Fleet Service apathy

[Jester]

I want the people who have been involved for years with knowledge and experience and a proven track record.

And this is what I wanted 4 years ago with the New Direction team and I did not see much worth voting for then... I'll say it again, "You can have the most likable, well-intentioned guy in the world, but that doesn't mean he knows what he is doing." I must give credit to Tim where it is due... he has worked the trenches of organizing, fought for co-workers in disputes, has the education to know when he needs to find professionals, and has been willing to expose many of the issues of the IAM, especially with these less-than-open LOAs.

It is a simple Presidential campaign question, "Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?" We still have a large back-log of greviances, a punitive attendance policy still in force and effect, shrinking future pension benefit, lost IAM elections at Delta, and a premature contracting of stations. What have been the positives under a Delaney leadership? I'll wait for an answer. (Maybe even someone from the New Direction team could come to this forum and provide a response... might someone page Mr. Delaney?)

So Invokes Jester.

 

[ograc]

Tim,

You make sense in some ways and I commend you for wanting the best for our membership. The problem I have is that the Canale team probably had some good people, the ND may have good people, Occupy may have good people and the other tickets may have good people. This it's got to be my ticket is going to cause pain for our membership. Let's try a novel concept here in DL 141 for a change and elect the best people for the various positions. It isn't hard to figure out who some of the good people are because they are continually involved in leadership positions. The people who haven't been involved are not right for our Union. Somebody make a list of the various leaders across our system and how long they've been involved, how many elections they've won etc. This includes UA, CO and US. I don't want the yes Tim, Delaney, or other ticket leaders (what I really mean is I want the big money) people. I want the people who have been involved for years with knowledge and experience and a proven track record.

saywhat,
Your novel concept is what the members should truly practice. Once the tickets have been officially announced we need to research the candidates on an individual basis. Let's consider years of involvement, knowledge, track records and leadership positions held as they pertain to the position they are running for. If you're considering the AGC positions for instance, years of involvement in Shop or Grievance Committees should be paramount. We must do thorough research though. For some of the candidate's resumes, on the New Direction Team, were vastly overinflated and exaggerated. Believe me, I have first hand knowledge of this.

 

[ograc]

And this is what I wanted 4 years ago with the New Direction team and I did not see much worth voting for then... I'll say it again, "You can have the most likable, well-intentioned guy in the world, but that doesn't mean he knows what he is doing." I must give credit to Tim where it is due... he has worked the trenches of organizing, fought for co-workers in disputes, has the education to know when he needs to find professionals, and has been willing to expose many of the issues of the IAM, especially with these less-than-open LOAs.
It is a simple Presidential campaign question, "Are you better off now than you were 4 years ago?" We still have a large back-log of greviances, a punitive attendance policy still in force and effect, shrinking future pension benefit, lost IAM elections at Delta, and a premature contracting of stations. What have been the positives under a Delaney leadership? I'll wait for an answer. (Maybe even someone from the New Direction team could come to this forum and provide a response... might someone page Mr. Delaney?)

So Invokes Jester.

Tim has been involved for years. I believe he is an effective and aggresive organizor. I believe The Int'l, the District and the membership took a step backwards with the mutual seperation. There are, however, many out there who have dedicated much of their time and effort for the union and the betterment of their fellow members. Members who have worked behind the scenes for as many, if not more years, than Tim. Up to this point, with the exception of the upcoming election, they have never been asked to run for District office on any ticket. Going forward a concern I have is the current New Direction Team was put together, with Tim's input and strong endorsement.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim has been involved for years. I believe he is an effective and aggresive organizor. I believe The Int'l, the District and the membership took a step backwards with the mutual seperation. There are, however, many out there who have dedicated much of their time and effort for the union and the betterment of their fellow members. Members who have worked behind the scenes for as many, if not more years, than Tim. Up to this point, with the exception of the upcoming election, they have never been asked to run for District office on any ticket. Going forward a concern I have is the current New Direction Team was put together, with Tim's input and strong endorsement.

Definately endorsed the New Direction and supported them. The previous regime, all of them, supported contracting out cargo at UA, pay seniority at US AIRWAYS, class 2 station pay at US AIRWAYS, no scope for United Reservations, part timers making half of full timers at Hawaiian, and presented no solid argument as to why the beatings should continue. It made absolutely no sense to keep them so I am not apologizing for supporting their eventual departure.

