Procedure for removing a pax from full flight

[US1YFARE]

OK, first, that reply was to a certain poster's comments that customers only wah wah wah. I understand the gate situation. But there are times that your connecting flight is running late because of US. There are times that when going through security, especially in BOS, where it can take a long time to get through and you get there a little later than anticipated. I have had experiences in BOS where it has taken almost 45 minutes to get through security. Some of these people blame EVERYTHING on the customer. Many assume just because the customer arrived at the gate late it is the CUSTOMER's fault. They need to get a life and stop treating the customer as the enemy.

My reference to the reserves is that a lot of the younger people working for the airline understand the importance of keeping a customer. Customers = jobs. They like their jobs--cripe they wouldn't be there if they didn't. Most of them can barely make their minimum hours and they have to put up with some of these bitter senior mommas who don't think reserves deserve to pick up trips. The good news is that a lot of bitter senior mommas will stop working the A position because of the improvements made to first class service--too much work. Just overheard a senior momma tell a reserve that she was in the back working on her lines while the reserve was working her butt off in a full A321 FC cabin. The reserve doesn't hold a block so she can't do that...it was a mean, thoughtless, and offensive comment for that FA to make. She had a full flight in the back too--get off your butt and do a drink service or help out your fellow employee. But, no, she had the attitude that she has worked too long and too hard over all these years and that her time has come to sit her butt down and relax. Her only questions to the Reserve were (1) where is the leftover cheesecake and (2) where is the snack basket. That is BS. There are lot of people who want to work and those are the people that I want to see on my flights.

Giving good customer service does not equate to being a pawn for the company. Giving good customer service does not equate to being a weak individual. Giving good customer service is part of your job as an airline employee and shows that you have pride in what you do even though you are not given the tools to do that job most of the time. US's FA's are the best in the industry--it's time these bitter people find a new pasture to graze in.

If some of you had read the original poster's post more carefully, you would see that he said that a customer was REMOVED from a flight (the now disembarked son). But, instead, you assumed the customer goofed by not getting to the gate in time and lashed out at the customer.

Paying customers should always get the seat, particularly if the push back of the flight is not going to be delayed. Some of you need to realize that losing $40K a year from one passenger is going to be very difficult to make up--particularly if the pax should be on that plane and a hasty gate agent bumped the paying pax. I'm not saying that you need to concede to all demands, but when it is reasonable you need to respond to a customer's situation.

I take no crap from gate agents. I don't overstep my bounds at the gate or on the plane and I will not tolerate someone being rude to me. There has been some improvement in PHL, but there is still no comparison to the great HP gate agents I have come across in other cities.

Note to PHL gate agents: (1) smile every now and then, it goes a long way; (2) listen to the question that the customer is asking instead of answering a question that you think they are asking; and(3) if you don't like the customers, quit

 

[LCC_#1]

Sorry guys but on this one the customer IS first...even if the non-rev WAS told to board. Yes, it's a pain to take a seat and then be told to get off the a/c, but that's the downside of non-reving. Like mentioned earlier, delays, security....the list goes on and on but the customer boards FIRST..not matter WHAT!! I want fellow employees to make their flights, but sorry, you ARE THE BOTTOM OF THE LIST!! That's the biz.

 

[US1YFARE]

I happen to agree with you but the unfortunate part of the equation is that many who work the front lines have taken the bait from Management that the reason their pay was cut is because customers don't want to pay outrageous last minute fares. So I don't totally fault them

I think it's just a bad idea to get into it with a G/A. Memories are long, especially in PHL. Honestly I've been treated very well in PHL by the staff. They're have been a few rude ones and their names/or gate workied and time of the incident have been sent to what was then Consumer Affairs.

Well, my tickets aren't cheap. If they want to go on that basis, pull up my fare and just see how much I am paying. Under your theory, I should get the best customer service on the plane because I will bet at least 80% of the time, my ticket is in the top 5 most expensive on the plane. And, PB, what you are saying here is inconsistent. You are a big proponent of elites who pay more not being treated differently than those who buy cheap tickets--Isn't that what the whole cockroach thing is about????

