US AFA labor thread 3/28-
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BajaBabe
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- Aug 9, 2005
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dont want my post lost so, this week a member of our council went into the union office with John McCorkle and reviewed the council 70 LEC Budget. Michael Elias looked at the allowable expense for afa and found John was deducting his crash pad as an expense. this is allowable per afa so they say under the hotel section but I agree with Michael when he told them perception is everything. If I were you, I would bring this forward at the next LEC meeting because our flight attendants are sick and tired of the free ride of afa officials and the ability to bank vacation time, sick time and not be accountable for their actions. if this were allowable why did just john claim it and not the other elected officers of this council? I tip my sombrero to michael for taking the time and the guts. I was sick at the thought of confronting McCorkle with this chatter, how many standards do we set for certain people? happy to be back in philly and to see my cat CHEWY!
PITbull
Veteran
Thank God for Michael. He, at least, keeps that office on heir toes, and probably on guard.
One can only hope that Michael runs again and beats the pants of McCorkey...which shouldn't take much.
One can only hope that Michael runs again and beats the pants of McCorkey...which shouldn't take much.
Travelpro72
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- Jan 30, 2005
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Good for YOU Michael Elias wherever you are. At least SOMEBODY has some man berries around here. ****Hey all of you PHL commuters**** ....wanna get your crashpad for free? Simply run for office. You can deduct your breakfast lunch and dinner too and alleviate a need to shop for groceries. Let me know how many votes you get next election John. Sure won't be mine baby.
With that said please allow me to switch gears for a minute. I was casually looking over on the Northwest board about the f/a's having satellite bases. I know everyone has a different contract but thought about the possibility here. Let's face it, negotiations will take a lot longer. I know this has been discussed a long time ago but with all of the flying the east bases do out west wouldn't it benefit the airline to negotiate a deal for satellite bases? WITHOUT interfering with those in PHX's flying couldn't this be done? It would quite easily be staffed with f/a's that commute to the east and could benefit the airline by better utilization of crews. Am I missing something here? I know they don't want to negotiate outside of joint negotiations but it would benefit the company greatly. Would it not?
With that said please allow me to switch gears for a minute. I was casually looking over on the Northwest board about the f/a's having satellite bases. I know everyone has a different contract but thought about the possibility here. Let's face it, negotiations will take a lot longer. I know this has been discussed a long time ago but with all of the flying the east bases do out west wouldn't it benefit the airline to negotiate a deal for satellite bases? WITHOUT interfering with those in PHX's flying couldn't this be done? It would quite easily be staffed with f/a's that commute to the east and could benefit the airline by better utilization of crews. Am I missing something here? I know they don't want to negotiate outside of joint negotiations but it would benefit the company greatly. Would it not?
flybynite
Veteran
You raise a rather interesting question about satellites. I'm not real sure about it being helpful at all.
I would think cross utilizing east and west aircraft and crews out of PHX would be more efficient but I think hell will freeze over before that happens!
I would think cross utilizing east and west aircraft and crews out of PHX would be more efficient but I think hell will freeze over before that happens!
NoMoreKoolAid
Senior
- Nov 12, 2007
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I would loved to have been TheFlyOnTheWall for that one!
Then maybe not. Tell him to come to DCA anytime!Funny you should mention satellite bases; I sent an email not too long ago about that subject to AFA. Was told it is not being considered, because it would split us from the pilots. Why this company is soooooo scared to break us away from the pilots is beyond me... Regional mentality dies hard....
NoMoreKoolAid
Senior
- Nov 12, 2007
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From what I understand AFA has brought the company around to sticking with the pilots. At least thats the last I hear from our council.
flybynite
Veteran
It's more a "been there, done that" and it didn't work well reason.
Also, it's not really efficient nor cost effective because we all work the same rigs. Not to mention it does nothing for CRM.
beachboy
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- Jul 7, 2006
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Separation from the pilots is Pandora's box for two simple reasons.
1. This company can neither read nor follow contractual language. They use our working agreements like Puffs Plus to wipe their noses daily. They only respect FAA regulation because they law makes them and if they could get away with that...trust me they would. So, even if we negotiated every protection the pilots have under our contract it's just that...a contractual obligation. How fast you think it would take them to go wild with that?
2. PHL in the summer thunderstorm season. Kiss your nice little 3 day commutable GOODBYE! You will be rescheduled like the wind. Scattered Smothered Covered and SPIT!
