US Airways Pilots Labor Thread 12/8-12/15

[hp_fa]

1. **IF** the judge rules against USAPA and implements the Nic award, can this still be negotiated away with the company?

I'm not sure. The age old adage of anything can happen comes into play. However, if the judge was to implement Nicolau then I strongly believe that the company would accept it and move on rather than get into a fight with the provisions of any judgment of a federal judge.

2. If the judge does decide in favor of the Nic how does this affect the constitution of USAPA? My understanding is that their constitution is based on date-of-hire. If the judge forces Nic into play this will be in opposition to their constitution.

It would cause problems with that constitution if the judge were to find as such and he would, in my opinion, order it modified within a set time frame.

 

[767jetz]

This is what its like to explain BINDING ARBITRATION to a East pilot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqwFnyxu-OA

+1

 

[pilotn79]

This is what its like to explain BINDING ARBITRATION to a East pilot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqwFnyxu-OA

This is to be expected when you try to reason with a LIBERAL.

 

[Tiger 1050]

hp-fa,
Thanks for the clarification. And sorry for the poor choice of words. I was just trying to convey the jist of my question....

 

[hp_fa]

The choice of words was fine. I edited the response because the wording you used, in retrospect, was fairly specific and I wanted to answer the question as posed.

 

[Phoenix]

I asked a simple question that required a yes or no answer. You answer the question with a history lesson from the Civil War. The obvious answer was yes and you know it. Does this clear it up a bit for you? How you make it through a FAA oral is beyond me.

There is a reason Conferate money is not legal tender. Maybe one day it will be. Maybe not.

 

[curious]

Thanks to all for the explanations. Best of luck to all, safe travels, and have a Happy Holiday. Back to lurking!

 

[Metroyet]

There is some talk about a settlement prior to the trial. I hope there is no deal. I'm looking forward to seeing the look on Lee's face after the verdict.

"Lee" knows how this is going to end. He has since day one. He isn't going to be surprised when this whole thing implodes back into the Nic Award.

It's Bradfords et. al. faces I'd like to see.

The millions in lost wages/benefits
The millions in legal fees
The Wasting of Careers....for?

NOTHING.

Great Job Angry FO Club!!!

 

[nycbusdriver]

"Lee" knows how this is going to end. He has since day one. He isn't going to be surprised when this whole thing implodes back into the Nic Award.

It's Bradfords et. al. faces I'd like to see.

The millions in lost wages/benefits
The millions in legal fees
The Wasting of Careers....for?

NOTHING.

Great Job Angry FO Club!!!

You don't understand. USAPA never assured the elimination of the Nicolau list. It's simply giving it it's best shot. On the east we all went into this process with eyes open, and whatever the court decides will not surprise me, nor anyone else. One side may prevail, or the judge may actually exhibit some of Solomon's wisdom and hand down something that will piss both sides off.

Seham, Bradford, and the rest of us will not be at all surprised or particularly irate over whatever the outcome is. It's just the business of the union to do union business in accordance with its C&BLs. If the Nicolau shame survives intact, that's that. Time to move on knowing we've given our best shot at eliminating that old man's embarrassment.

 

[cleardirect]

You don't understand. USAPA never assured the elimination of the Nicolau list. It's simply giving it it's best shot. On the east we all went into this process with eyes open, and whatever the court decides will not surprise me, nor anyone else. One side may prevail, or the judge may actually exhibit some of Solomon's wisdom and hand down something that will piss both sides off.

Seham, Bradford, and the rest of us will not be at all surprised or particularly irate over whatever the outcome is. It's just the business of the union to do union business in accordance with its C&BLs. If the Nicolau shame survives intact, that's that. Time to move on knowing we've given our best shot at eliminating that old man's embarrassment.

That is a bold statement sir. The way many here go back and dig up past quotes. That may come back to haunt you.

I hope that is the thinking of the leadership and the rest of the membership. But USAPA has all ready stated they will continue this for years and pursue an appeal. It sure seems like a lot of wasted time, money and effort just to “give it your best shotâ€￾.

“will not be at all particularly surprised or irate over whatever the outcomeâ€￾ It is a shame that was not the attitude of the east after the Nicolau in the first place. But what makes you think that attitude will prevail the second time around?

 

[Metroyet]

It's just the business of the union to do union business in accordance with its C&BLs.

Sure. The highly revered, (and illegal) "Constitution". Do you think Judge Wake, (or anyone else for that matter) is simply that stupid?

I predict a new land speed record for DFR all inside of 90 days.

Also, Bradford on video, during one of his pre USAPA promotional tours, (east side only of course because they could only find 4 hours in 9 months to show up in PHX) touting the abandonment of the Nic Award if USAPA is elected to be a "slam dunk".

It, (and everything else USAPA ever wrote on and off line) are archived in the AOL files. I wouldn't be surprised to find it in court shortly.

 

[N924PS]

If the Nicolau shame survives intact, that's that. Time to move on knowing we've given our best shot at eliminating that old man's embarrassment.

I hope USAPA or AWAPPA, as the case may be, will indeed recognize that's that. And will in fact move on.

After all, if USAPA wasn't conceived just to eliminate "that old man's embarassment", they would serve the combined pilot group much better by focusing on negotiating a new contract. Enough resources have been expended on both sides.

It is time to move on.

 

[A320 Driver]

You don't understand. USAPA never assured the elimination of the Nicolau list. It's simply giving it it's best shot. On the east we all went into this process with eyes open, and whatever the court decides will not surprise me, nor anyone else. One side may prevail, or the judge may actually exhibit some of Solomon's wisdom and hand down something that will piss both sides off.

Seham, Bradford, and the rest of us will not be at all surprised or particularly irate over whatever the outcome is. It's just the business of the union to do union business in accordance with its C&BLs. If the Nicolau shame survives intact, that's that. Time to move on knowing we've given our best shot at eliminating that old man's embarrassment.

I doubt seriously if we as a group will "move on" no matter what happens. Arrogance and stupidity brought us LOA 93, the Nic and a variety of other ills. If that isn't enough, the voting pilots of USAPA just voted to reinstate the roll call vote, the single most destructive weapon ever used by our union reps. I don't blame the West pilots one bit for being ticked. We made a deal. We blew it. When it didn't turn out like we wanted, we switched unions to try to undo the result. The best case scenario is we arbitrate again, either voluntarily or forced in a method similar to what Delta/Northwest went through. More likely we will have the Nic shoved down our throat and have to pay some sort of reparations.

There was a time when cooler heads might have brought us closer together. I think that time is past.

A320 Driver

 

[exB717Flyer]

Seham, Bradford, and the rest of us will not be at all surprised or particularly irate over whatever the outcome is.

You seem to forget something very important: if Judge Wake rules against you there will be compensatory and punitive damages. He will want to make you pay for your little experiment and you might well find it wasn't worth the effort at all. We can only hope this comes to pass.

 

[Boeing Driver]

He will want to make you pay for your little experiment and you might well find it wasn't worth the effort at all. We can only hope this comes to pass.

Once again proving beyond a shadow of a doubt why AWA was the place where you went when you couldn't get a job anywhere else.

A home town judge might rule in your favor and you think it will be over? Dream on.


Boeing Driver