2015 Pilot Discussion.

[Claxon]

 
He's obsessed with avatars and is drawn to the number 666. Nevermind the briefs.
 

 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-JLbAePwoHQ

 

[snapthis]

 
He's obsessed with avatars and is drawn to the number 666. Nevermind the briefs.
 

 
He can stare at my new avatar for the next 8 hours.
 

 

[Phoenix]

I hope Marty keeps you reading until you get the message.

Everything he writes, he bills. The real message is in the bill. Really.

 

[snapthis]

Everything he writes, he bills. The real message is in the bill. Really.

 
Most attorneys bill. Really.
 
Maybe you can get Claxon to supervise.

 

[Metroyet]

Everything he writes, he bills. The real message is in the bill. Really.

About that...thanks for paying the West back the millions they've spent. It's well appreciated.

 

[Phoenix]

About that...thanks for paying the West back the millions they've spent. It's well appreciated.

Are you expecting a refund for your tie? Or your monthly donations... 😀

 

[Phoenix]

Most attorneys bill. Really.
 
Maybe you can get Claxon to supervise.

You still don't understand the message, but don't worry, you will get the message reissued each month.

 

[snapthis]

You still don't understand the message, but don't worry, you will get the message reissued each month.

It's my pleasure. Money well spent to keep the messenger employed.

 

[Metroyet]

Are you expecting a refund for your tie? Or your monthly donations... 😀

The 4+ million out of the Easts share or the refund ought to reimburse the West for everything. Every single $675.00 tie included.

How much will the yellow usappy ties cost? Better hurry up. 75 days til show time. Gonna need a few million to play. Of course I believe Silver is going to slap any east committee with the Nic so my guess is no one ever shows up on behalf of the poor, misunderstood Easties. Better keep that in mind before you donate thousands of your hard earned dollars. I know I wouldn't trust any east guy with a dime. If they no-show. Expect your donation to go "poof" Anyway. Looks like you may have already spent your share of the 1.3 million. That means whatever east committee there may be, as of this writing, doesn't have a pot to piss in. 🙂

 

[snapthis]

USAPA attorney Roland Wilder is asking them now, do not have to personally.  USAPA attorney Roland Wilder will ask the Supreme Court also.
 
We will find out the results next year.  How is the phx pilot base morale doing lately?  (rhetorical)

Just think, if Mike Cleary had not burned those bridges a while back, USAPA may have stood a better chance in the 9th. Oh well, a little late now. Maybe he let his emotions get the best of him when he fired Lee Seham and burnt bridges with other unions who employed his firm:

The Mike Cleary Issue
Innuendo, Versus Facts!
For those pilots who remember the USAPA Presidents message entitled The Lee Seham Issue of November 06, 2011, this letter from the President of the Teamsters Local 1224 will be interesting. Those who do not recall that particular message from Mike Cleary may remember it was largely a rationalization for unilaterally firing the Seham Law Firm.
Among his proffered reasons for this action was Mikes assertion that most of Sehams other clients were dissatisfied with the firm. We shall not dignify Clearys libelous claims by repeating them here, but they can be reviewed on the USAPA Website.
Cleary asserted that among those unhappy clients of Seham, Seham, Meltz and Peterson are the Teamsters Union.
Well, the following letter, written to Mike Cleary from Mr. Boyd, President of the Teamsters Local 1224 is a full refutation of Clearys characterization of their professional relationship and a lot more. Enjoy the read. This letter has not been edited for content.
Please direct any thoughts, or questions you might have after reading Mikes Presidents Message and this letter to Mike Cleary and the Board


Captain Michael Cleary
President
US Airlines Pilot Association
200 East Woodlawn Road Suite 250
Charlotte, NC 28217

