US Pilots Labor Discussion

[snapthis]

Ever hear of U-haul Jackass? I also mentioned I'd moved. Pay attention son this constantly having to correct you grows tiresome. Just like when I reached out to help a customer. Noticed you haven't posted there because you were WRONG AGAIN!

Never minding the fact it takes away from the point I was/am trying to make is that the constant infighting is what is going to crush you. The external forces like Jerry Glass can lay back and sip fine cognac and smoke expensive cigars while you do destroy yourselves from within.

Even funnier was one of my favorite movies, "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" was on last night and as I was watching it occurred to me why I enjoy reading the pilots thread. The similarities were frightening.

Don't you have someone to rat out Tough Guy? Perhaps write up a Flight Attendant? Ramp Agent? CSR? Surely as Doug Parker's butt boy there must be SOMETHING putrid you can do?

I was going to ask if you were East or West, but then I read a few of your posts and I figured out you must be Mesa or Republic as no mainline pilot could be a bigger idiot. PS: Try to learn the quote feature. I know it's tough but if you take your nose out from between Doug's Butt cheeks you can see better 😀

You are a funny guy IRABob. You speak like an Usapian hack. Why is that? Could it be that you are little too interested in this dispute?

My concern is for real passengers. Not phonies. Sorry pal for starling your thunder but I posted the proper contact info rather than relying imaginary friends in high places by someone who lives in a Cuckoo's Nest. It was obvious to me that you wanted the glory for saving the day. I did not want to embarrass you with your new found friend.

You crave attention, you got it.

 

[700UW]

You must be wanting a one way ticket to the cornfield, outing someone is a no no on this board.

And I have met Sparrowhawk, have had many conversations with him online, he is a passenger, he is/was a CP and is a friend of a few former labor leaders including myself.

Your barking up the wrong tree.

He and his fellow group did more for the employees who were being outsourced in PIT Res than the company did.

He has visited many sites and talked to employees, can you say the same?

What have you done for your coworkers who lost their jobs?

A big nothing, I bet!

 

[Pi brat]

The following video, paid for by america west pilots, insulting fellow pilot's age. Even judges are older women, who may not appreciate this conduct, if it was ever brought to their attention.

america west pilots video

I tried to watch this, but I only got part way through-it's too embarrassing. But, in the time I wasted it did raise one question: The west pilots complain that this was the one west grievance that USAPA chose to pursue. Wasn't that a condition from Doug? That he would delay taking the pay back in the quick time frame if USAPA agreed to an expedited grievance? And by doing that you now have had two years to pay it back? I mean, he could have taken the money then said "if you don't like it grieve it", like they do most things. I understand that you wanted the grievance heard, in case there was a loophole that would keep you from having to pay at all, but the point that "that was the grievance they chose to hear" seems disingenuous.

 

[snapthis]

You must be wanting a one way ticket to the cornfield, outing someone is a no no on this board.

And I have met Sparrowhawk, have had many conversations with him online, he is a passenger, he is/was a CP and is a friend of a few former labor leaders including myself.

Your barking up the wrong tree.

He and his fellow group did more for the employees who were being outsourced in PIT Res than the company did.

He has visited many sites and talked to employees, can you say the same?

What have you done for your coworkers who lost their jobs?

A big nothing, I bet!

How would I know you met Mr Sparrow? Am I just going to take your word at face value? Probably not. He's losing the debate since I exposed his half truths or flat out lies.

All you are trying to do is stifle free speech with your cornfield threat. In true Clearian form.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Single carrier, one FAA Certificate.

And that's the way it is.......

Yes, just like Eastern could not spin off the shuttle to Trump, right?

Single carrier, one FAA certificate.

 

[700UW]

Apparently you dont understand the 1st Amendment, it is free speech only pertaining to the government restricting speech.

Two I have met Sparrow, and he is not losing.

Your tattletale thread says it all about you.

Maybe you should stick to the topic at hand and debate with facts instead of trying to attack, insult and out an board member.

 

[snapthis]

Apparently you dont understand the 1st Amendment, it is free speech only pertaining to the government restricting speech.

Two I have met Sparrow, and he is not losing.

Your tattletale thread says it all about you.

Maybe you should stick to the topic at hand and debate with facts instead of trying to attack, insult and out an board member.

Obviously you support a work action disguised as safety issues. My concern is for getting my passengers from point A to B safely. Not leaving them stranded for someone else's selfish reasons.

I'm not going to be blamed for other's reckless actions. The company has made it clear that it will not tolerate such activity.

Go ahead, take your chances. Buh-bye.

 

[SparrowHawk]

How would I know you met Mr Sparrow? Am I just going to take your word at face value? Probably not. He's losing the debate since I exposed his half truths or flat out lies.

All you are trying to do is stifle free speech with your cornfield threat. In true Clearian form.

