TWU negotiations.........what?

[Chuck Schalk]

The Presidents Council took the time for negotiating training. Is this suppose to make us feel like they really have a say in contract negotiations? For anyone to think it does, is misinformed! [The TWU International encouraged the concessions of 2003 and now they act like they don't know what we need. The Presidents Council does not need training, they need the TWU International to demand our contract back and lead the membership into battle. But that won't happen, The TWU will hide behind the Presidents Council and blame everything on the Negotiating Committee and the members because they were trained. Even though the Negotiating Committee or the members do not own the contract. Meaning that Jim Little and Gary Yingst have to sign off on the contract not the Negotiating Committee. That is why the negotiating Committee are labeled as only witnesses to the contract( look in your contract book).
The TWU is so entrenched with the company that it is difficult to tell which represents us. This whole project of opening the contract early is a farse. The contract in my opinion has been already discussed and the needs are set awaiting for the games to begin in November. We are mere pawns in this game and the earlier you realize it, the better off you will be to accept your predetermined fate. If the TWU International is just a shadow of the company, then why do we need the TWU International in the Air Transport Division? Anyone can do what the company requests. Remember, the TWU ATD did not support any strikes, bankruptcy, or abrogation of contracts with any real teeth. Talk is just talk! Some were non AFL/CIO and some were AFL/CIO members! To me what is the difference if it will affect us down the road? What is the ATD Purpose if they didn't try to protect our industry!
Negotiations is not what it seems!

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Chuck,

A very good post.
Well thought out, truthful, informative etc, etc !!

But alas, your hard work, will go for "naught"

As you know so well, THE # 1 problem with the TWU/ATD is, NOT AA, not the International, Not even Little/Yingst !

It is(SADLY) the majority of AMT "members" in TUL/DFW/AFW who will ensure, that the twu continues to "INFEST" the AMT group as a whole.

I will depart this earth(some day), NEVER/EVER understanding HOW/WHY the "majority" of these AMT's can continue to "take it in the shorts", and "look in the mirror" with out incuring "projectile VOMMITING" !!!

The male members(of this majority) must surely notice, that when they put there hands in their pockets, that their SCROTUM is MISSING .

I am baffled...TOTALLY baffled !!!!!!!!!!!

NH/BB's

 

[ch53D]

Chuck,

A very good post.
Well thought out, truthful, informative etc, etc !!

But alas, your hard work, will go for "naught"

As you know so well, THE # 1 problem with the TWU/ATD is, NOT AA, not the International, Not even Little/Yingst !

It is(SADLY) the majority of AMT "members" in TUL/DFW/AFW who will ensure, that the twu continues to "INFEST" the AMT group as a whole.

I will depart this earth(some day), NEVER/EVER understanding HOW/WHY the "majority" of these AMT's can continue to "take it in the shorts", and "look in the mirror" with out incuring "projectile VOMMITING" !!!

The male members(of this majority) must surely notice, that when they put there hands in their pockets, that their SCROTUM is MISSING .

I am baffled...TOTALLY baffled !!!!!!!!!!!

NH/BB's

You’re correct about these three stations. Let’s not forget the big picture. Title II is a bigger problem system wide than TUL/DFW/AFW in Title I.


2003 vote results.

Title I: 6250 yes 6173 no = 77

Title II: 1272 yes 459 no = 813

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

You’re correct about these three stations. Let’s not forget the big picture. Title II is a bigger problem system wide than TUL/DFW/AFW in Title I.
2003 vote results.

Title I: 6250 yes 6173 no = 77

Title II: 1272 yes 459 no = 813

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

ch53D,

A good point !

Where are the majority of these title II jobs/stations ?

Also, can you possibly post a station/local.... break down of the title I..2003... YES vote(only) ?

Permit me to add something that I omitted from my earlier post.

I FULLY realize that "everyone's not the same".

For example,
An AMT in BOS/JFK/LGA/EWR/PHL may react in a "milli-second" and tell AA to *UCK OFF, whereas AMT's(in say) ORD/MIA/LAX/SFO may take a little longer to tell AA to *UCK OFF(and thats OK), ...BUT... to CONTINUALLY bend over, and take it in the shorts(without any grease) for AA, in the.."Famous BIG 3 stations" is (to me) BEYOND BELIEF)

And before I forget.........MCI, which group DO YOU fall into ??


ch53D,...Thanx in advance !!

NH/BB's

 

[ch53D]

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

ch53D,

A good point !

Where are the majority of these title II jobs/stations ?

Also, can you possibly post a station/local.... break down of the title I..2003... YES vote(only) ?

Permit me to add something that I omitted from my earlier post.

I FULLY realize that "everyone's not the same".

For example,
An AMT in BOS/JFK/LGA/EWR/PHL may react in a "milli-second" and tell AA to *UCK OFF, whereas AMT's(in say) ORD/MIA/LAX/SFO may take a little longer to tell AA to *UCK OFF(and thats OK), ...BUT... to CONTINUALLY bend over, and take it in the shorts(without any grease) for AA, in the.."Famous BIG 3 stations" is (to me) BEYOND BELIEF)

And before I forget.........MCI, which group DO YOU fall into ??
ch53D,...Thanx in advance !!