Captain Cleary,
I am sending this letter to follow up on a phone conversation we had on November 18 regarding the communication piece you sent to your USAPA membership on November 6th. While your choice of legal counsel for USAPA is your business, I find it both inappropriate and unprofessional for you to publicly speak about other unions relationships with said counsel. In this case, such public correspondence is particularly problematic because your information is both misleading and inaccurate.
In your November 6th letter, you stated that SWAPA terminated their relationship with Seham just this year for incompetence and billing irregularities. It should be noted that SWAPA did not have a long-standing relationship with Seham, Seham, Meltz & Petersen, so there was no relationship to be terminated. We hired Mr. Sehams firm for a single System Board of Adjustment/Arbitration in Spring of 2010 in which we were attempting to get a pilot reinstated after a termination. The firm had been recommended to SWAPA by another Southwest union that uses the firm regularly. SWAPA chose to hire outside counsel for that arbitration because the subject-matter relating to the pilots termination was specialized, and Mr. Sehams firm had done extensive work in that field. That single arbitration is the only experience SWAPA had with Mr. Sehams firm. When that arbitration concluded, our relationship with the firm also ended. They were not terminated by SWAPA for either incompetence or billing irregularities. We elected to not use them going forward at that time.
Because your letter to the USAPA membership is misleading and inaccurate, I again request (this time in writing) that you retract the statements made to your membership and issue a correction about SWAPAs past business dealings with Seham, Seham, Meltz & Petersen.
Sincerely,
Steve Chase



Captain Michael Cleary
President
US Airlines Pilot Association
200 East Woodlawn Road Suite 250
Charlotte, NC 28217

Dear Captain Cleary:
My name is Captain Robert Boyd former President and Chief Steward of Airline Professional Association (APA Teamster Local 1224). On background I have been employed at ABX AIR INC., former Airborne Express since 1979. During my time at Airborne Ive had the opportunity to represent the Locals Pilots and Professional Flight Engineers both as a two-time elected Chief Steward for 4 years and two-time elected President of Teamsters Local 1224 for six years exclusively representing the Cockpit Crewmembers of Airborne Express.
I have recently reviewed a communication you distributed to your USAPA members making certain representations concerning Mr. Lee Seham of Seham Seham Meltz and Petersen regarding the legal services both he and this law firm provided to the Teamster membership.
As President of Teamster Local 1224, my appointed duties involved the direct hiring and oversight of the Locals staff legal counsel as well as the recruitment and hiring of outside counsel used in several specialized areas oflaw. The Local believed that the crewmembers it represented deserved a vigorous legal representation to protect their valuable careers and the Local cast the net wide to hire the best and notable in each area of law required to represent the membership.
I would request to go on record that to my direct knowledge during my tenure in office the only legal representation Mr. Seham provided for the Teamsters both at the Local or National level was for Teamster Local 1224.
Mr. Seham represented Teamster Local 1224 as outside lead counsel on cases that broached well beyond the areas of expertise and experience that could be provided by the Locals own staff attorneys. Mr. Seham represented our membership at RLA arbitrations, DOT ALJ legal hearings and before the NTSB. In every case his experience, commitment and tenacity helped the Local prevail in very difficult cases in defense of the members valuable careers. While I am aware of Teamster criticism of Mr. Seham at the International level, that criticism was based on his representation of independent unions and not on the quality of legal services provided to Teamster members.
Given Mr. Sehams factual track record of service for Teamster members at Local 1224, I am requesting that you correct or retract your statements made to your membership concerning Mr. Sehams Legal representations of Teamster Pilot members. For the record we currently have members flying today, and providing for themselves and their families, as a direct result of Mr. Sehams involvement.
Fraternally,
B-767 Captain Robert Boyd

http://compasscorrectioncoalition.com/2012/01/26/unionism-cleary-style/

 

[Phoenix]

The 4+ million out of the Easts share or the refund ought to reimburse the West for everything. Every single $675.00 tie included.
How much will the yellow usappy ties cost? Better hurry up. 75 days til show time. Gonna need a few million to play. Of course I believe Silver is going to slap any east committee with the Nic so my guess is no one ever shows up on behalf of the poor, misunderstood Easties. Better keep that in mind before you donate thousands of your hard earned dollars. I know I wouldn't trust any east guy with a dime. If they no-show. Expect your donation to go "poof" Anyway. Looks like you may have already spent your share of the 1.3 million. That means whatever east committee there may be, as of this writing, doesn't have a pot to piss in. 🙂

If Silver overreaches and tells APA they have to set up an East committee that argues for the Nic... That would be a dream come true! ... For Leospanker, the LAA and the East... and the lawyers too!!

