Grassroots Efforts at DL for ACS and FAs, no personal attacks.
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WorldTraveler
Corn Field
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DL FAs aren't voting for me. they are voting on the IAM.
When they have people like you who spout inaccurate statements and refuse to back them up, they can clearly see how bankrupt your answers are.
and the APFA and APA DID NOT get just DL plus 7%.
The APA negotiated far better raises than what the APA got.
and if the APFA was really that great, they should have been able to get what the APFA negotiated.
and if you want to use the argument that pilots and FAs get different levels of pay rates, then the rest of what you have posted about DL FAs vs. pilots is not accurate.
as usual, you are caught in fraudulent statements. AKA lies.
When they have people like you who spout inaccurate statements and refuse to back them up, they can clearly see how bankrupt your answers are.
and the APFA and APA DID NOT get just DL plus 7%.
The APA negotiated far better raises than what the APA got.
and if the APFA was really that great, they should have been able to get what the APFA negotiated.
and if you want to use the argument that pilots and FAs get different levels of pay rates, then the rest of what you have posted about DL FAs vs. pilots is not accurate.
as usual, you are caught in fraudulent statements. AKA lies.
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Corn Field
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so, you were full of BS all along that FAs and other DL non-contract employees could have done anything differently from the pilots.
The AA FAs only did as well as the DL FAs in percentage increases.... but they didn't even do as well as what DL FAs did when profit sharing is included.
see, DL FAs, not the APFA set the standard for compensation increases.
and the statement about industry leading is a lie... since DL FAs rec'd/will receive 16.% in profit sharing and APFA only managed to come up with 7%.
The AA FAs only did as well as the DL FAs in percentage increases.... but they didn't even do as well as what DL FAs did when profit sharing is included.
see, DL FAs, not the APFA set the standard for compensation increases.
and the statement about industry leading is a lie... since DL FAs rec'd/will receive 16.% in profit sharing and APFA only managed to come up with 7%.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
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they are available on the same DOT sourced sites that I have shown to you before.topDawg said:
but once again, DL FAs have been told that the APFA negotiated industry leading compensation agreements.
where is the proof that is true from the union advocates who made that claim.
even by the same average compensation claims that 700 posted, that isn't true.
it is precisely that kind of lying that DL FAs have to watch very closely.
their livelihood depends on what they do with unions that claim they have delivered something which they clearly have not.
Another:
It was just like yesterday when I was on a layover as a NWA Flight Attendant when a note from the company was slipped under my door from the hotel. Wow. We are merging with Delta! I never seriously considered anything like that would happen in my career. So much went through my mind including union representation. Let’s face it, it’s all I knew. Coupled with the fact I’m a born and raised Minnesotan from a very “blue state.” I mean Minnesota was the only state to go to Mondale in the 1984 presidential elections for goodness sake.
Anyway, I needed to know more about this Delta and how in the heck did they operate without a union? It was such a foreign concept to me. So what did I do? I found out. Over the next few years – I literally went and found out. And I came out the other end with a new view on companies and how they should treat employees. I voted no in the last election to really “find out.” Long behold, it happened. The union was gone. Since May 2012 when pre-merger NWA FA’s went under Delta work rules, my pay, quality of life, and most importantly – my happiness improved beyond measure.
Fast forward to this moment. Watching the vote come again, and watching those videos. Oh my goodness, watching those IAM video testimonials from my colleagues on how bad it is at Delta – I’m just at a loss. A complete loss. Their memory of NWA as it relates to Delta is something I can’t wrap my head around as my memory is completely different. For example, I flew up to 14 + duty days and had 8-9 hours of rest at NWA. Why? Because that’s what the contract said. To suggest that we didn’t have that is simply not true.
To fully understand what it is to be Delta without a union, one would have to experience it. Being pro-union in the past (for real, I always read that contract – like all the time), I would have never come to my understandings now without Delta. I found out it’s possible to work for a company as a Flight Attendant without a third party. I owe a more positive worldview, improved pay, and a better work-life balance to Delta. To watch the division happening now within our work group reminds me of what it was like every single day at NWA – and I don’t want to go back. Ever. My hope is my shared journey here will help that.
