is driven by leisure travelers alone. And the connection traffic to points further West seems to be a stretch since all the major Euro hubs already have West coast nonstop service. Why add a PHX stopover for such a route?

Just imagine hot "HOT" those plastic seats would be in the sun wearing shorts. No Thanks.

B)

 

[USCREW]

Phoenix is 5th largest city in the US and growing. PHL is shrinking. Money goes where the action is.

The action is not in Phoenix although it is a large city.
It rates very poorly in the top ten public policy areas against other states:

1. Education--dead last for 2006!
2. Family incomes
3. Housing
4. Public transportation
5. Environment
6. Local government
7. Crime and punishment
8. Health and healthcare
9. Business futures
10. Arts and Culture

U.S. Census

 

[UWCactus]

PHX-FRA is only being considerd if China falls through and if a long range a/c (iec, A340) is acquired. That according Derek Kerr.

 

[ClueByFour]

Phoenix is 5th largest city in the US and growing. PHL is shrinking. Money goes where the action is.

Uhh, PHL is the 4th largest MSA in the country. PHX is 14, and there is about a 2 million person difference. Let's not get all that excited.

 

[BuffaloJoe]

Uhh, PHL is the 4th largest MSA in the country. PHX is 14, and there is about a 2 million person difference. Let's not get all that excited.

The story was misleading too as comparing PHL and PHX. They used PHX MSA over PHL City itself. But who gives a crap who got a bigger cone of ice cream. What they failed to say, what percentage of "Retired" and "Disabled" people that live in the PHX area. This is not a knock on PHX. I am just stating that their are different variables when comparing PHX, TUS, LAS to other cities. Just as there are in Florida.

 

[zethya]

I think I already mentioned this at least 3 or 4 times here. The US Airways 767-200ER was purchased with the idea that it would only be used to destinations with a fully loaded range of about 4000nm. Consequently, to save money, an option was selected to lower the Maximum Take Off Weight (MTOW), which translates to maximum range, primarily because of the associated fuel limitations. The MTOW can be changed by Boeing for a price and an associated software upgrade. There is no required physical change to the airframe itself. The US 767s could be upgraded to reach FRA from PHX (with seasonal climate/altitude considerations) or TLV from PHL if (I assume) US decided these route were more economically attractive than the routes currently being served.

 

[AstroLounge]

The action is not in Phoenix although it is a large city.
It rates very poorly in the top ten public policy areas against other states:

1. Education--dead last for 2006!
2. Family incomes
3. Housing
4. Public transportation
5. Environment
6. Local government
7. Crime and punishment
8. Health and healthcare
9. Business futures
10. Arts and Culture

U.S. Census

I personally would live in a cardboard box on the streets of Scottsdale than one of the mansions of the Dupont clan. You can keep Philly and its luster (HA!) and daily clusterf*......I don't even live in the West but know good from dreadful