Anyone Iam M&r.....

[mweiss]

Let me explain this to you again.

...

The IAM in the hearings gave all relevent items that would lead you to believe the company was negotiating in bad faith ie. how long it took for information to be given and the company not responding to offers made on paper.

Funny you use the word "again." This is the first time that you detailed the specific time the IAM claimed bad faith.

If the hearings are over and the Judge went on vacation and said he would rule 1/6/05 and there were no more hearings and all the evidence was presented at the end of November how was the offer to be submitted into evidence as the hearings were concluded and the judge said no more hearings on the matter?

Was the IAM not present when the ruling was issued? Was it issued outside the courtroom?

And the company could have asked for more time

Yeah. They could have also claimed that they were negotiating in bad faith. But why should they do your job for you?

Like I have said numerous times, there was no way to reach an agreement that would eliminate 50% of the workforce.

Of course. So you came up with an alternative that kept 67% of the workforce and saved the amount that the company was asking for, but you came up with it at the 11th hour.

he has to protect the creditors and ensure they get paid.

Yes. This is why the 11th hour proposal was roughly as useful as no proposal. Too late.

I truly believe there was no way to reach a T/A

[post="246968"][/post]​

You're probably right. But you would have been in a much better place if you had your 1/5 proposal done at least a month earlier. But you couldn't, because the company was withholding information, which is why the plan of attack had to be a charge of bad faith. It needed to be reiterated when the judge returned from his vacation. Was it?

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

The offer is still available for IAM members to see it, it is not a document for anyone else as it does not concern them.

I don't see the IAM asking you to post your paycheck, IRS tax records, Mortgage or any other information on the internet for people who it does not concern.

And setting up a password protected site is very encumbered and how do you verify everyone is who they say they are and how you do you stop the information going to people who should not have it?

[post="246965"][/post]​

Why isn't it a document for everyone else to see? What makes it so different from every other item that was released from the process? (like the items that IAM proposed before that was supposed to have saved the company money and the items from the company proposals)

What the heck is a password for? Doesn't USAirways request a password for the Hub? How about for yor 401k? Are yoiu saying that isn't safe?

 

[ALCARLOS]

This can be debated for ever..... however, if the document is not openly seen, it did not exist. It may take some more time than others to come to this realization. We need to be gentlle with them, they will come around in time.

 

[700UW]

Funny, I have a copy, several other posters have seen it and I have posted only about 10 times on how it can been viewed.

I guess I can lead the horse to water but can't make them drink.

 

[SpinDoc]

Funny, I have a copy, several other posters have seen it and I have posted only about 10 times on how it can been viewed.

I guess I can lead the horse to water but can't make them drink.

[post="247091"][/post]​

700UW:

For the last time, WHAT IS SO freakin' secret
in this proposal that you, or anyone else can't
post the details? Nobody is asking you to post
the de facto document, only the points that
YOu CLAIM were relevant. You have spent
a great deal of time and energy repeating the
same tired old crap about asking IAM officials
to view the document.

You accuse US management of hiding important
facts and information all of the time, and yet,
you are doing the same thing. That makes you
no better than them and also makes you appear
to be less than respectable. Okay, never mind,
you have never been respectable, but that is
something for another thread at another time.

The majority of the people asking to see
the details are NOT IAM members, and
therefore, they don't have an IAM representative
to ask to see the proposal. So, why not share
the details and prove your case? Are you
really that embarrassed by the proposal that
you can't make it public? Something smells
and it is the IAM and people like you who
don't have the integrity to be above board with
your ridiculous allegations that this proposal
actually exists.

Enough said about this. You have to earn
credibility by proving your allegations with
facts. Until you do that, you are a non-entity
on these forums.

 

[700UW]

It is only available for IAM members and the District Leadership made the decision.

It was at every single ratification vote.

And NON-IAM members are not entitled to the offer.

If you are an IAM member contact your representative and you will be allowed to view it.

Note to the moderators: This thread is going no where.

 

[SpinDoc]

With people like you as members, it is
no wonder the IAM is in decline. DELETED

It is MORE THAN obvious that the IAM
proposal was less than what you are
representing it to be, and that's fine
if you and the district want to have
a negative public image. Good luck to
you and your ever smaller union.





Mod note: avoid personal insults.

 

[700UW]

Does the IAM ask you a non-member to post your paycheck, income tax or mortgage?