Not a smart idea for our base alignment and us a flight attendant group. I will say I think the company is using this Me Too as leverage in negotiations. They know the pilots are hopelessly lost and will most likely be the end of this carrier. So by linking us all together what do they care?
Frankly the AFA mec should recall the negotiating committee back to regular duties until Doug gets serious. It's a wait of everyone's time and we are sick of it.
1. This company can neither read nor follow contractual language. They use our working agreements like Puffs Plus to wipe their noses daily. They only respect FAA regulation because they law makes them and if they could get away with that...trust me they would. So, even if we negotiated every protection the pilots have under our contract it's just that...a contractual obligation. How fast you think it would take them to go wild with that?
2. PHL in the summer thunderstorm season. Kiss your nice little 3 day commutable GOODBYE! You will be rescheduled like the wind. Scattered Smothered Covered and SPIT!
Not a smart idea for our base alignment and us a flight attendant group. I will say I think the company is using this Me Too as leverage in negotiations. They know the pilots are hopelessly lost and will most likely be the end of this carrier. So by linking us all together what do they care?
Frankly the AFA mec should recall the negotiating committee back to regular duties until Doug gets serious. It's a wait of everyone's time and we are sick of it.
Travelpro72
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- Jan 30, 2005
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I am not talking about separating from pilots or intermingling crews of east and west. If you have all of that airbus flying in and out of phx to san, lax, sfo, sea and wherever else that is done with EAST BASED crews why not try to negotiate a satellite? It would utilize the a/c and east crews as they do now. You could have a/c there, crews there and in the event of some snafu your crews are not stuck on the east coast and can't make it or on the left coast and stuck. I'm not saying fly west's schedules at all. There is a lot of east based crews flying into and out of PHX and LAS doing turns to quite a few cities. If negotiated as a side item it would give the company flexibility and allow many of the west coast commuters (pilots/flight attendants) to staff it. I just don't see it being a negative. I know each airline is different and have different contract language but looking at Delta and Northwest merging and opening satellite bases just seems wise until single contracts are ironed out. An airline 3 times our size and it's getting done. Go figure.
Fair enough guys, but why is almost every other carrier able to successfully separate its Pilots and FA's? I have many friends at other carriers that separate from their pilots. They are able to work productively, sometimes more productively than the pilots! Yes, they may have longer duty days, and longer flight hours, but so what? Aren't we here to work? Flying one leg and enjoying a 28 hour overnight is nice, but not everyone wants to waste their entire month doing that. Some, such as me, would enjoy the option of 10 hour transcon turns, etc....
Couldn't this be feasible with the proper protections in our contract? Say, only a certain percentage of turns, rigid duty day restricitions, rescheduling restrictions, etc? Of course, we would have to nip the abuse in the bud with strong contractual language, and the FA's would actually have to learn their contract! Imagine!?
I just fail to see what massive "protections" these pilots are now giving us. Further, whenever we are about to go illegal, or are being jerked around by scheduling, it is usually one of the flight attendants that is on the phone with crew sked giving them a heads up, or demanding to be replaced, NOT the pilots. Last time, the pilots were trying to convince us that we had to go to 16 hours!
Also, beachboy mentions PHL in the thunderstorm season. How does AA deal with DFW/ ORD in the thunderstorm season? How does DL deal with ATL during the thunderstorm season? Why would PHL be so different?
Edit: TO Travelpro72: I was told that pilots will NEVER have satellite bases.. Way too expensive to have Pilot admin, which would be required. That is why other carriers have only FA satellite bases. Take it for what it's worth....
Couldn't this be feasible with the proper protections in our contract? Say, only a certain percentage of turns, rigid duty day restricitions, rescheduling restrictions, etc? Of course, we would have to nip the abuse in the bud with strong contractual language, and the FA's would actually have to learn their contract! Imagine!?
I just fail to see what massive "protections" these pilots are now giving us. Further, whenever we are about to go illegal, or are being jerked around by scheduling, it is usually one of the flight attendants that is on the phone with crew sked giving them a heads up, or demanding to be replaced, NOT the pilots. Last time, the pilots were trying to convince us that we had to go to 16 hours!
Also, beachboy mentions PHL in the thunderstorm season. How does AA deal with DFW/ ORD in the thunderstorm season? How does DL deal with ATL during the thunderstorm season? Why would PHL be so different?
Edit: TO Travelpro72: I was told that pilots will NEVER have satellite bases.. Way too expensive to have Pilot admin, which would be required. That is why other carriers have only FA satellite bases. Take it for what it's worth....
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