- Nick Eckstrom
It was just like yesterday when I was on a layover as a NWA Flight Attendant when a note from the company was slipped under my door from the hotel. Wow. We are merging with Delta! I never seriously considered anything like that would happen in my career. So much went through my mind including union representation. Let’s face it, it’s all I knew. Coupled with the fact I’m a born and raised Minnesotan from a very “blue state.” I mean Minnesota was the only state to go to Mondale in the 1984 presidential elections for goodness sake.
Anyway, I needed to know more about this Delta and how in the heck did they operate without a union? It was such a foreign concept to me. So what did I do? I found out. Over the next few years – I literally went and found out. And I came out the other end with a new view on companies and how they should treat employees. I voted no in the last election to really “find out.” Long behold, it happened. The union was gone. Since May 2012 when pre-merger NWA FA’s went under Delta work rules, my pay, quality of life, and most importantly – my happiness improved beyond measure.
Fast forward to this moment. Watching the vote come again, and watching those videos. Oh my goodness, watching those IAM video testimonials from my colleagues on how bad it is at Delta – I’m just at a loss. A complete loss. Their memory of NWA as it relates to Delta is something I can’t wrap my head around as my memory is completely different. For example, I flew up to 14 + duty days and had 8-9 hours of rest at NWA. Why? Because that’s what the contract said. To suggest that we didn’t have that is simply not true.
To fully understand what it is to be Delta without a union, one would have to experience it. Being pro-union in the past (for real, I always read that contract – like all the time), I would have never come to my understandings now without Delta. I found out it’s possible to work for a company as a Flight Attendant without a third party. I owe a more positive worldview, improved pay, and a better work-life balance to Delta. To watch the division happening now within our work group reminds me of what it was like every single day at NWA – and I don’t want to go back. Ever. My hope is my shared journey here will help that.
- Nick Eckstrom
Kev3188
Veteran
Nick & I must've worked for 2 different NW's... much more divded now...
IAM Justice: A Kangaroo Court
Picture yourself arriving at the front door of a new restaurant in town. As you reach for the door handle, you notice a sign that says:
CUSTOMERS ARE NOT PERMITTED TO POST NEGATIVE YELP REVIEWS. ANYONE FOUND POSTING A NEGATIVE YELP REVIEW WILL BE SUBJECT TO A RESTAURANT TRIAL. IF FOUND GUILTY OF RESTAURANT CRIME IN THE COURT OF RESTAURANT LAW, YOU WILL BE SUBJECT TO A RESTAURANT FINE.
Apparently, this restaurant is so fearful of criticism that they try to intimidate anyone who might give them a negative review. You might ask yourself, "Is the food here so bad that they can't tolerate honest reviews? Should I eat here?"
This may come as a surprise to some, but the IAM is very much like this hypothetical restaurant. Article L, Section 3 of the IAM Constitution describes "Improper Conduct of a Member," which includes:
So what happens to an IAM member who is "charged" with violating Article L, Section 3? That's when Article L, Sections 4-16 come into play. These sections define the elaborate trial system of the IAM, a process that amounts to no more than a kangaroo court run by IAM cronies. Here are some of the highlights from these sections:
These are not outdated, rarely used sections of the IAM Constitution. Here are examples of cases that involved IAM trials:
Machinist Union Hit with Multiple Federal Charges for Retaliating Against Employees Who Inquired about their Rights
... union officials ordered Bedenik and Slatten to attend an IAM union internal kangaroo court held for the purpose of punishing them for inquiring about refraining from full union membership. Instructing the employees to attend the proceedings and only enter through the “rear entrance” of the building, union officials intended to fine and discipline the two for thinking about opposing the union. The employees chose not to show up for their “trial.”
Dozens fight union fines over strike at Joliet Caterpillar plant
In September, union members who crossed the picket line were informed of the local's intent to hold trials regarding their crossing. After the trials, union members voted to assess fines.