I don't care if the GA has the memory of an elephant. I'm not going to take their crap. I buy expensive tickets or FC tickets so I normally don't have to sweat out the upgrade--so, my dependency on the GA is much less than yours.

 

[tadjr]

Well, my tickets aren't cheap. If they want to go on that basis, pull up my fare and just see how much I am paying.

We've been told not to do this, but some agents will. The only exceptions are to be those booked in F when giving out certain amenitites in irregular ops. Otherwise, a ticket is supposed to be a ticket whether its $59 or $659 as far as service goes.

Regarding the initial post. It would appear from the info here (guessing, since the agent/crew in charge arent able to respond) that the gate agent thought that the last person boarded (nonrev) would have been the one without a seat, hence the one who came off the plane. (Nonrevs know to take ANY seat ASAP when told to grab something). The GA didnt verify the name of the customer who came off and/or that they werent the nonrev that should have been pulled. Also since the description of both parties is similar, it sounds like the agent just thought the last one standing was the last nonrev boarded and it wasnt checked.
As far as people getting on "without a boarding pass", its a technical thing. The person would have had a ticket, but the agent would not have taken the time to actually print a boarding pass for them. It could be many reasons why this wasnt done and it not a security/safety issue, just a matter of paperwork. Probably the count was off and instead of looking thru all the tickets to verify who/what wasnt onboard, they just told them to take any seat. It happens quite often at dept on full flights, tickets are sorted after pushback and the computer work done after the door is closed in order to get the plane out on time.

 

[US1YFARE]

I think that is great and I will use that in the future.

Still, PB, and to quote you, not to be a "pain your arse", but how do you reconcile your comment about fare discrimination with the philosophy behind the cockroaches????? I love the idea of discriminating between pax based on fare.

 

[PHX-F/A]

Flyer talk has this thread about a situation in which a rev pax is almost bumped from a full flight because of a non-rev who is in his seat ( the former is removed from the plane & they actually push back before the teen's mom comes running up from the back of the cabin looking for her now disembarked son). The non-rev is taken off and the flight continues with mother and son.

I'm not seeking to criticize anyone here. There was a language barrier issue going on which adds to the confusion of a full flight trying to push back. But clearly something goes wrong here and I'm just curious as to what and how. What is all this non-rev stuff about and how does a non-rev get on the full flight and be told to take any seat he can find? I thought everyone has a boarding pass and tracing a problem begins here. Once again, the source is from Flyer Talk, and not my own personal experience.

Thanks

Barry

Sounds just like a West flight.

 

[US1YFARE]

So, the bottom line is that you are afraid a GA in PHL may read this thread and will screw you out of an upgrade in the future--because you really believe they have absolutely no right to assume, no matter who gave them the information, that everyone is buying a cheap ticket. You do blame them for having that attitude. And no matter what type of customer you are, and no matter how you show your loyalty to the airline (as you have given in your example) no customer deserves to be treated like dirt as is seen many many times in PHL just because that oh so miserable, filthy, whining and paying customer dares to approach the alter of the PHL gate agent.

One of the main problems with some of the senior US people is that whatever job they hold, they think they are the boss of me. Well let me tell you, they are not. And some people will jump in and say, FAA this and FAR that and Procedure this and Manual that, but I am not talking about people who are violating the law or are being totally obnoxious (you know the ones that yell at a FA for crushing their computer in an overhead bin--puleeese--put it under your seat if it is that delicate--I am talking about customers who are simply seeking a service for the money they spend.

 

[Dont call me Shirley]

The subject reminds me of this story:


ARE YOU GAY?

An employee for USAir, who happened to have the last name of GAY, got on a plane recently using one of his company's "Free Flight" programs. However, when Mr. Gay tried to take his seat, he found it being occupied by a paying passenger. So, not to make a fuss, he simply chose another seat.

Unknown to Mr. Gay, another USAir flight at the airport experienced mechanical problems. The passengers of this other flight were being rerouted to various airplanes. A few were put on Mr. Gay's flight and anyone who was holding a "free" ticket was being "bumped".

Airline officials, armed with a list of these "freebee" ticket holders boarded the plane to remove the free ticket holders. Of course, our Mr. Gay was not sitting in his assigned seat as you may remember.

