US Pilots Labor Discussion

[lynyrdskynyrd]

It looks like it's likely going to be awhile before we could ever be one in any case. Perhaps after enough time goes by some of the poison will be replaced with a softening of sorts.

For instance, after attrition kicks in the long suffering east fos get back into the left seat and the west has forward movement as well, perhaps people will be more inclined to say, 'what the hell, I forgot what I was so pissed about, let's just get it done.'

At present it looks like the time that has gone by has added to the poison, and solidified extreme sentiments. Hopefully the next batch of time that goes by will soften sentiments and dilute the poison.

Perhaps we can't ever be one, but I don't believe it to be necessarily true. I'll buy that more time may be necessary, but I don't buy that it can't ever happen.

 

[crazystnic]

Reed,

Thanks for taking the time to look it up. You are more than likely right that the waters are too poisoned but I still hope that someone from either side is brave enough to stick their arm through the hole in the door.

After this trip I'm on vacation so I'll be taking care of family matters. My mother has taken a turn for the worse and is in the hosptital now. I have been blessed to have my parents with me for my whole life (63 years tomorrow) so I am a lucky man!

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours,

Bob Moore

*******************************
Is this the Bob Moore that was spared retirment by about a week with age 65? 🙂 I was never a big fan of 65 flying but for you sir I was, you were always a Gentleman on the AlPA board.

Best to your Family ...

 

[crazystnic]

Why is USAPA afraid to put a contract with the Nicolau Award out for a vote? Please stay on task with your answers.

USAPA is and will continue to be a failure until it get all the pilots WEST and EAST pulling in the same direction. The East trying to use its majority to force anything on the West will continue to create a divide and further any and all DFR actions. Until you accept the Binding Arbitration, you will be forever in this circle of mistrust and dismal failure. It seems that you enjoy working for industry trailing wages. Even if you upgrade through "East" attrition, your pay is still piss-poor. But you all don't seem to mind. And USAPA is too cowardly to put a contract up for a vote.

USAPA = Even the Captain's back East like LOW WAGES.

becuase we are no where near an agreement on wages and other items.

 

[crazystnic]

You make a very valid point. That ALPA set it up to remove themselves from the process. To give themselves immunity. So they would not get sued. What was the first thing usapa did? Put themselves in the middle of the process and got themselves sued. When we get back to DFR II 8 million will be tiny compared to the damages. Now before you going thinking no way damages will happen. Care to look at the MDA suit?

$175 mill. That was for a "minor error" of using the wrong list. Simple mistake maybe. What do you think a 4-5-6 year ongoing effort to implement a seniority system that harms a portion of the list will be worth? Does the MDA case have merit?

At this point ALPA who cares? usapa is the CBA for almost 3 years now. When are you guys going stop looking back and start looking forward? When does it become usapa's fault?

The "tweaking" of the Nicolau has been discussed. I have asked many times but never get an answer. What was the east willing to give not just take to "tweak" the award? So far I have heard nothing!!!

Not that it matters it is to late. Just curious.

I would be willing if there is a future furlough to get furloughed. how is that.

 

[Freebird]

becuase we are no where near an agreement on wages and other items.

Why exactly is that? Is it because USAPA reopened every completed section? Dont weasel out and answer that the company is at fault. USAPA is doing all it can to delay the inevitable. Poor character.


USAPA = "Despite all our rage, we are still just rats in a cage" ~Smashing Pumpkins

 

[Freebird]

Not even USAPA is planning on that. Go read the C&Rs on USAPA's website. It specifically prevents such things.

But noooo. It's always better to make stuff up and whine about it.

The C&R's written without any West input? DOA. Do you really think they are favorable to the West? C'mon Oldie. You need to wake up. I'm curious, do you renege on all your agreements? Or just the Binding Arbitrations?


USAPA = Taliban = USAPA (seamless)

 

[88 B.T.D.]

The C&R's written without any West input? DOA. Do you really think they are favorable to the West? C'mon Oldie. You need to wake up.

I can say that as an East pilot I would vote yes on an industry standard contract that had Nicolau with the same C&R for the East that are proposed for West.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

The C&R's written without any West input? DOA. Do you really think they are favorable to the West? C'mon Oldie. You need to wake up. I'm curious, do you renege on all your agreements? Or just the Binding Arbitrations?


USAPA = Taliban = USAPA (seamless)

The fact that YOU guys wouldn't help is your own fault. I even heard that someone that offered to help was threatened.
To answer your other question, I've never reneged on anything. Never even paid a bill late, even my union dues and assessments. How about you?

 

[prechilill]

This thing needs to move forward, it is crazy the rates you guys are working for out East. In a couple years I will be able to say the same thing about ours.

ATI captains make about $155 an hour and they are close to signing a new contract.

Atlas/ Polar and about to sign a new contract and they also expect to double their seniority list in the next five years. Whisper numbers are around $200 an hour.

Republic 170 captains will soon be making what East 320 captains make.

Insanity

 

[sumadarson]

This thing needs to move forward, it is crazy the rates you guys are working for out East. In a couple years I will be able to say the same thing about ours.

ATI captains make about $155 an hour and they are close to signing a new contract.

Atlas/ Polar and about to sign a new contract and they also expect to double their seniority list in the next five years. Whisper numbers are around $200 an hour.

Republic 170 captains will soon be making what East 320 captains make.

Insanity

You west pilots made millions less than the East pilots for years, now you are impatient. Heck look at the wages when you click on the link below. You west pilots did not even ask for international pay when you flew to Bangkok, Laos, Aruba and Australia. Your wages did not go up untill you were acquired and financed by Usairways.
america west pilot wages

 

[prechilill]

You west pilots made millions less than the East pilots for years, now you are impatient. Heck look at the wages when you click on the link below. You west pilots did not even ask for international pay when you flew to Bangkok, Laos, Aruba and Australia. Your wages did not go up untill you were acquired and financed by Usairways.
america west pilot wages

Your wages bought you 20 years in the right seat and a furlough! Now you want our captain seats, but I refuse to take your bait and even go there bud. From now on, it's all about pilot labor, not pilot wailing. We need a contract, we need to move forward.

 

[sumadarson]

Your wages bought you 20 years in the right seat and a furlough! Now you want our captain seats, but I refuse to take your bait and even go there bud. From now on, it's all about pilot labor, not pilot wailing. We need a contract, we need to move forward.

You underestimate with whom you are dealing with.

There are conditions and restrictions for what you brought to the airline, the PHX out and backs. A fact is not a bait, a non fact (luring substance)is a bait that catches the intended victim off guard.

I am not trying to catch anything but hypocrisy, you jumped up on my boat, I do not require bait when dealing with you.

 

[prechilill]

You underestimate with whom you are dealing with.

There are conditions and restrictions for what you brought to the airline, the PHX out and backs. A fact is not a bait, a non fact (luring substance)is a bait that catches the intended victim off guard.

I am not trying to catch anything but hypocrisy, you jumped up on my boat, I do not require bait when dealing with you.

Can you make a coherent post? Is that even possible?

 

[sumadarson]

Can you make a coherent post? Is that even possible?

coherent; logically connected; consistent: a coherent argument.

You make this impossible.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Your wages bought you 20 years in the right seat and a furlough! Now you want our captain seats, but I refuse to take your bait and even go there bud. From now on, it's all about pilot labor, not pilot wailing. We need a contract, we need to move forward.

Actually I would guess 95% of us want nothing to do with you, your HUB(which would have been pulled down by now had it not been for seperate ops)so go enjoy your attrition and you want to complain, do it to DP, ask an F/a how their negotiations are going! MM!