crazystnic
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you just figured that out? when are you guys going to run out of money? just checking...
and how much is the bill now?
US Pilots Labor Discussion
- Thread starter Richard
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- Status
you just figured that out? when are you guys going to run out of money? just checking...
and how much is the bill now?
Thank you clowns.
Filed today in Judge silvers court.
Notice is hereby provided that, on April 11, 2012, the United Stated
District Court for the Eastern District of New York, in Naugler v. Air Line Pilots
Ass’n, Int’l, Case No. 05-CV-4751, granted summary judgment to the Air Line
Pilots Association (“ALPA”) on a claim arising from the Nicolau Arbitration
(Copy of order is attached as Exhibit “A.”) The West Pilots bring this order to
Case 2:10-cv-01570-ROS Document 179 Filed 04/12/12 Page 1 of 3
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the attention of the Court because USAPA argued here that the Naugler
plaintiffs were necessary parties to this litigation. Doc. 49 at 31:10 to 31:17.1
At the hearing held on February 9, 2011, USAPA explained its view of
Naugler, in part, as follows:
One of the lawsuits we’re going to have if this court imposes the
Nicolau award is the Naugler case that we’ve referenced in our
papers. ALPA is accused of having deliberately committed a falsified
seniority list because part of Nicolau’s decision was to say pilots on
furlough back in 2005, even with 16 years of seniority, get zero.
* * *
ALPA’s argument in that litigation is, Your Honor, this case is not
ripe because Nicolau may not be implemented; but if Nicolau is
implemented, then the company is just in another lawsuit about
whether the Nicolau award was corrupted by ALPA’s forged seniority
list.
RT 42:11 to 43:4 (copy attached as Exhibit “B”). But, as explained in the order
dismissing the East Pilots’ claims in Naugler, USAPA is just wrong:
Since the List correctly identified the relevant employment data and
the status of each pilot, the List submitted by ALPA to the Arbitration
Board was factually accurate. No breach of the DFR could occur from
submitting the accurate List. ALPA’s actions in submitting the
factually accurate List were not arbitrary because it was reasonable
and rational to submit the accurate List.
Ex. “A” at 18.
In sum, Naugler found that the dispute there was ripe, without regard to
the outcome of this case. Id. at 15. And, having found that dispute ripe,
Naugler found that there was no merit to the East Pilots’ claim against ALPA.
/ / /
1 All citations to the docket refer to the page numbers in the Court’s electronic filing
system, and
Filed today in Judge silvers court.
Notice is hereby provided that, on April 11, 2012, the United Stated
District Court for the Eastern District of New York, in Naugler v. Air Line Pilots
Ass’n, Int’l, Case No. 05-CV-4751, granted summary judgment to the Air Line
Pilots Association (“ALPA”) on a claim arising from the Nicolau Arbitration
(Copy of order is attached as Exhibit “A.”) The West Pilots bring this order to
Case 2:10-cv-01570-ROS Document 179 Filed 04/12/12 Page 1 of 3
2
2821927.1
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
the attention of the Court because USAPA argued here that the Naugler
plaintiffs were necessary parties to this litigation. Doc. 49 at 31:10 to 31:17.1
At the hearing held on February 9, 2011, USAPA explained its view of
Naugler, in part, as follows:
One of the lawsuits we’re going to have if this court imposes the
Nicolau award is the Naugler case that we’ve referenced in our
papers. ALPA is accused of having deliberately committed a falsified
seniority list because part of Nicolau’s decision was to say pilots on
furlough back in 2005, even with 16 years of seniority, get zero.
* * *
ALPA’s argument in that litigation is, Your Honor, this case is not
ripe because Nicolau may not be implemented; but if Nicolau is
implemented, then the company is just in another lawsuit about
whether the Nicolau award was corrupted by ALPA’s forged seniority
list.
RT 42:11 to 43:4 (copy attached as Exhibit “B”). But, as explained in the order
dismissing the East Pilots’ claims in Naugler, USAPA is just wrong:
Since the List correctly identified the relevant employment data and
the status of each pilot, the List submitted by ALPA to the Arbitration
Board was factually accurate. No breach of the DFR could occur from
submitting the accurate List. ALPA’s actions in submitting the
factually accurate List were not arbitrary because it was reasonable
and rational to submit the accurate List.
Ex. “A” at 18.
In sum, Naugler found that the dispute there was ripe, without regard to
the outcome of this case. Id. at 15. And, having found that dispute ripe,
Naugler found that there was no merit to the East Pilots’ claim against ALPA.
/ / /
1 All citations to the docket refer to the page numbers in the Court’s electronic filing
system, and
Phoenix
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Is certain he will be elected now.CCC Update (Building Credentials): April 12, 2012
Building Credentials
A New Day for USAPA?