So when the Ticket Agent approached the seat where Mr. Gay was supposed to be sitting, she asked a startled customer "Are you Gay?". The man, shyly nodded that he was, at which point she demanded: "Then you have to get off the plane".

Our Mr. Gay, overhearing what the Ticket Agent had said, tried to clear up the situation: "You've got the wrong man. I'm Gay!". This caused an angry third passenger to yell "Hell, I'm gay too! They can't kick us all off!" Confusion reined as more an more passengers began yelling that USAir had no right to remove gays from their flights.

 

[SCUBAgal]

Sounds just like a West flight.

Niiiiice....I've had this happen to me on West metal, Hawaiian Airlines, American Airlines, Alaska, United and Continental...you're assuming it's only West the gets the coutns off? Try working the gate end of things and you'll understand EXACTLY how we can board 135 people on a plane that holds 134.

As far as the situation that was mentioned...it is hard to say what happened unless we're there. Could have been several different scenarios, all but one or two would have indeed been the fault of the gate staff.

And as far as gate staff goes...is there such a thing as a GOOD story anyone wants to tell about one of us, or are we all supposedly tired worn out hags who deserve nothing except to be thrown out on our collective butts to be replaced with 18-20 year olds who could really care less about YOU the customer as long as you leave an open seat on the plane for the employee to go vacation on? Seriously!!! I am so sick and tired of everyone doing nothing but bash gate staff...there are those of us out there who DO try to do some good for our customers!

 

[Travels2mch]

Not only have I had marshals on-board wearing only slacks and polo shirts, you just described a number of my executive platinum passengers. Drinking the free booze on the airplane isn't considered quite as sophisticated as it once was. For that matter drinking period does not have the cache it once had. Too many people are into the fitness thing these days.

And, lord knows, a PDA doesn't distinguish anyone anymore. I saw a 12 year old the other day who had the latest version of the Treo. How in touch does a 12 year old need to be?

Actually lately I've noticed that the FAM's have a slightly (not too) more casual look.....maybe the summer attire. Everyone at the gate sees them going on early, and the early boarders see them sitting in their aisle seats in FC.

They stand out like a sore thumb!! They should board with everyone else so they maintain discretion and nobody would be able to pick them out.

:down:
:down: :down: :down: No its ALWAYS the airlines fault- fuel prices, weather , 9/11, employees who dont deserve to make a living daily wage. The list goes on and on. Lets remember it ALL ABOUT the passenger, they are NEVER wrong. Saints all of them and airline workers are pond scum! Ah the joys of airline travel- sophisticated, kind, caring, happy passengers. Ahhhh I SO miss flying...NOT!!!!!!!

Good thing that's all been clarified......and we don't miss your kind in the air either!!

Just overheard a senior momma tell a reserve that she was in the back working on her lines while the reserve was working her butt off in a full A321 FC cabin. The reserve doesn't hold a block so she can't do that...it was a mean, thoughtless, and offensive comment for that FA to make.

And senior momma is lucky that you didn't take her name and report her to the airline. I know 2 former FA's that got fired because a customer overheard their petty work related complaining and reported them.

 

[flygirl74]

OK, first, that reply was to a certain poster's comments that customers only wah wah wah. I understand the gate situation. But there are times that your connecting flight is running late because of US. There are times that when going through security, especially in BOS, where it can take a long time to get through and you get there a little later than anticipated. I have had experiences in BOS where it has taken almost 45 minutes to get through security. Some of these people blame EVERYTHING on the customer. Many assume just because the customer arrived at the gate late it is the CUSTOMER's fault. They need to get a life and stop treating the customer as the enemy.

My reference to the reserves is that a lot of the younger people working for the airline understand the importance of keeping a customer. Customers = jobs. They like their jobs--cripe they wouldn't be there if they didn't. Most of them can barely make their minimum hours and they have to put up with some of these bitter senior mommas who don't think reserves deserve to pick up trips. The good news is that a lot of bitter senior mommas will stop working the A position because of the improvements made to first class service--too much work. Just overheard a senior momma tell a reserve that she was in the back working on her lines while the reserve was working her butt off in a full A321 FC cabin. The reserve doesn't hold a block so she can't do that...it was a mean, thoughtless, and offensive comment for that FA to make. She had a full flight in the back too--get off your butt and do a drink service or help out your fellow employee. But, no, she had the attitude that she has worked too long and too hard over all these years and that her time has come to sit her butt down and relax. Her only questions to the Reserve were (1) where is the leftover cheesecake and (2) where is the snack basket. That is BS. There are lot of people who want to work and those are the people that I want to see on my flights.

