Pilot seniority arbitration award is out

[A320 Driver]

You know, driver, you will be known by the company you keep.

You chose to support the Shuttle arbitration yet you oppose the natural consequence. Perhaps you represent the mental problem that exists here at US. You are insane.

And you are an A$$.

A320 Driver :angry:

 

[dusty]

It was best said on the ALPA board. "We will burn this house down and hand the west the ashes" Look for sick calls from one of the two F/Os in Europe this summer and Island fever sweeping the Caribbean. Never in 23 years have I ever seen the massive outrage displayed by the east pilot group. I pity the passengers flying US and the agents that will have to deal with them.

 

[Phoenix]

It was best said on the ALPA board. "We will burn this house down and hand the west the ashes" Look for sick calls from one of the two F/Os in Europe this summer and Island fever sweeping the Caribbean. Never in 23 years have I ever seen the massive outrage displayed by the east pilot group. I pity the passengers flying US and the agents that will have to deal with them.

I wouldn't worry too much. All the pilots are professionals and wouldn't do anything stupid that would get them fired (or write something stupid and announce that they plan to do something that might get them fired).

They all will do everything safely, efficiently, and with a smile on their face. How do I buy a vacation package to the Med?

 

[ussnark]

Asking for DOH was a major FU. The Arbitrator couldn't give it to you anyway due to ALPA merger guidance. They wasted all there time on a non starter issue, Why? because thats what the pilots wanted. AAA bet on green, the should have went with red or black when playing roulette.

Macaroon.

ALPA merger policy is for DOH not to disregard other factors, if brought up.

Before tossing your cookies you might wish to educate yourself as to the factors involved. Not that it would help macaroons like you.

 

[Bear96]

can someone explain how Doug and Scott engineered this result. those guys are good.

Again, why would the company care who is in which position on the list?

 

[Busdrvr]

On the other hand the arbitrator was supposed to preserve career expectations to the greatest degree possible and by his own admission, did not do it. West did not bring widebodies to the party, but if operations were merged today, they could step IMMEDIATLY into the widebody jobs. This same arbitrator denied immediate access to the widebody flying to the Shuttle pilots in that seniority award citing the fact that they had none. Then he turns around and awards this flying to the West pilots almost unrestricted. He protected 500, but seniority #818 is a Captain on the A330 effective July one. Sooner or later West will push him and others onto less paying equipment.

Makes NO sense to me.

A320 Driver B)

Sounds a lot like what the east F/A's did to the west with DOH...

I found this interesting article on a similar decision at Air Willy and the resulting attempt to decertify ALPA.

http://www.projectposner.org/case/1990/909F2d213


and a U blast from the past

http://cf.alpa.org/mec/aaa/docs/newmectoda.../merger0201.pdf

 

[bigbusdrvr]

On the other hand the arbitrator was supposed to preserve career expectations to the greatest degree possible and by his own admission, did not do it. West did not bring widebodies to the party, but if operations were merged today, they could step IMMEDIATLY into the widebody jobs. This same arbitrator denied immediate access to the widebody flying to the Shuttle pilots in that seniority award citing the fact that they had none. Then he turns around and awards this flying to the West pilots almost unrestricted. He protected 500, but seniority #818 is a Captain on the A330 effective July one. Sooner or later West will push him and others onto less paying equipment.

Makes NO sense to me.

A320 Driver B)

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With a "No bump, no flush" provision, how will the west eventually push #818 to lower paying equipment. wouldnt he have recall rites if displaced?

I think he would have to voluntarily bid a lower paying equipment for his own reasons, therby loosing the recall rites...

Am I wrong, if so please explaine...I may be in the same position, dont want to make a mistake...thx

 

[USCREW]

Sounds a lot like what the east F/A's did to the west with DOH...

Yeah right....very similar to placing anyone hired in 1988 behind a junior punk hired in 2005. Which part of D.O.H. is complicated?

