US IAM Fleet Service topic 15Jul-

[Edward]

I think it is time to start a thread. All US Fleet Service issues go here. Do NOT make it personal or about each other as that will get you time off & your post removed with out comment.

 

[roabilly]

Awlright Bros...

In the previous forum I was pretty much swarmed by West Dudes. Apparently... there are questions regarding the perception of the “Truth†regarding economic expansion in CLT... contract improvements etc.

First... I would like to congratulate you guys for finally showing solidarity even if it was to dispute my posts! Now...if you could only channel that level of enthusiasm and determination toward your position as IAM Fleet Members ,you would be well on your way out of the mindset that you’re currently in.

Since the “Truth†was such an integral part of our arguments... let’s address it! The truth is boys ‘n girls... your very existence is being eroded away by corporate fat-cats that would, and have outsourced our entire middle class economy to the lowest bidders in foreign lands. I’ll submit this statement into this forum as being the single most mitigating factor regarding not only the current US economy (Freedom)... but the Global Economy as well.

Now...just a reminder... we...as Fleet fall into this middle class scenario. Why do you think that you are still working in F/S in this business dynamic? I’ll give yahh a hint... It ain’t cuz yer boy Parker likes yahh! It’s because of contractual protections, albeit some were eroded in BK agreement as we are witnessing now with small station outsourcing.

If you guys continue to perpetuate a submissive, “roll-over†attitude in regards to not only your occupations...but in your lives as well... you will always be victims! Of course ...that’s assuming that you are who you say you are.

Support your UNION! That is all that stands between you, immigrant workers, and the soup kitchen! Your corporate buddies don’t care if you live or die, as long as they continue to make their big bucks, and play golf!

I know this will rile you boys up... so let it FLY! H*** I might even invoke some profound philosophy from Jester!

 

[freedom]

The truth …..

They say the truth will set you free ….. Personally I doubt it , more like the truth will shake you to your very core and leave you hollow inside ..


I won’t disagree with you Roa that we have sold ourselves down the river as a country .. Our nation no longer produces , we consume … our economy is 70% consumer driven … so in essence we’re a society of lay abouts .. Not only that , but we’ve sucked massive amounts of monies out of the rest of the world just to turn around and spend their money to our benefit … but hey , I’m cool with that ….it’s been a great run , and now it’s over ..

If you guys continue to perpetuate a submissive, “roll-over†attitude in regards to not only your occupations...but in your lives as well... you will always be victims! Of course ...that’s assuming that you are who you say you are.

On this subject I couldn’t agree with you more!!!!!! We are responsible for what happens to our future ….and so much depends on our resolve , I believe that the only chance we have of keeping our jobs is if the government nationalizes us , and they won’t do that unless we force their hand … I think I know a way we can do this due to our companies indebtedness and just to whom we owe all that money … but we will save those plans for another day as we get closer to our end ..

As far as the small stations being farmed out , I don’t think it’s because management hates us , but merely the first sign of a dying company …

Apparently... there are questions regarding the perception of the “Truth†regarding economic expansion in CLT... contract improvements etc.

It seems to me you have a Microeconomics view point while ignoring the Macroeconomics
Side of the coin completely … look CLT , contract improvements etc .. they ALL hinge on what happens in the larger economy … in many ways airlines are a good gauge of a nations economic health ..As people lose their jobs or money they will fly less , and seeing how extensive our number crunching department is at us airways we can get good estimates on short term outlooks ..I think not to long ago the company stopped making long term projections concerning passenger booking etc ..

The trend pattern that we are seeing in the US on a macro level indicates further retrenchment of consumer spending and a decline in consumer confidence ..this translates to us on a mico level with less bookings ….

To put it simply , people ain’t got the money to fly , and if they do , their too scared to spend it ..

Us airways will continue to die , unless magic fairies carpet bomb our country with 100 dollar bill’s from the sky the us consumer is toast baby !

 

[The Bagfather]

It will be interesting to see if any of those stations are brought back after
a year of averaging less than 14 mainline flts.

To another subject: Has anyone else had their head almost chopped off
from opening the front bin on those new 321s? Ive complained about it
but it seems the real problem has not been investigated . My understanding
is the new 321s are operating with a different hydrolic system which no
longer supplies the front bin with as much breaking power. If you add
the factor of a pressurized bin and and power shut down and you have
the possibility of and unaware ramper being seriously injured. There have
been two knock downs and one minor injury here. It is possible that this
problem is confined to a particular airbus that being 519.

