Amfa Ballot Count Questions
- Thread starter Skymess
- Start date
mrfish3726
Veteran
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2004
- Messages
- 931
- Reaction score
- 0
AMFA swore they wouldn't cave, guess DELL is eating humble pie now. Next is NWA, they will cave there to, and see more of their membrs losing their jobs. How many did you guys at UniTED vote away again this time??????
mrfish3726
Veteran
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2004
- Messages
- 931
- Reaction score
- 0
And this is ALL YOU WILL GET FROM UniTED management, "We appreciate that the members of AMFA have voted to ratify their tentative agreement with United (BULLETIN BOARD: UALAQ) . This is an important and necessary step in providing the cost savings United needs to finish its restructuring successfully.
Amazing, they are laughing at you all the way to their pensions!!!!!
Amazing, they are laughing at you all the way to their pensions!!!!!
It happened exactly like I said it would. No way am I defending the IAM, but when the IAM brought back that TA with a 7% paycut with pensions, retiree health care, and heavy maintanence still intact, didn't the AMFA supporters at UAL urge rejection and promise the people that they will be better off in bankruptcy? Well now they lost it all and the mighty AMFA has done nothing. AMFA is all talk and chest thumping. NW management will wipe the hangar floor with AMFA's a$$ there too. And they won't even be in bankruptcy. I'm sure glad we at AA did not take the advice of the better off in bankruptcy crowd. We still have our pensions and other retirement benefits, less expensive benefits, and higher pay after these new agreements at UA are implemented. Anyone at AA who says we would have been better off in bankruptcy needs to be drug tested.mrfish3726 said:
synchronicity
Advanced
- Joined
- Nov 27, 2002
- Messages
- 144
- Reaction score
- 0
I expect the Usual Suspect will be along shortly to tell you how not only should you have not conceded, but you should take to the streets and STRIKE when all your demands are not met!aafsc said:
-synchronicity
I worked at EAL. So I know from experience that airline employees are not better off in bankruptcy. I could not believe it when the AMFA supporters at UA (and AA) were actually saying that bankruptcy would be better.synchronicity said:
PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH
Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2003
- Messages
- 1,401
- Reaction score
- 2
Even though I feel they should have VOTED NO and struck. UAL mechanics still have their vacation,benefits,and only lost two holidays. Their maintenance bases,except for SFO,were given away by the IAM before AMFA ever got there! Their DB pension was flushed to the PGBC and replaced by a defined contribution plan,something that is fixing to happen at AA despite all the B.S. on this board. UAL mechanics pay is still on par with AA when you reflect that AA overhaul bases are shutdown for one week at christmas time without pay,United never gave up the paid lunch(2.5 hrs extra a week at AA), They still have all their vacation(extra week that AA mechanics have to work), They only lost two holidays compared to five lost at AA(another extra five days that AA have to work).
UAL would have been in bankruptcy,even if the the mechanics voted YES on their first concessions package over two years ago. AA and USAIR set the snowball in motion for concessions in this God forsaken industry and now dummies like aafsc,CIO,TWUeretc. are blaming AMFA for it? UAL in many ways is just now catching up to AA in the concessions race to the bottom!
UAL would have been in bankruptcy,even if the the mechanics voted YES on their first concessions package over two years ago. AA and USAIR set the snowball in motion for concessions in this God forsaken industry and now dummies like aafsc,CIO,TWUeretc. are blaming AMFA for it? UAL in many ways is just now catching up to AA in the concessions race to the bottom!
Princess, I talked to a laid off UA AMT. He told me ALL heavy maintanence is gone. I asked him what aircraft do you still do heavy maintanence on? He said "none". There are a number of things that AA and it's unions could do to keep the pension programs going. I find it odd that people are critical of efforts to keep what we have. It is as though some want our pensions to be terminated just so the TWU can be put in a bad light. I would think that a majority of UA AMTs (and NW AMTs) would love to have what AA AMTs still have. AMFA went in and promised that they "don't negotiate concessions" and that with their "iron clad" layoff protection, AMTs would be playing cards in the hangar before they would ever be laid off. Yes, AMFA's "$60/hr" and slogan of "make a stand for a hundred grand" was all talk just to get dues. Ask any UA employee if they are "better off in bankruptcy". Who will AMFA blame when they get crushed to dust at non-bankrupt NW? The fact is AMFA has been a disaster at the airlines where they are present. I know you will say that they got the $35/hr at NW. NW just decided to take a loss in the short run to rid themselves of the AMFA AMTs in the long run. That means FOREVER. This plan was hatched a few years ago by NW management and will come to fruition very shortly.PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH said:
SAY WHAT??? You bash the one union (AMFA) that has done more to promote our profession and has been brutalized by the NMB, Company Managements, and opposing unions for their efforts. Only a union buster or corporate stooge would not feel remorse for the plight of our fellow AMT's at other airlines.
PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH
Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2003
- Messages
- 1,401
- Reaction score
- 2
aafsc, I suggest you look at your own situation before you bash UAL situation. Almost all of the low cost airlines have outsourced their fleet service functions to outside contractors. How long do think AA is gonna to keep you above market rate unskilled guys employed?
How much of the paycuts that are coming for fleet service are you gonna be willing to take? I was talking today to some ex-fleet service people, who are now AMT's. They told me one of the reasons they got out of fleet service is that one of these days soon, fleet service will be outsourced entirely to contractors ,or they said the only way AA would keep it own fleet service people is if the TWU agrees to pay you guys only minimum wage and all part time. Are you fleet people going to be willing to strike when the ax falls?