NH/BB's

Yes No

510 20 72
514 3998 1869
521 17 16
529 186 333
530 795 290
561 33 375
562 51 828
563 81 440
564 187 559
565 225 580
567 620 773
569 16 14
590 20 24

Title II big station is no other then DFW

 

[Wretched Wrench]

Any time the ATD ventures beyond monosyllabic, they get confused. As in capitulation vis à vis negotiation.

 

[Hackman]

Yes No

510 20 72
514 3998 1869
521 17 16
529 186 333
530 795 290
561 33 375
562 51 828
563 81 440
564 187 559
565 225 580
567 620 773
569 16 14
590 20 24

Title II big station is no other then DFW

Jeez I remember now!!!! Look at all the 514 goo-gobblin' yes voters!!!! Still amazed even today.

Why is that not a surprise.

Show us the ShAAred SAAcrifice :blink: :blink: :blink:

 

[Wretched Wrench]

...........Yes........No

510.... 20....... 72
514.... 3998.. 1869
521.... 17....... 16
529.... 186..... 333
530.... 795.... 290
561.... 33...... 375
562.... 51...... 828
563.... 81...... 440
564.... 187..... 559
565.... 225..... 580
567.... 620..... 773
569.... 16....... 14
590.... 20....... 24

It is worth noting that only the fraidy cats at TUL and MCI sissied out. The line station mechs voted it down. BNA had their roster padded with non-mechanics.

 

[ch53D]

It is worth noting that only the fraidy cats at TUL and MCI sissied out. The line station mechs voted it down. BNA had their roster padded with non-mechanics.

That’s not true for BNA. Title IV was separate in the vote.

Title IV

101 yes 15 No

 

[Chuck Schalk]

The way stations voted was mostly influenced by the boo factors given out by the TWU and the company. That is the threats if we did not approve the contract in 2003. The biggest problem of all is the lies and misinformation that poisons the minds of the TWU members and persuades them to vote out of fear as opposed to an informed vote. Knowledge is power and i have found that when the members research the truths and ask the hard questions they get angry and continue their quest for answers. This produces an informed member. The TWU enjoys the ignorance of its members and in my opinon uses it against ourselves. This is part of the reason why we are so dysfunctional. Amidst the chaos lies the rulers (TWU Int'l) who make you think they represent us all in harmony. When in actuality, they represent themselves, the company, and then the members. To further validate my point, the TWU and the company implemented much of the concessions and much of the programs that have affected our members. They pat each other on the back for jobs well done but give nothing of value to the members who work under these new programs.
remember the more we sacrifice, the more shares they get!

 

[TWU informer]

For myself,

I am now well versed and a victim of the problem.

I am very interested to discover a SOLUTION!

 

[767 mechanic]

Yes No

510 20 72
514 3998 1869
521 17 16
529 186 333
530 795 290
561 33 375
562 51 828
563 81 440
564 187 559
565 225 580
567 620 773
569 16 14
590 20 24

Title II big station is no other then DFW

Bear I realize that the bases are the majority of the problem. Although it was not by very much,AFW voted no. The majority of the yes voters came from 530-KC and 514-Tulsa. Tulsa voted 68% yes and KC voted 73% yes. Chuck mentioned fear facture and I agree Chicken Little didn't have the balls to show up at the 2nd largest local (AFW). He decided to send his flunky lawyer. We had a group of about 10 people from AFW that went to Tulsa to pass out fliers at the Brady Theater in Tulsa when Chicken Little showed up for his fear campaign. The 514 was informed informed of their intention and arrival in advance by one of the people in the group and they were not allowed in. I don't know of any other union/local that would not allow a member in good standings in to another locals meeting.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

That’s not true for BNA. Title IV was separate in the vote.

Title IV

101 yes 15 No

So, then, were all 44 votes on the chart cast by mechanics?

 

[FWAAA]

Ya know, you guys are all focused on who voted yes and who voted no as if these numbers are gospel. Not sure I get the point. Why?

On the one hand, hundreds of posts here alleging that your union lies to you (and perhaps it does) and hundreds of posts here alleging that AA's management lies to you (and perhaps it does as well).

Yet all of a sudden, everybody puts stock in these vote totals as if they're the pure and unadulterated truth.

How do you know these vote totals weren't simply manufactured by your union and the company to reflect the pre-ordained outcome (that the concessions would be "approved" by a majority of the voters)?

I wouldn't put any faith in Chicago's presidential vote totals (or NYC, for that matter), let alone these votes. Can't figure out why you guys continue to do so.

Oh, well. Carry on. B)

 

[PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH]

Ya know, you guys are all focused on who voted yes and who voted no as if these numbers are gospel. Not sure I get the point. Why?

On the one hand, hundreds of posts here alleging that your union lies to you (and perhaps it does) and hundreds of posts here alleging that AA's management lies to you (and perhaps it does as well).

Yet all of a sudden, everybody puts stock in these vote totals as if they're the pure and unadulterated truth.

How do you know these vote totals weren't simply manufactured by your union and the company to reflect the pre-ordained outcome (that the concessions would be "approved" by a majority of the voters)?

I wouldn't put any faith in Chicago's presidential vote totals (or NYC, for that matter), let alone these votes. Can't figure out why you guys continue to do so.

Oh, well. Carry on. B)

FWAAA, I have to give you credit. You hit the nail right on the head this time. This vote was done in haste and fraud could have easily been accomplished using the system that AAA had in place.