From: "Rob Streble" <rstreble@usairlinepilots.org>
Date: April 10, 2012 700 AM EDT
To: "xxx xxxxx”
Subject:RE: Paul Music FPL for grievance training
Confirmed he was removed from trip 2xxxx on Xxxxx xxth at an estimated cost to the Union of $2,717.57 as authorized by Spike and Parrella. ]
The email above came in response to a written request for union information, from The Compass Correction, to USAPA. We had our curiosity raised by the endorsement letter for candidate Paul Music, by Captain William G. Glynn on his web-board blog.
This e-mail confirmation from our USAPA Secretary/Treasurer brings up some compelling talking points.
Why is a candidate going to training to be a rep prior to being elected?
Why does this candidate need 3 days off, at a cost to USAPA members for a 3-hour course that could and should be done voluntarily?
Why did current PHL Chairman Steve Szpyrka authorize this?
What is Mr. Music doing the other 2 days he has off and is getting paid for with our dues dollars?
Since Grievance Chair Parrella is off full-time, why couldn’t she teach this course at a convenient time that did not require Mr. Music to drop and get paid for a 3-day trip?
Shouldn’t this course be taught to reps AFTER THEY ARE ELECTED, so our dues money is not wasted? What if Mr. Music does not win the election? Then that $2727.57 of your dues money was entirely wasted, and Mr. Music got a paid vacation on your dime!
We at the Compass Correction have had enough of this sort of cronyism, back-scratching and money-wasting at USAPA. The Cleary Era is all but over…and still this kind of dues money wasting is going on.
Please consider carefully, before you vote in current ongoing PHL election. If you have already voted, it is not too late to recast your ballot. Unlike other elections, there is only one position on the ballot for recasting.
In his recent Blog, Glynn could not resist slamming Jamie Weidner, rather than simply singing the praises of Paul Music; that always raises our collective eyebrows. If the endorser can’t put forth positive reasons to vote for his candidate, he will generally resort to mud slinging.
Mr. Glynn states that candidate F/O Music, a Cleary and Szpyrka disciple, is uniquely qualified to represent you in the PHL Chief Pilot’s office since he has recently received important union training. Here’s the rest of the story…
Jamie was notified by PHL Chairman Szyprka, on March 22, that he had been scheduled for a March 27th training session on”representation”. He was told that this was to “educate” him on the nuances of Parrella style representation.
This three-hour class was to be hosted by none other than Tracy Parrella, our USAPA Grievance Chair. Weidner responded that he had a scheduling conflict and that any of the following dates would work for him: March 28, 29 or 30th. Also, he pointed out the fact that these dates dovetailed with the upcoming BPR Meeting. The later dates would also increase efficiency, since the new PHX Representatives, as well as new VP, Steve Bradford and new EVP, Steve Smyser would all be present at that time for the same training; which they all needed.
Here’s the training course in a nutshell:
a. Prep the Pilot
b. Take good notes
c. You can’t bring a USAPA Attorney
d. Don’t say anything stupid!
Also, the always practical Weidner pointed out that this 3 hour training class could wait until after the PHL special election, because if he was not elected, the expense and USAPA resources would not be wasted. Weidner also mentioned to Chairman Szyprka that in the meantime, three previous Representatives were available in PHL and had made themselves available, should the need arise.
For reasons unknown, Szyprka instead decided to train Candidate F/O Music, on March 27th., along with two other non-Committee PHL First Officers, hand picked by Szpyrka. As a result, First Officer Music was paid for a three day Rome trip + expenses, for attending this three hour Parrella indoctrination. This is simply another Cleary sponsored “Cash for Cronies” deal, or as Mike Cleary himself refers to it as “building credentials.” We are reminded of that credit card commercial.
Three hours work!
Three days of pay!
Political favors and campaign points obtained!
Priceless!
And it only cost you, the dues paying USAPA member, $2,717.57! (USAPA estimate).For those of you doing the math, remember; a bought trip costs USAPA a company mandated 30% (approximately)- cash penalty, paid back to Management. Mike Cleary loves to spend “other people’s money!”
The PHL special Election: An endorsement of Jamie Weidner.
We at the Compass Correction like to think we know a little about representation. In fact, at least five of our recent contributors have served as representatives for the pilots at our current bargaining agent or under our previous bargaining agent. We also know what this special election is all about.
This election is about the continuation of the nightmare many of you thought was in the rearview mirror when you elected a new president in Gary Hummel and a new approach in leadership; separate from the disasters of the past failed tirades of the Cleary administration. Under Mike Cleary, this pilot group witnessed failure after failure for 3 years with an administration that included four (AZ, NC, NY, MN) miserable court losses amid a dysfunctional leadership corp.
You see, the reason your outgoing president did not run for re-election was because his closest aides told him he was not electable. So Cleary chose to run a hidden campaign, a campaign that would allow enough support for one of those “golden flight pay loss” jobs.
It has come down to this – his one last shot! Mike Cleary needs the election of First Officer Music to join his other PHL and CLT cronies to provide the needed BPR majority to land one of those coveted positions on the NAC (negotiating) and/or Merger Committees.