 

[Phoenix]

Just think, if Mike Cleary had not burned those bridges a while back, USAPA may have stood a better chance in the 9th. Oh well, a little late now. Maybe he let his emotions get the best of him when he fired Lee Seham and burnt bridges with other unions who employed his firm:
The Mike Cleary Issue
Innuendo, Versus Facts!
For those pilots who remember the USAPA Presidents message entitled The Lee Seham Issue of November 06, 2011, this letter from the President of the Teamsters Local 1224 will be interesting. Those who do not recall that particular message from Mike Cleary may remember it was largely a rationalization for unilaterally firing the Seham Law Firm.
Among his proffered reasons for this action was Mikes assertion that most of Sehams other clients were dissatisfied with the firm. We shall not dignify Clearys libelous claims by repeating them here, but they can be reviewed on the USAPA Website.
Cleary asserted that among those unhappy clients of Seham, Seham, Meltz and Peterson are the Teamsters Union.
Well, the following letter, written to Mike Cleary from Mr. Boyd, President of the Teamsters Local 1224 is a full refutation of Clearys characterization of their professional relationship and a lot more. Enjoy the read. This letter has not been edited for content.
Please direct any thoughts, or questions you might have after reading Mikes Presidents Message and this letter to Mike Cleary and the Board
Captain Michael Cleary
President
US Airlines Pilot Association
200 East Woodlawn Road Suite 250
Charlotte, NC 28217
Captain Cleary,
I am sending this letter to follow up on a phone conversation we had on November 18 regarding the communication piece you sent to your USAPA membership on November 6th. While your choice of legal counsel for USAPA is your business, I find it both inappropriate and unprofessional for you to publicly speak about other unions relationships with said counsel. In this case, such public correspondence is particularly problematic because your information is both misleading and inaccurate.
In your November 6th letter, you stated that SWAPA terminated their relationship with Seham just this year for incompetence and billing irregularities. It should be noted that SWAPA did not have a long-standing relationship with Seham, Seham, Meltz & Petersen, so there was no relationship to be terminated. We hired Mr. Sehams firm for a single System Board of Adjustment/Arbitration in Spring of 2010 in which we were attempting to get a pilot reinstated after a termination. The firm had been recommended to SWAPA by another Southwest union that uses the firm regularly. SWAPA chose to hire outside counsel for that arbitration because the subject-matter relating to the pilots termination was specialized, and Mr. Sehams firm had done extensive work in that field. That single arbitration is the only experience SWAPA had with Mr. Sehams firm. When that arbitration concluded, our relationship with the firm also ended. They were not terminated by SWAPA for either incompetence or billing irregularities. We elected to not use them going forward at that time.
Because your letter to the USAPA membership is misleading and inaccurate, I again request (this time in writing) that you retract the statements made to your membership and issue a correction about SWAPAs past business dealings with Seham, Seham, Meltz & Petersen.
Sincerely,
Steve Chase
Captain Michael Cleary
President
US Airlines Pilot Association
200 East Woodlawn Road Suite 250
Charlotte, NC 28217
Dear Captain Cleary:
My name is Captain Robert Boyd former President and Chief Steward of Airline Professional Association (APA Teamster Local 1224). On background I have been employed at ABX AIR INC., former Airborne Express since 1979. During my time at Airborne Ive had the opportunity to represent the Locals Pilots and Professional Flight Engineers both as a two-time elected Chief Steward for 4 years and two-time elected President of Teamsters Local 1224 for six years exclusively representing the Cockpit Crewmembers of Airborne Express.
I have recently reviewed a communication you distributed to your USAPA members making certain representations concerning Mr. Lee Seham of Seham Seham Meltz and Petersen regarding the legal services both he and this law firm provided to the Teamster membership.
As President of Teamster Local 1224, my appointed duties involved the direct hiring and oversight of the Locals staff legal counsel as well as the recruitment and hiring of outside counsel used in several specialized areas oflaw. The Local believed that the crewmembers it represented deserved a vigorous legal representation to protect their valuable careers and the Local cast the net wide to hire the best and notable in each area of law required to represent the membership.
I would request to go on record that to my direct knowledge during my tenure in office the only legal representation Mr. Seham provided for the Teamsters both at the Local or National level was for Teamster Local 1224.
Mr. Seham represented Teamster Local 1224 as outside lead counsel on cases that broached well beyond the areas of expertise and experience that could be provided by the Locals own staff attorneys. Mr. Seham represented our membership at RLA arbitrations, DOT ALJ legal hearings and before the NTSB. In every case his experience, commitment and tenacity helped the Local prevail in very difficult cases in defense of the members valuable careers. While I am aware of Teamster criticism of Mr. Seham at the International level, that criticism was based on his representation of independent unions and not on the quality of legal services provided to Teamster members.
Given Mr. Sehams factual track record of service for Teamster members at Local 1224, I am requesting that you correct or retract your statements made to your membership concerning Mr. Sehams Legal representations of Teamster Pilot members. For the record we currently have members flying today, and providing for themselves and their families, as a direct result of Mr. Sehams involvement.
Fraternally,
B-767 Captain Robert Boydhttp://compasscorrectioncoalition.com/2012/01/26/unionism-cleary-style/