It was made available to EVERY SINGLE IAM Member at EVERY Ratification vote, is that hard to comprehend?

If any IAM member wants to see it they can contact their representative and get to view it.

What all you non-IAM, NON-Mechanic and Related employees fail to grasp is that you are NOT entitled to view a document that is none of your concern.

And your lame attempt at an insult will not change how things are.

The District President made the decision and if you don't like it, well to darn bad.

 

[SpinDoc]

700UW:

Oh, and by the way Mr. IAM. I forgot
to mention it, but it is very important.

THE IAM LOST. THE COMPANY WON.

Don't forget that, because now your
union buddies have to submit to the
company terms for the next several
years. I hate it for the IAM members,
but you brought it on yourselves with
the wonderful phrase "The Concession
Stand Is Closed".

I know you won't forget it because you
were the most vocal of all in the
war of the words. Good luck to you.
I hope you find a good career that
takes you away from these forums.

 

[700UW]

Sorry I hate to burst your bubble, but I am not leaving US Airways, I still have a job.

And your callous attitude and taking joy that people are losing thier jobs, healthcare and retirement speaks loads about what kind of person you truly are.

Just remember the word Karma.

And there is no winners in this scenario.

 

[SpinDoc]

Sorry I hate to burst your bubble, but I am not leaving US Airways, I still have a job.

And your callous attitude and taking joy that people are losing losing thier jobs, healthcare and retirement speaks loads about what kind of person you truly are.

Just remember the word Karma.

And there is no winners in this scenario.

[post="247114"][/post]​

Since when did I ever express joy at the
fact that IAM members are being laid off?

It sucks, but it is the reality of the current
airline economic environment. That is
what the IAM refused to acknowledge and
recognize when the company first asked
for concessions, and in the process, they
brought on the current situation most of
the IAM members are in.

You can try to deflect the blame, but it
rests on the IAM.

 

[planejane]

So I hear the new paychecks are out. Morale is really sinking big time for the mechanics and who can blame them.

 

[AP Tech]

"They will realize a substantial increase of pay up from the 21% court imposed paycut." I remember reading this from the company highlight sheet. Funny as I have just received my weekly check and it is in fact less than the previous week when we were under the 21% court imposed cut? :down: I guess we are still confused....... :huh:

We are now proud to be among the lowest paid and have the worst work rules in the industry...so much for the "Fighting Machinists"

 

[Bob Owens]

Sorry I hate to burst your bubble, but I am not leaving US Airways, I still have a job.

And your callous attitude and taking joy that people are losing thier jobs, healthcare and retirement speaks loads about what kind of person you truly are.

Just remember the word Karma.

And there is no winners in this scenario.

[post="247114"][/post]​

Sure there are.

The people who get to fly cheap win.

The fuel companies who double the price of fuel, who dont have to worry about about repercussions because the airlines simply rape their workers instead, win.

GE and all the others lessors win, because they can still collect huge fees for their property.

The airports win as they still collect landing fees and rents.

The Hotels and resorts win because the money that would have been spent on airfare can now be spent at their facilities.

The Banks win because our concessions underwrite their risks, they sit back and collect the proceeds.

The politicians win because people can afford to go places cheaply.

The unions win because they get to collect dues but do not have to do much for them.

The airlines win because they lock in cheap labor rates.

As a matter of fact every one except airline workers are doing better!

And this will continue until we shut it all down. When they dont sell the fuel, collect the rents fees, dues, lease payments etc etc then they will get around to fixing this broken industry, but until that happens things will not get better because no one else has a problem with things going the way they are, just airline workers, and hell if our own unions pretty much say we are overpaid why would anyone else argue it?

 

[N628AU]

Apparently you have never been in the negotiation process, it does not happen overnight, it took two months of talking and exchanging information to reach the point to give the company that total offer.

[post="246958"][/post]​

Not to mention the months spent saying the "Concession Stand is Closed", when everyone knew the IAM just decided to wait at the end of the line for their concessions everyone knew were inevitable. Maybe if they had jumped to the head of the line and showed some leadership instead? They could have either showed leadership, or been true to their so called principles and put it into the judges hands. Since they knew the judge was almost guaranteed to rule for the company, maybe showing some leadership would have been a more prudent course of action. Instead, they were not only weak and spineless, they became followers and got what was left.