Giving good customer service does not equate to being a pawn for the company. Giving good customer service does not equate to being a weak individual. Giving good customer service is part of your job as an airline employee and shows that you have pride in what you do even though you are not given the tools to do that job most of the time. US's FA's are the best in the industry--it's time these bitter people find a new pasture to graze in.

If some of you had read the original poster's post more carefully, you would see that he said that a customer was REMOVED from a flight (the now disembarked son). But, instead, you assumed the customer goofed by not getting to the gate in time and lashed out at the customer.

Paying customers should always get the seat, particularly if the push back of the flight is not going to be delayed. Some of you need to realize that losing $40K a year from one passenger is going to be very difficult to make up--particularly if the pax should be on that plane and a hasty gate agent bumped the paying pax. I'm not saying that you need to concede to all demands, but when it is reasonable you need to respond to a customer's situation.

I take no crap from gate agents. I don't overstep my bounds at the gate or on the plane and I will not tolerate someone being rude to me. There has been some improvement in PHL, but there is still no comparison to the great HP gate agents I have come across in other cities.

Note to PHL gate agents: (1) smile every now and then, it goes a long way; (2) listen to the question that the customer is asking instead of answering a question that you think they are asking; and(3) if you don't like the customers, quit

Maybe customers should paste their Dividend Miles card to their shirt. Then we will know who is trailer trash and who's a$$ to worship!!!
There are many "senoir mama's" who are NICE...there are also many reserves(who got furloughed TWICE)that are very nasty. Gotta love stereotypes. :blink:

 

[LD3]

We were non-reving home a while back, a couple got on the airplane and started complaining we were in their seats. GA came aboard, seats were double ticketed, no problem, wide open flight. Paying customers just threw a fit and demanded their seats, GA, whom we knew very well gave them the seats we were in and moved us up front, that really pi$$ed them off....IMO, if the rev pax would have approached the GA with a better attitude, they would have been moved up front.

 

[USCREW]

We were non-reving home a while back, a couple got on the airplane and started complaining we were in their seats. GA came aboard, seats were double ticketed, no problem, wide open flight. Paying customers just threw a fit and demanded their seats, GA, whom we knew very well gave them the seats we were in and moved us up front, that really pi$$ed them off....IMO, if the rev pax would have approached the GA with a better attitude, they would have been moved up front.

I have seen this a few times. It's justice. HaHaHaHaHa

 

[hp_fa]

We were non-reving home a while back, a couple got on the airplane and started complaining we were in their seats. GA came aboard, seats were double ticketed, no problem, wide open flight. Paying customers just threw a fit and demanded their seats, GA, whom we knew very well gave them the seats we were in and moved us up front, that really pi$$ed them off....IMO, if the rev pax would have approached the GA with a better attitude, they would have been moved up front.

IMO you are absolutely correct. Prior to going inflight I was a GA and later a supervisor. I would never reward bad behavior with an upgrade to FC for two reasons. One was to not reward bad behavior. If pax were to see that it would encourage future bad behavior and it would take it's toll on GA's who already had enough problems to deal with. The second reason was that if the misbehaving party was truly upset, they would likely continue to be upset for awhile and I did not want to subject my folks already in FC to one or more disgruntled people with a discretionary upgrade. I would finds someone else to upgrade (rev or non-rev) and that would accomplish the same goals.

As an inflight I always backed the GA when they had a situation such as this for the same reasons. Since I almost always worked FC, I wanted to give my passengers the best ride I could with whatever amenities I had, and peace and quiet was one of them.

 

[wench]

SCUABgAL..
Thumbs to you!

Thanks, and BTW the senior agents are all NOT biatches!

SO get over over it and stop thinking we ARE ALL THE SAME>.

Justice NOT INJUSTICE..

***SCUSE ME, LIKE SOME cheese to go with that whine***?