Which once again proves you to dumb as as a rock. This board is privately held so there is no free speech, just as there isn't in the US employee code of conduct & ethics. Try reading it. I have! Below is the applicable paragraph regarding "Outing" of a fellow poster. NOTE: The bolding is mine.

You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use the AirlineForums.com Message Boards to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law. You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or by AirlineForums.com.

That should cover the issue regarding identity & outing a fellow poster. The problem I have is that unlike you I'll never hit the "Report" button as it is cowardly I feel. But that's me. I'm pretty certain that given your history as a Stool Pigeon, Snitch & Rat, I'll get reported 17 times a minute by you. You've shown us who you are as a person and I thank you for that. When your attitude and words speak for themselves there is little need for me to interrupt.

I asked you about this 3 times now and all I get is "crickets" from you, so here we go again.

GREAT NEWS, Thanks to help from Bob, I received 2 phone calls from US Airways Customer Service and a letter containing $100.00 Travel Voucher!

I cannot believe it....After further investigation they realized that my flight was "late".

So now I am satisfied that they acknowledged their mistake, and offered some compensation.

Thank you Bob, it would not have happened without your intervention.

I am very happy!

Regards,

Dee Dee McGuire

Guess I am THE MAN, with the plan, the boss with the hot sauce after all. Have a US Airways day! Remember Doug's motto, "We're not happy until you're not happy" and God Bless the IRA!

 

[700UW]

I support people working safe and by the company's policies and procedures.

And you cant get in trouble for following the paperwork, yet you can for not following the rules and procedures.

No run along, its father's day and Doug needs a beer, so go fetch it for him.

 

[snapthis]

I support people working safe and by the company's policies and procedures.

And you cant get in trouble for following the paperwork, yet you can for not following the rules and procedures.

No run along, its father's day and Doug needs a beer, so go fetch it for him.

IRABob already had me make a beer run for Doug in an earlier thread. Boy, you two sure do think a lot alike.

 

[luvthe9]

Why are you so concerned with our business? I have doubts you are just a concerned passenger. Why are you constantly sticking your nose in our dispute? Are you not getting enough attention at home?

Consider him the counter balance to 767 Jetz. Sparrowhawk at least gives us some revenue. Jetzz just leaves his baggage..........

 

[SparrowHawk]

Obviously you support a work action disguised as safety issues. My concern is for getting my passengers from point A to B safely. Not leaving them stranded for someone else's selfish reasons.

I'm not going to be blamed for other's reckless actions. The company has made it clear that it will not tolerate such activity.

Go ahead, take your chances. Buh-bye.

Well said Uncle Tom! Just exactly who the Flock IS the company? Is it merely Doug Parker and the 30 something executives and BOB?

Or is it the Thirty Three Thousand men and women who actually do the work?

Oh and for the record, 700UW has already proved he's smarter than you. He got out of the Cesspool known as US Airways and moved on to better things.

I work for ME, there is no "I" in Team, but there is a "ME". Never been in a Union and don't care to be as they limit my income potential. I've learned that when it comes to Corporations it's best to do it to them before they do it to you. Want proof? Look at your situation. Pretty soon an E-190 Captain at Republic will make more than you do. I got stuck in a downsizing a few years back, company is still getting rid of those over 50. Class action Lawsuit? Not me! Right now I along with another are talking to Senior Management about outsourcing the Department that cut me and 15 others over 50 to My former colleague and myself. $2 Million in annual savings will get your proposal some traction. PLUS it has the added benefit if accepted, of having those who threw Marilyn, Shirley and I under the bus the humiliation of having to interview with us if they want their job, which in the case of three Managers there will NEVER happen.

Point to the above is that the ramp has my total support in their alleged job action. The question of why the Federal Government has it's nose in a private companies Labor Relations at any level is beyond me. I personally can't wait for CHAOS! Ask yourself who is ultimately at fault for the Labor unrest? Unless Doug comes up with some dough, he will have no one to blame but himself.

Now then boys and girls can anyone say Eastern Airlines? I knew that you could.

 

[nic4us]

There are those who would say that the current East gains, seniority wise, are at the expense of gains that were due West pilots.


Sorry but I fail to see how an East pilot who is moving ahead based on East attrition is stealing anything from a West pilot.
Merging seniority lists based on a snap-shot in time and ignoring the contributions of those employees who have worked for a long time is ridiculous.

On the basis of these public statements by management, what would a "snap-shot" look like now. What are West expetations now?

Al,

If a snapshot were taken today, it would hightlight exactly why the Nic is fair and equitable. The problem you are having seeing it, is because you are still looking at it as though there are still two seperate companies, and that the east pilots are making gains on something that is theirs. Not true. The reason there is even any east attrition is a result of "the merger". I suppose same could be said of the West attrition. The reason there are any east coast markets is "because of the merger". The reason PHX is no longer profitable for the West is because of saddling the east higher cost on the West operation..i.e. "because of the merger".