 

[BoeingBoy]

With a "No bump, no flush" provision, how will the west eventually push #818 to lower paying equipment. wouldnt he have recall rites if displaced?

I think he would have to voluntarily bid a lower paying equipment for his own reasons, therby loosing the recall rites...

While it doesn't affect the 330 as much as the 75/76, there's a "mini" bump/flush every fall when the seasonal TA flying is pulled down. So anyone hanging on the bottom during the summer might very well be displaced in the fall.

Under the current East contract, there is no preferential right to return given to a pilot displaced, no matter whether it's from equipment, position, or base. All vacancies are awarded strictly on seniority #. Whether that'll change in any combined contract is an unknown at this point.

Jim

 

[Busdrvr]

Yeah right....very similar to placing anyone hired in 1988 behind a junior punk hired in 2005. Which part of D.O.H. is complicated?

Kind of like what U did to the eastern 757 folks when you "bought the jets"

Simply put, ALPA doesn't do DOH because it would result in nothing but "equipment and asset" purchases in the future.

 

[Phoenix]

Yeah right....very similar to placing anyone hired in 1988 behind a junior punk hired in 2005. Which part of D.O.H. is complicated?

That would be Capt Junior Punk who isn't jumping up and down.

Unless the ALPA MECs all of a sudden develope some uncommon skills of leadership to direct this newfound level of emotion... oh never mind.

 

[Viper16]

It's about career expectations. I know my views which are primarly the west's views are not popular with most of you guys but it is what it is. All furloughs before this merger have been put behind all actives, why did you think this would be any different? because some have many years of service? They didn't expect to come back, plain and simple. That's why most got new jobs elsewhere. I bet Colello never expected to wear a mainline uniform again, now he's a B757 fo with over 300 pilots behind him.

I know Mr Colello quite well and based on the attrition on the east he definitely planned on being back - in fact he was back, flying under the USAirways certificate. For argument sake let's take the furloughs out of the picture. How about the pilot one number senior to Dean - Joe Monda who has worked continuously since 18 Jul 88. How do you justify that he is junior to pilots hired on 4 Apr 2005. Joe has no furlough time.

He's probably not even on reserve anymore, not so with Odell. He's still on the very bottom with NOBODY underneath him. What about his expectations that he had when he came on board?

Poor Dave - been here a whole 2 years and his expectations are shot? When he was hired he nad NO expectations of flying a 330 to Europe and now he does ahead of those who in fact had those expectations when they were hired.

You people say windfall due to all the attrition, but not all the east that are retiring are Captains, alot will be Fo's.

Even if they are FOs, it is generally on the big equipment and when a FO senior to you retires it is an opportunity to get off reserve.

Kind of like what U did to the eastern 757 folks when you "bought the jets"

Simply put, ALPA doesn't do DOH because it would result in nothing but "equipment and asset" purchases in the future.

ALPA doesn't do DOH because United was instrumental in getting the policy changed in the early 90s when they were afraid of the first UA/US merger talks.

 

[allegheny36]

If it wasen't for us you wouldn't have any profit to share.

You can't spell hope you fly a plane better <_<

 

[USCREW]

That would be Capt Junior Punk who isn't jumping up and down.

Unless the ALPA MECs all of a sudden develope some uncommon skills of leadership to direct this newfound level of emotion... oh never mind.

No offense to Mr.Odell, as I'm sure he's a nice guy...I'm just furious for our pilots. IMO, this is the biggest injustice of all. We've never seen anything like it.

 

[bigbusdrvr]

While it doesn't affect the 330 as much as the 75/76, there's a "mini" bump/flush every fall when the seasonal TA flying is pulled down. So anyone hanging on the bottom during the summer might very well be displaced in the fall.

Under the current East contract, there is no preferential right to return given to a pilot displaced, no matter whether it's from equipment, position, or base. All vacancies are awarded strictly on seniority #. Whether that'll change in any combined contract is an unknown at this point.

Jim

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Thanks for the explaination...