Where are the letters from these guys telling D.U.I. to use the N.I.C. ?

 

[snapthis]

Where are the letters from these guys telling D.U.I. to use the N.I.C. ?

Ask Claxon..

I have found the revised proposed TRO. Here's a sample

1. Defendants USAPA and Gary Hummel, Stephen Bradford, Rob Strehle, Steve
Smyser, Robert Frear, Courtney Horman, Ronald Nelson, Paul Diorio, Paul Music
John Taylor, Jay Milkey, and Stephen Nathan and each of them are temporarily
restrained from authorizing the expenditure of USAPA funds obtained from the
collection or dues and assessments of US Airways pilots during the period that
USAPA was the exclusive bargaining agent of LUS Airways pilots in support of
activities of any kind, including but not limited to (1) payment of attorneys, experts,
witnesses, office space or Ilight pay loss to pilots for purposes of preparing for and
participating in the Substantive Seniority Integration Process culminating in an
arbitration before Arbitrators Dana Eischen. Ira Jaffe and W. David Vaughn, and

(2) payment of attorneys and costs for any actions that oppose implementation of
the ruling issued by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals on June 26, 2015, In
Addington v. USA PA, Nos. 14-15757, 15874, 15892, regardless of the Corum III
which such opposition is attempted, except that reasonable expenses incurred for
preparing the Petition for Hearing En Bane that was filed July 10,2015 may be paid.



http://leonidas.cactuspilots.us/USAPA_NC_DJ_Suit/Doc_62-9_Revised_Proposed_TRO.pdf

 

[CactusPilot1]

I think it will take 8 months for the court to respond to the En Banc and Supreme court questions, take your time.
 
How fitting you posted on page 666 of this forum. How is it going in the phx base, I hear there are a lot of dissenters?
 

 
Who cares how long your appeals take. The new seniority list will most likely be in place. The appeals won't stop the SLI.
 

 

[Metroyet]

If Silver overreaches and tells APA they have to set up an East committee that argues for the Nic... That would be a dream come true! ... For Leospanker, the LAA and the East... and the lawyers too!!

following the injunction issued by the 9th isn't "over reaching" it's the law. The East pilots, via their fake union, broke the law. Time to pay up.