So, we throw all the cost and gains into a one pile, and share them equitably, that is what Nic does. What you are suggesting is that we throw all the cost onto the West, put all the upside on the east, then take a snapshot, after east pilots have already stolen attrition that no longer even belongs to them "because of the merger", and have a redo today for an event that took place 6 years ago.

Everything Parker, Kirby, Isom, Nicolau, Wake, Bybee, Tashima, Graber, Silver, Lakefield, have said to date upholds my point of view. The east pilots have reaped a huge benefit from the merger at the West's pilots expense. The fact that West pilots are furloughed while east furloughed pilots have been employed since the merger makes me sick to my stomach, I don't care if Colello had 17 years or not, he stole Odell's job.

In the simplest terms, the West's expectation is that a final and binding seniority award will be honored. The West, nor the east, would have never entered into arbitration with the expectation that the award could simply be dismissed by popular vote.

The West has given up on the expectation that any player in this fiasco would actually have any integrity and honor their word. And, I am not just talking about the east pilots. The company has lied to the West from the get go, and they turn up the volume of the lies with every passing month. First it was, "no employed personel will be replaced with furloughees", then it was "third list???? what third list?", then "yeah. we ACCEPTED the list, but define ACCEPTED". Now it is just emboldened straight up lies that are the result of 6 years of lying to everybody about the situation in the first place.

Enjoy your fathers day, and try to remember the furloughed West guys who lost their jobs to benefit the employed East pilots.

 

[Missfit]

In the simplest terms, the West's expectation is that a final and binding seniority award will be honored. The West, nor the east, would have never entered into arbitration with the expectation that the award could simply be dismissed by popular vote.

And if said "final and binding seniority award" followed ALPA's extremely flawed merger policy...ie; windfalls. (Which I know you disagree with) I'm sure it would have been acceptable to both parties.

Seems like all this was discussed 50+ closed threads ago.

The East will not give up their rightful attrition without a fight to the end...let me repeat that for you...WILL...NOT...GIVE...UP.
So if you think you're getting your point across to them...you're not.

But if you find it cathartic to spout your same point of view day after day after day...carry on.

 

[snapthis]

Al,

If a snapshot were taken today, it would hightlight exactly why the Nic is fair and equitable. The problem you are having seeing it, is because you are still looking at it as though there are still two seperate companies, and that the east pilots are making gains on something that is theirs. Not true. The reason there is even any east attrition is a result of "the merger". I suppose same could be said of the West attrition. The reason there are any east coast markets is "because of the merger". The reason PHX is no longer profitable for the West is because of saddling the east higher cost on the West operation..i.e. "because of the merger".

So, we throw all the cost and gains into a one pile, and share them equitably, that is what Nic does. What you are suggesting is that we throw all the cost onto the West, put all the upside on the east, then take a snapshot, after east pilots have already stolen attrition that no longer even belongs to them "because of the merger", and have a redo today for an event that took place 6 years ago.

Everything Parker, Kirby, Isom, Nicolau, Wake, Bybee, Tashima, Graber, Silver, Lakefield, have said to date upholds my point of view. The east pilots have reaped a huge benefit from the merger at the West's pilots expense. The fact that West pilots are furloughed while east furloughed pilots have been employed since the merger makes me sick to my stomach, I don't care if Colello had 17 years or not, he stole Odell's job.

In the simplest terms, the West's expectation is that a final and binding seniority award will be honored. The West, nor the east, would have never entered into arbitration with the expectation that the award could simply be dismissed by popular vote.

The West has given up on the expectation that any player in this fiasco would actually have any integrity and honor their word. And, I am not just talking about the east pilots. The company has lied to the West from the get go, and they turn up the volume of the lies with every passing month. First it was, "no employed personel will be replaced with furloughees", then it was "third list???? what third list?", then "yeah. we ACCEPTED the list, but define ACCEPTED". Now it is just emboldened straight up lies that are the result of 6 years of lying to everybody about the situation in the first place.

Enjoy your fathers day, and try to remember the furloughed West guys who lost their jobs to benefit the employed East pilots.

I never applied to US Air. Instead, US Air applied at America West and like a fool, Doug hired em. As a result, the West pilots have exchanged upgrades in less than 7 years (less than a year in the 80's) to the stagnation and furloughs today. There is a reason that many of us did not want to apply to the career stagnate airline US Air. My choices were SW and America West. Not the dying dinosaur who was way past it's prime. Besides I had no desire to be anywhere close to the East Coast.

Our pilots flying at the time of the merger will not hand their upgrade or job to a furloughed pilot. That is the DOH scheme we will not allow on our property. Not now, not ever. We wil fight it with our without the help of Leonidas. Guaranteed.

Thank you Doug Parker

Thanks Doug for transferring the East infection of furloughs and stagnation to West pilots.
Thanks Doug for pairing us up with people who don't have the hint of integrity.
Thanks Doug for not having any backbone to stand up to thugs trying to ruin your airline.

Thanks Doug for this mess of a merger.