But, if we have learned anything, we have learned that it's more than just switching out names, you gotta switch out the non intelligent, non academic cave man mentality that somehow makes all the AGC's think that they are now experts just because they go to a 2 week AGC training seminar at the First Church of IAM kool aid. Simply put, all of them are way over their head. And I don't exclude myself from that or Delaney. Presently, there are only two Presidential candidates with any experience whatsoever in a District Leadership position that has/had authority over a department, myself and Rich. The success of each candidate while in that capacity should mean something. The only other candidate that I'm aware of that is running for President was only an assistant and never had charge of a District Department The president of the district isn't the one who files grievances and isn't the one who fights the arbitration, He/she is charged with Leadership head coaching skills and giving the AGC's the necessary resources to fight the grievances/arbitrations. Obviously, it makes no sense to go 'back to the future' with someone who already proved insignificant. But not only experience but vision and energy and passion is needed in the presidents election. The Occupy 141 ticket recognizes professionals as additional support for our AGC's and President. And only the Occupy 141 platform has the vision that abolishes much of what we know with the structure of this District. No other ticket supports the transparencies and radicalness that is needed to finally empower the masses.

So far all I have heard from the other tickets is "Don't vote for Tim Nelson, he works for ********" Or "I filed alot of grievances and won and lost arbitration cases so you shold vote for me", and of course the usual, "Delaney sucks so vote for me". It's best for voters to actually focus on what the actual leader did while on your dime. That will cut out many based on the bad experience. Remember, when evaluating experience, there is good experience and bad experience in these capacities.

regards,

 

[ograc]

Definately endorsed the New Direction and supported them. The previous regime, all of them, supported contracting out cargo at UA, pay seniority at US AIRWAYS, class 2 station pay at US AIRWAYS, no scope for United Reservations, part timers making half of full timers at Hawaiian, and presented no solid argument as to why the beatings should continue. It made absolutely no sense to keep them so I am not apologizing for supporting their eventual departure.

But, if we have learned anything, we have learned that it's more than just switching out names, you gotta switch out the non intelligent, non academic cave man mentality that somehow makes all the AGC's think that they are now experts just because they go to a 2 week AGC training seminar at the First Church of IAM kool aid. Simply put, all of them are way over their head. And I don't exclude myself from that or Delaney. Presently, there are only two Presidential candidates with any experience whatsoever in a District Leadership position that has/had authority over a department, myself and Rich. The success of each candidate while in that capacity should mean something. The only other candidate that I'm aware of that is running for President was only an assistant and never had charge of a District Department The president of the district isn't the one who files grievances and isn't the one who fights the arbitration, He/she is charged with Leadership head coaching skills and giving the AGC's the necessary resources to fight the grievances/arbitrations. Obviously, it makes no sense to go 'back to the future' with someone who already proved insignificant. But not only experience but vision and energy and passion is needed in the presidents election. The Occupy 141 ticket recognizes professionals as additional support for our AGC's and President. And only the Occupy 141 platform has the vision that abolishes much of what we know with the structure of this District. No other ticket supports the transparencies and radicalness that is needed to finally empower the masses.

So far all I have heard from the other tickets is "Don't vote for Tim Nelson, he works for ********" Or "I filed alot of grievances and won and lost arbitration cases so you shold vote for me", and of course the usual, "Delaney sucks so vote for me". It's best for voters to actually focus on what the actual leader did while on your dime. That will cut out many based on the bad experience. Remember, when evaluating experience, there is good experience and bad experience in these capacities.

regards,

Good track records vs. bad should definately be duly noted when considering candidates for leadership positions. The officers who have ineffective track records should be removed and replaced with candidates who are capable and willing to do a better job serving the membership. Additionally, I do not buy into broad brush changes across the board. This is an injustice to experienced officers who have effectively served the membership. This election is not just about the position of President but many other officer positions. We must be open to electing who we, as a membership, believe will make the best team. It may involve crossing designated tickets (slates).

 

[saywhat]

Good track records vs. bad should definately be duly noted when considering candidates for leadership positions. The officers who have ineffective track records should be removed and replaced with candidates who are capable and willing to do a better job serving the membership. Additionally, I do not buy into broad brush changes across the board. This is an injustice to experienced officers who have effectively served the membership. This election is not just about the position of President but many other officer positions. We must be open to electing who we, as a membership, believe will make the best team. It may involve crossing designated tickets (slates).

ograc,

I totally agree with you. If you are or were an effective leader and are interested in helping the membership I would want you. Experience and dedication to the membership is paramount to the successful rehabilitation of the DL 141 machine.

 

[charlie Brown]

Good track records vs. bad should definately be duly noted when considering candidates for leadership positions. The officers who have ineffective track records should be removed and replaced with candidates who are capable and willing to do a better job serving the membership. Additionally, I do not buy into broad brush changes across the board. This is an injustice to experienced officers who have effectively served the membership. This election is not just about the position of President but many other officer positions. We must be open to electing who we, as a membership, believe will make the best team. It may involve crossing designated tickets (slates).