AMFA's situation at UAL is like being handed control of the Titanic after it hit the iceberg. AMFA is trying the best they can. The UAL AMFA membership had a choice accept the contract or strike. Unlike here at AA our choice was accept the contract or Jim Little will ratify it anyway. At least AMFA threatened a strike and even voted No on the first TA. When was the last time the TWU even hinted at strike at AA. Actually, us AMFA supporters were informed last month by UAL AMFA reps about the situation at UAL and what could possibly happen. So today's news isn't entirely shocking.
How much of the paycuts that are coming for fleet service are you gonna be willing to take? I was talking today to some ex-fleet service people, who are now AMT's. They told me one of the reasons they got out of fleet service is that one of these days soon, fleet service will be outsourced entirely to contractors ,or they said the only way AA would keep it own fleet service people is if the TWU agrees to pay you guys only minimum wage and all part time. Are you fleet people going to be willing to strike when the ax falls?
AMFA's situation at UAL is like being handed control of the Titanic after it hit the iceberg. AMFA is trying the best they can. The UAL AMFA membership had a choice accept the contract or strike. Unlike here at AA our choice was accept the contract or Jim Little will ratify it anyway. At least AMFA threatened a strike and even voted No on the first TA. When was the last time the TWU even hinted at strike at AA. Actually, us AMFA supporters were informed last month by UAL AMFA reps about the situation at UAL and what could possibly happen. So today's news isn't entirely shocking.
Checking it Out
Veteran
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2003
- Messages
- 1,702
- Reaction score
- 0
AMFA-United Airlines Tentative Agreement
Referendum Results
The votes for the AMFA – United Airlines Tentative Agreement (T/A) were tallied
on May 31, 2005. TrueBallot Inc. conducted the vote and tally by use of the
TeleVote® and WebVote® systems.
The results are as follows:
Total Eligible Voters 5662
Total Votes Cast 4568 (80.68%)
T/A – Accept 2701 (59.13%)
T/A – Reject 1867 (40.87%)
Steven A. Nowak May 31, 2005
National Secretary
Just for your information: Amfa represented 8439 members a year ago and has lost 10 members per day at United and is scheduled to drop another 3 classifications (appox. 700-1000 after this concessionary agreement). So please tell us again how much better they are? :down:
Referendum Results
The votes for the AMFA – United Airlines Tentative Agreement (T/A) were tallied
on May 31, 2005. TrueBallot Inc. conducted the vote and tally by use of the
TeleVote® and WebVote® systems.
The results are as follows:
Total Eligible Voters 5662
Total Votes Cast 4568 (80.68%)
T/A – Accept 2701 (59.13%)
T/A – Reject 1867 (40.87%)
Steven A. Nowak May 31, 2005
National Secretary
Just for your information: Amfa represented 8439 members a year ago and has lost 10 members per day at United and is scheduled to drop another 3 classifications (appox. 700-1000 after this concessionary agreement). So please tell us again how much better they are? :down:
Maybe AMFA should concentrate more on being a protector of deferred compensation (pensions and other retirement benefits, ESOPs, etc.) and jobs instead of just being a promoter (advertiser). It appears to me that AMFA lacks any ability to devise a strategy to do this given the fact that they state "were better off in bankruptcy". Going into bankruptcy allowed UA to take compensation earned in the past. So in effect the people at UA took a retroactive paycut. I don't remember ALPA, AFA, or the IAM telling their members at UA that they will be better off in bankrutpcy. At AA, there is an effort to keep what we earned (our pensions) by allowing extra time for funding. If you think losing a pension is a good thing, there is a website where you can read the testimony of many UA people directed at elected officials. When you think about it, maybe AMFA is right when they say "were better off in bankruptcy". AMFA is better off in bankruptcy because they can just absolve themselves of any responsibility by blaming the judge for the massacre while collecting dues. Ever heard of the song "Money for nothing"?Birdman said:
Hackman
Veteran
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2003
- Messages
- 3,997
- Reaction score
- 892
Dear Mr. Fleet Service Clerk, don't you think we also know many AMT's at UAL? We know what happened with the iam and the "No Concessions" rally at SFO and around the country on May 8, 2002. We know that on April 11, 2003 the iam and UAL agreed to the horriffic "Restructuring Agreement" that let UAL outsource any/all its maintenance, this T/A also doomed both IMC and OAK Maintenance Bases to close permanently. The agreement was ratified at UAL on May 1, 2003 with the iam in power. GOT IT??? AMFA did not get on the UAL property until July 15, 2003 So stop with your moronic twu mantra that AMFA agreed to these fatal sellout agreements. We know who it was. All AMFA is guilty off is inheriting and attemping to enforce a "scorched earth" concessionary contract at UAL, left for them when the iam got the boot.aafsc said:
Now we will turn your blind twu eyes to the twu. All these airlines have been licking their chops to stick their employees with the type of concessions the twu gave away YEARS ago!!!! For gods sake are you dense!!! B-scale, Flex Benifits, No paid lunch, Pre-funding, De-ice, Pushbacks, SRP/OSM scam.....these are just some of the concessions the twu gave away YEARS ago that are just now being implemented at other carriers today (except the SRP/OSM scam, AA still holds that beauty all alone). Then you take our current abortion of a sellout concessionary contract..... I won't even go there. You and your twu buddies can go take a hike. You have nothing to be proud of, and you've got nothing to say. Your sellout union the twu included with the iam have brought this industry to its knees by their continued 23+ years of sellouts. SO SHUT UP....... before you look more like a "baggage transfer engineer" flunkie then you all ready do. The industrial unions started this mess, and documented facts don't lie. Go back to the AA ramp, and leave the mechanics at UAL alone.