Please ask yourself this question: If this is an organization that is truly trying to help us, why must they resort to threats and intimidation to prevent us from speaking out against them?
Picture yourself arriving at the front door of a new restaurant in town. As you reach for the door handle, you notice a sign that says:
CUSTOMERS ARE NOT PERMITTED TO POST NEGATIVE YELP REVIEWS. ANYONE FOUND POSTING A NEGATIVE YELP REVIEW WILL BE SUBJECT TO A RESTAURANT TRIAL. IF FOUND GUILTY OF RESTAURANT CRIME IN THE COURT OF RESTAURANT LAW, YOU WILL BE SUBJECT TO A RESTAURANT FINE.
Apparently, this restaurant is so fearful of criticism that they try to intimidate anyone who might give them a negative review. You might ask yourself, "Is the food here so bad that they can't tolerate honest reviews? Should I eat here?"
This may come as a surprise to some, but the IAM is very much like this hypothetical restaurant. Article L, Section 3 of the IAM Constitution describes "Improper Conduct of a Member," which includes:
- Attempting, inaugurating, or encouraging secession from the I.A.M.
- Advocating or encouraging or attempting to inaugurate any dual labor movement
- Supporting movements or organizations inimical to the interest of the I.A.M. or its established laws and policies
- Accepting employment in any capacity in an establishment where a strike or lockout exists as recognized under this Constitution, without permission
- Any other conduct unbecoming a member of the I.A.M.
So what happens to an IAM member who is "charged" with violating Article L, Section 3? That's when Article L, Sections 4-16 come into play. These sections define the elaborate trial system of the IAM, a process that amounts to no more than a kangaroo court run by IAM cronies. Here are some of the highlights from these sections:
- It is the duty of any member who has information as to conduct of a member covered by Sec. 3 of this Art. to immediately prefer charges in writing against such member by filing the same with the president of the L.L. of which the accused is a member
- In the event that any L.L., or the members thereof, fail to proceed as prescribed herein, then any officer or representative, or member, may file written charges against such member or members with the I.P. Upon the receipt of such charges, the I.P. shall forward 1 copy thereof to the accused and 1 copy to the president of the L.L. of which the accused is a member, together with an order commanding said L.L. to proceed to place the accused on trial under the provisions of this Art
- Both the plaintiff and the defendant shall have the privilege of presenting evidence and being represented either in person or by a member to act as his/her attorney
These are not outdated, rarely used sections of the IAM Constitution. Here are examples of cases that involved IAM trials:
Machinist Union Hit with Multiple Federal Charges for Retaliating Against Employees Who Inquired about their Rights
... union officials ordered Bedenik and Slatten to attend an IAM union internal kangaroo court held for the purpose of punishing them for inquiring about refraining from full union membership. Instructing the employees to attend the proceedings and only enter through the “rear entrance” of the building, union officials intended to fine and discipline the two for thinking about opposing the union. The employees chose not to show up for their “trial.”
Dozens fight union fines over strike at Joliet Caterpillar plant
In September, union members who crossed the picket line were informed of the local's intent to hold trials regarding their crossing. After the trials, union members voted to assess fines.
Please ask yourself this question: If this is an organization that is truly trying to help us, why must they resort to threats and intimidation to prevent us from speaking out against them?
Kev3188
Veteran
CRP isn't a "kangaroo court?"
How 'bout the SAFA's running 360, and their actions?
As for no F/A's on the IAM leadership roster, maybe from EV should've stepped up? Maybe they did & lost? I dunno. What I do know is that there are several over there doing some really great work on behalf of their peers.
How 'bout the SAFA's running 360, and their actions?
As for no F/A's on the IAM leadership roster, maybe from EV should've stepped up? Maybe they did & lost? I dunno. What I do know is that there are several over there doing some really great work on behalf of their peers.
Kev3188
Veteran
PS: when I was an IAM member (and an elected official, for that matter), I spoke out about several things. Nothing ever came of it. I think this is another example of the fear mongering you & I detest...
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