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

 

[psa8979]

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

 

[psa8979]

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

 

[psa8979]

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

 

[psa8979]

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

 

[psa8979]

Agree with you Charlie Brown 100% . Because so many LCC members have the apathy towards the IAM. Elections become a popularity contest . Major problem with a democratic Union like IAM . WE need the best and smartest representing US. Other wise these elections become PROTEST VOTES. United WE stand DIVIDED will get screwed AGAIN !

 

[charlie Brown]

Agree with you Charlie Brown 100% . Because so many LCC members have the apathy towards the IAM. Elections become a popularity contest . Major problem with a democratic Union like IAM . WE need the best and smartest representing US. Other wise these elections become PROTEST VOTES. United WE stand DIVIDED will get screwed AGAIN !

The democratic process is a good thing as long as its done correctly. IM telling you, someone could put a real ticket together, with the best people in place, that has proven their work through their actions, and kick ass. Lets face facts people. Right now, everyone is voting for a few people they know, and the rest they are just guessing on. Even the people running for president, dosent know the real work ethic of some of the people they are asking to run on their ticket. However those people can get the vote out, so thats why they are on the ticket. I dont want to name names on here, but people need to wake up, and ask for credentials!!!! If someone is running for AGC, shouldnt that person at the very least, have a record on how they have done at step 2 or step 3 hearings. If they dont have a record of how they have done, and they say they are running for the membership, and they have the memberships best interest at heart, I have to call bull_ _ _ _ on that. They are in it for the paycheck, just like the people they want to criticize. I dont care if its 100k a year, or 85k a year, you have certain people that want that position. They will do whatever it takes to get that position. Until we come together, and work together, and quit thinking its only going to work if " I have that top position" we will never get there. It dosent matter who types the best campaign slogan on here, or who says the best stuff. Its only talk!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ograc]

ograc,

I totally agree with you. If you are or were an effective leader and are interested in helping the membership I would want you. Experience and dedication to the membership is paramount to the successful rehabilitation of the DL 141 machine.

saywhat,
I am a member who has been loyally involved, under many different leadership teams, throughout most of my 30 + year career at US. I was actively involved with the organizing efforts at US dating back to the early 90s. I have served as shop steward, Grievance Committee and Grievance Committee Chairperson in PIT. I have served as Grievance Committee Chairperson in my current station for three terms (12 years). I have dedicated most of my career toward advancing the interests of the members I serve within my capacity. In the best interest of the members I serve, I have tried to steer clear of the politics within the IAM, and have strived to work with any and all of the elected leadership teams I have worked under. I am one who has faithfully served in the background. I am one who has been asked to run for office in this election.

 

[ograc]

Ograc,
I dont know who you are, but I agree 100% with your post. While it is good that the IAM is a democratic union, and thus, the members get to vote who runs the show. The negative part of that, is you have way to much pride in the way, and nobody will put the best people in place because they didnt support them during election time, or in the last election.There was a couple of very good people on the Canale ticket, and there are some very good people on the ND ticket, and Im sure that Tim has a few good people on his ticket, the problem is that everyone wants to put people in place that can pull votes, and not necessarily the best people. Some people on every ticket, is in it just for the paycheck. I am a big believer on judging people on their actions, and not what they say. Another problem, is most of the members will not take the time to check and see what kind of experience people have. They will just vote what their buddies tell them to vote. Most of our members like to be spoon fed, not trying to put anyone down, just stating my opinion. Until we check our egoes at the door, and all come together and realize who the real enemy is, and put the best people in place, we will never be where we need to be as a Union.

charlie Brown,

You will soon learn more about me. I am one who has remained actively involved, regardless of the leadership team in place, to advance the best interests of the membership. I have served for many years in various capacities. I have remained in the background, support team if you will, for all of those years. I agree candidates should be judged on their actions and not what they say, promise or propose as over inflated qualifications on a resume. I agree there are qualified candidates on every ticket (slate) going into this election. Likewise, there were qualified, experienced and dedicated officers voted out of office when we were persuaded to vote out the Canale ticket (slate). We must focus on putting the best people in place, even if it means crossing tickets (slates) to do so. Egos must be checked at the door, which will be difficult for some, and we need to focus on who the real opponent is in this game. It is certainly not our union, our district or elected officers. Do we need to make some in house changes and improvements? Yes. Let's discreetly get it done without sacrificing what little solidarity we have.