OCT/NOV 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

"Please urge USAPA to..............put the Nicolau Award in Section 22 unaltered..." I'm almost starting to feel sorry for this fellow. Pretty please...just put the nic in anyway...willya' huh?...Puhleeeaze!!??

Said the idiot on LOA 93. LMAO!

 

[Move2CLT]

No, I just called and asked, not there. You wouldn't just post one side would you? Or is that the only side AOL let you see?

Why don't you go to USAPA's website and post it here? You'd think they'd have his reply front and center, right?

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

THE PHRASE THAT PAYS, MARTY"S SECOND PARAGRAPH "In my opinion, " priceless! LMFAO!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Why don't you go to USAPA's website and post it here? You'd think they'd have his reply front and center, right?

I Wouldn't even dignify it or waste time or money on useless nonsense, but hey "IN MY OPINION"!

 

[luvn737s]

I don't see in there where it says that. It says that they must NEGOTIATE. Negotiating is not just saying no, even if they company likes to do that.

You picked the quote. Can't you read? It says the Company need not demand a particular SLI method. So it can choose whatever it wants. And it has already accepted the NIC.

Maybe they can be persuaded after the NIC inclusive JCBA is rejected, but I think a sufficient number of pilots are fed up with USAPA and that is an unlikely outcome.

 

[Pi brat]

You picked the quote. Can't you read? It says the Company need not demand a particular SLI method. So it can choose whatever it wants. And it has already accepted the NIC.

Maybe they can be persuaded after the NIC inclusive JCBA is rejected, but I think a sufficient number of pilots are fed up with USAPA and that is an unlikely outcome.

If that's what you got out of that what can I say?

 

[Pi brat]

Why don't you go to USAPA's website and post it here? You'd think they'd have his reply front and center, right?

Not if they didn't answer.

 

[luvn737s]

"Please urge USAPA to..............put the Nicolau Award in Section 22 unaltered..." I'm almost starting to feel sorry for this fellow. Pretty please...just put the nic in anyway...willya' huh?...Puhleeeaze!!??

If you want to drive your imitation union off a cliff, then step on the gas. Puhleeeaze!!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Gee, and all this time USAPA has said seniority is negotiable just like crew meals...

The West Pilots can still successfully allege claims against USAPA for not fairly representing them.

As a matter a fact, so could I, if I had the money. USAPA is only representing a narrow band of the seniority list at the expense of the rest of the pilots, East and West. The fact that they have been unable to place a contract to vote on in front of the pilot group affirms this. Delay...delay ...delay......

You asked for it, you got it, in spades

Could be said of any group, your view, so could I, the fact there is no contract in front of this group proves "NOTHING" the F/A's voted down 2,! Your needs not being met? PLEEZ!

 

[cleardirect]

The company will come talking as soon as they want to move forward.

ALPA changed its SLI policy for a legitimate union purpose, did they not? If they had used their current SLI policy, rather than their old one they discarded, then we would all still be ALPA dues payers.

I think any reasonable person could find an SLI based on the corrected ALPA policy to be well within the wide range of reasonableness, especially seeing that the ALPA policy was corrected as a result of the previous policy's inability to support union objectives. One could also find that all the other unions on property used DOH, for legitimate union purposes. The risk is exactly where it was predicted to be at Wye River.

The problem being that you want to change the rule AFTER you played the game.

Beside even if we used the new rules. there is nothing that says Nicolau would have used a different method. All it says is the LOS will be considered. Nicolau considered LOS but did not give it the value that you place on your LOS.

As far as wye river. Why is it the east pilots begging to negotiate if all the risk is on our side. Don't you think that if we were worried or thought that we were losing that the west would be knocking on the door to make a deal? Judge Silver told you that all the risk is on usapa's side if you use something other than the Nicolau.

 

[cleardirect]

I don't see in there where it says that. It says that they must NEGOTIATE. Negotiating is not just saying no, even if they company likes to do that.

But the company does not have to negotiate if they think it is illegal or will bring risk.

If the union said we want to fly 12 hours per day does the company have to negotiate if it violates the FAR's or can they say no?

The company is not going to negotiate line bidding. They are going to continue to say no even if usapa wants line bidding.

 

[N924PS]

Could be said of any group, your view, so could I, the fact there is no contract in front of this group proves "NOTHING" the F/A's voted down 2,! Your needs not being met? PLEEZ!

Good point. The FA's have already had 2 T/A's to vote on. How many has USAPA presented?

And you're darn right my needs aren't being met, along with a few thousand of my fellow USAirways pilots.

I make $5/hr less than I made way back in 1989. PBGC is paying me about 29 cents on the dollar of what I would have received under the DC plan. I get 21 days of vacation with 30+ years (F/A's get 31!). 10% 401Kcontribution when most other legacy pilots get 15%.

I have always maintained a decent Nic inclusive T/A would pass, which is exactly why USAPA plays the delay game to the max. They know it too.

 

[cleardirect]

Where is the reply?

That is an excellent question for your open and honest communication committee. why has usapa not posted these letters on the web site? All of the letters were e-mailed tot he west pilots but they are not available to the east pilots even from the PHX domicile update.

Now why would that be? why would James Ray and usapa prevent the east pilots from seeing all of the information?

 

[Pi brat]

But the company does not have to negotiate if they think it is illegal or will bring risk.

If the union said we want to fly 12 hours per day does the company have to negotiate if it violates the FAR's or can they say no?

The company is not going to negotiate line bidding. They are going to continue to say no even if usapa wants line bidding.

Wow, we are on a roll, you're right again. Even Szymanski said that. But they have to negotiate, right? When you disagree over issues you negotiate and see if you can come to an agreement and then if the issue is big enough you go into self-help.

Why don't we wait an see what the company actually does? There are pages and pages of wrong predictions on this board.

 

[Pi brat]

That is an excellent question for your open and honest communication committee. why has usapa not posted these letters on the web site? All of the letters were e-mailed tot he west pilots but they are not available to the east pilots even from the PHX domicile update.

Now why would that be? why would James Ray and usapa prevent the east pilots from seeing all of the information?

Emailed from whom? If they were, they are public info., so post the replies, not just your side's.