Until now I have not seen a bin pop open more that about 12 inches. 519 will
pop out a full THIRTY inches under the conditions cited above. Due to
the fact that the above conditions do not occur very often(most likely on a
RON) rampers may not have experienced this, but I'd be interested if any
other stations have.

I have inquired whether or not there are any written standards regarding
any unsafe level of this problem. In my opinion it should be about 15 inches
or the amont that the new 321s pop out with no APU and no pressurization.
Anyway befor the company responds or doesnt as the case may be, make
sure your careful with the new planes.

 

[Jester]

I know this will rile you boys up... so let it FLY! H*** I might even invoke some profound philosophy from Jester!

Indeed you will, My Dearest Mr. Roabilly! So many targets and so little band width...

First, if the IAM is what "stands between you, immigrant workers, and the soup kitchen," then I have bigger problems then my job at US Airways. If I cannot compete against someone that does not speak the language and possesses little or no education or job skills, then the problem isn't "corporate fat-cats" as you put it, but ME!

Second, while I cannot speak for everyone in the West, but we don't have this Us vs. Them mentality against management which is probably a good thing since our job and this company's survival should recognize the real "Them" as being other airlines in an extremely challenging economic time. Either you find a way to work together, or we shall surely all sink together.

Third, I do not subscribe to some notion of "The Man" is out to stick it to the workers. I understand it may feel that way when companies are looking to cut costs and stay competitive. Everyone is trying to save a buck... you are no different than when you are haggling the price of 'shine at the local back woods still.

Fourth, I don't understand all this class envy. What does it matter if some CEO likes to play golf? Do I think that somehow if he was to stop playing golf it would better me personally? Hell, even if he paid himself nothing, do I think his salary would materially change my standard of living once it is divided amongst 30,000 employees? If anything, I would consider him to be an economic role model of someone I could wish to achieve such financial success after I patent my bag stacking technique or split the beer molecule... worry about improving yourself, not what others are earning.

And finally, I do not have the "victim mentality," as I suspect you do. I do not have this hostile view of managers. I would not find myself at the end of an economic rope if the company closed tomorrow. I do not my think my economic well-being is tied with the IAM as my sole life line. There are survivors and there is debris on the road side.

So Rebukes Jester.

 

[necigrad]

Has anyone else had their head almost chopped off
from opening the front bin on those new 321s? Ive complained about it
but it seems the real problem has not been investigated . My understanding
is the new 321s are operating with a different hydrolic system which no
longer supplies the front bin with as much breaking power. If you add
the factor of a pressurized bin and and power shut down and you have
the possibility of and unaware ramper being seriously injured. There have
been two knock downs and one minor injury here.

When I went through ramp class back in '98 we were told to stand to the side of the Airbus doors when opening because they can pop out forceably when unlatched. It seems to me that following this procedure would eliminate the concern.

 

[roabilly]

Indeed you will, My Dearest Mr. Roabilly! So many targets and so little band width...

First, if the IAM is what "stands between you, immigrant workers, and the soup kitchen," then I have bigger problems then my job at US Airways. If I cannot compete against someone that does not speak the language and possesses little or no education or job skills, then the problem isn't "corporate fat-cats" as you put it, but ME!

Second, while I cannot speak for everyone in the West, but we don't have this Us vs. Them mentality against management which is probably a good thing since our job and this company's survival should recognize the real "Them" as being other airlines in an extremely challenging economic time. Either you find a way to work together, or we shall surely all sink together.

Third, I do not subscribe to some notion of "The Man" is out to stick it to the workers. I understand it may feel that way when companies are looking to cut costs and stay competitive. Everyone is trying to save a buck... you are no different than when you are haggling the price of 'shine at the local back woods still.

Fourth, I don't understand all this class envy. What does it matter if some CEO likes to play golf? Do I think that somehow if he was to stop playing golf it would better me personally? Hell, even if he paid himself nothing, do I think his salary would materially change my standard of living once it is divided amongst 30,000 employees? If anything, I would consider him to be an economic role model of someone I could wish to achieve such financial success after I patent my bag stacking technique or split the beer molecule... worry about improving yourself, not what others are earning.

And finally, I do not have the "victim mentality," as I suspect you do. I do not have this hostile view of managers. I would not find myself at the end of an economic rope if the company closed tomorrow. I do not my think my economic well-being is tied with the IAM as my sole life line. There are survivors and there is debris on the road side.

So Rebukes Jester.

I hear yahhh...

Look at the terminology... GOLF as a metaphor! The MAN is simply the purveyor of immaculate capitalism without restrictions, and/or checks and balances! In your infinite wisdom... there will be no need to “competeâ€￾ with immigrant workers... there is NO competition... they work for just short of free! Are you willing to compete with that?

The social disruption perpetuated on this country with ‘trickle down capitalism’ has all but destroyed a whole class of workers! The truth is... it trickles OUT to other countries... not DOWN to the workers!

Jester... I never knew yew wuz so sensitive ‘bout golf...

Hmmmmmm...

So ponders...

BroBilly

 

[The Bagfather]

When I went through ramp class back in '98 we were told to stand to the side of the Airbus doors when opening because they can pop out forceably when unlatched. It seems to me that following this procedure would eliminate the concern.

What you say is reasonalble but I have never seen a bin pop out anything like this far. I'm fairly
tall and have long arms so I can stand far away and jump back. My worry is that if stood
to the side the bin would strike my arm. Also on a 321 is high and the lever system goes up
not around making the reach even higher. Bur wait till you experience this and like I say
It may only be this exagerated on 519. And it only does it with pressure AND no APU
or engine power.

 

[mike33]

Us airways will continue to die , unless magic fairies carpet bomb our country with 100 dollar bill’s from the sky the us consumer is toast baby !

Before USairways dies it will be UA. The writings on the wall. UA + US is right around the corner.

Those stations were toast as soon as the votes were counted for the agreement. I don't think we'll get to see another Contract Negotiation, just another TA.

 

[roabilly]

Before USairways dies it will be UA. The writings on the wall. UA + US is right around the corner.

Those stations were toast as soon as the votes were counted for the agreement. I don't think we'll get to see another Contract Negotiation, just another TA.

Agreed ‘33’...

Many of these conversations we have on here will ultimately prove insignificant in the future of the industry. Consolidation is looming near... M&A language will be of the utmost importance! Your contract will me of the utmost importance!

 

[bagchucker]

It will be interesting to see if any of those stations are brought back after
a year of averaging less than 14 mainline flts.

These stations wont be back. Can any East veterans cite any instances where the company has brought insourcing to stations that were outsourced? The company is finally scratching the itch they have had to eliminate West ramp cities.

 

[freedom]

Before USairways dies it will be UA. The writings on the wall. UA + US is right around the corner.

Those stations were toast as soon as the votes were counted for the agreement. I don't think we'll get to see another Contract Negotiation, just another TA.

you know i'd almost like to see that ... but from where i sit i don't think there will be enough time for it ..it took forever to merge our two airlines .... and it would take years to do the same with UA ... the economy is falling down at a pretty fast clip ... i'm thinking us airways shuts its doors by oh say maybe February ?

let me throw down a scenario for ya

Aug 2009 (job losses continue on the national level )

Sep 2009 … the schedule changes come online , more layoffs are announced , I’m going to pull a random number out of the air and say oh 2K … (job losses continue on the national level )

Oct 2009 : ticket prices are way down as consumers must be drawn out of their caves by drop dead prices on airfare … wages are frozen across the system , US airways attempts to renegotiate it’s loans .. Us airways succeeds in getting it’s loan covenants lowered , uh costs and stuff are differed until later etc ..(job losses continue on the national level )

Nov 2009 : oil prices are lower , but consumer spending is still falling and or flat lined , all out competition between the major airlines to get pax to fly on them ..(job losses lessen but continue on the national level )

Dec 2009 : the thanksgiving holiday period has been a disaster , cash reserves are almost gone , the company comes to the workers and asks for wage cuts … more layoffs

Jan or Feb 2010 , us airways shuts down ..

 

[mike33]

These stations wont be back. Can any East veterans cite any instances where the company has brought insourcing to stations that were outsourced? The company is finally scratching the itch they have had to eliminate West ramp cities.

I can't think of one!

They will have to average 98 weekly mainline departures. " Ain't going to happen"

 

[goodfellow]

Tighten your seatbelts, it is about to get moderate to severe turbulence in our industry!!! Hang on and stick together sisters and brothers, just be glad that you now have people that give a shirt that represent you. az Jerkster would say, SO SAYS GF 😱

 

[The Bagfather]

These stations wont be back. Can any East veterans cite any instances where the company has brought insourcing to stations that were outsourced? The company is finally scratching the itch they have had to eliminate West ramp cities.

What I meant by that comment was It will be interesting If and when the company
brings them back as outsourced stations. In other words It may be possible that
the company is willing to take some finantial hit from closing these staions just to
reduce our scope.