Let’s be clear. A vote for F/O Music is a vote to place Mike Cleary on an important committee.A Committee where Cleary can bring us more of his failed leadership and “no results” accomplishments for this pilot group. All US Airways pilots deserve a fresh start. You deserve it and you know it!
So fellow pilots and USAPA members, particularly you the PHL voters, it is time to pay attention to this little glimpse into the current political world of Mike Cleary and his last desperate grasp for power. It is also important to note the continued political maneuvering by the current CLT and PHL reps and their disregard for your wishes, not to mention YOUR money.
We know Jamie Weidner from our days as the Council 41 leaders who were the first to declare our opposition to the NIC. Jamie was right there with us on the bus to and from Herndon and he’s never gotten off that bus since. He is the intelligent, rational and independent candidate that we can all be proud of.
Fraternally,
Eric Rowe PHL A330
Woody Menear PHL 7i
Jed Thomas PHL A330
Dave Ciabattoni PHL AB 320
crazystnic
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Hey Jim we still get to vote and I belive you are very wrong... I don't think if anyone forces us to use the NIC that all of a sudden guys will give in.
It's wasy more personal than that.
I know nothing about getting a thread closed. I do know that when I went to meet a Md. congressman he did not ask me my party (not his), he also did not suggest a donation and he did support the cause that we explained to him. Sorry if it appeared I was twisting your message as that was not my intention. I don't attend political fund raisers....I'll leave that to someone else. I'll just do the voting.
Move2CLT
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Hawkhunter
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LOL again. This is what I am talking about. Please go back and read all of your thousands of post. I sound like a saint compared to your vulgar insulting post. You idiots always cry foul but are the first to kick someone in the knees. If you cannot take it then cry somewhere else. Stay on your meds scab. :unsure:
In the past seven years I have come across four easties worth talking to. The rest.... detrogenous waste. We should take no prisoners.
Junebug, Nic4 and Res are starting to lose it as they see the AA deal coming up on them fast. There is just no time for the Nic. now, the delay of USAPA was priceless. Worth every cent! They still don't get you have to have a joint contract to have the Nic, and that is never going to happen now.
Incoming merger. Parker has learned from previous mistakes. Contract first merger, Delta-Northwest style. Contract appeals to American pilots (The majority). There's your contract, hello Nicolau.
EastCheats
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Fair enough..
FA is the one who admitted going to the mods about language that offends him. He either needs to grow a pair or leave the camp fire. All hat and no cattle if you ask me.
That's ok. The west pilots are used to dealing with bastards.
USA320Pilot
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I believe this is exactly what will happen, which is why the APA is not jumping on Tom Horton's band wagon of being anti-merger during the Texas-based carrier's "formal reorganization."
To expand on the Internet comment above I believe you will see US Airways publicly negotiate with the unions for the two companies. For the pilots it will be the DAL ALPA contract + 1% (industry leading), AMR employee pensions frozen, and for US Airways' pilots acceptance of the DJ District Court decision without appeal.
And, I believe APA knows this too, which is why Star Telegram reported:
American Airlines' pilots union accused management Wednesday of a "publicity stunt" for a memo written by the carrier's vice president of flight that contended that pilots are skeptical about a takeover bid from US Airways.
"Our take is, for whatever reason, American Airlines management feels threatened by US Airways management," said Gregg Overman, a spokesman for the Allied Pilots Association.
He said union President David Bates has seen the memo, written by John Hale.
Overman noted that the current industry landscape does not support some of Hale's assertions, particularly if one looks at the operational performance of American and US Airways.
For example, US Airways has outperformed American in metrics such as on-time performance and baggage handling, Overman said.
USA320Pilot
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CCC Update (Building Credentials): April 12, 2012
Building Credentials
A New Day for USAPA?
From: "Rob Streble" <rstreble@usairlinepilots.org>
Date: April 10, 2012 7
To: "xxx xxxxx”
Subject:RE: Paul Music FPL for grievance training
Confirmed he was removed from trip 2xxxx on Xxxxx xxth at an estimated cost to the Union of $2,717.57 as authorized by Spike and Parrella. ]
The email above came in response to a written request for union information, from The Compass Correction, to USAPA. We had our curiosity raised by the endorsement letter for candidate Paul Music, by Captain William G. Glynn on his web-board blog.
This e-mail confirmation from our USAPA Secretary/Treasurer brings up some compelling talking points.
Why is a candidate going to training to be a rep prior to being elected?
Why does this candidate need 3 days off, at a cost to USAPA members for a 3-hour course that could and should be done voluntarily?
Why did current PHL Chairman Steve Szpyrka authorize this?
What is Mr. Music doing the other 2 days he has off and is getting paid for with our dues dollars?
Since Grievance Chair Parrella is off full-time, why couldn’t she teach this course at a convenient time that did not require Mr. Music to drop and get paid for a 3-day trip?
Shouldn’t this course be taught to reps AFTER THEY ARE ELECTED, so our dues money is not wasted? What if Mr. Music does not win the election? Then that $2727.57 of your dues money was entirely wasted, and Mr. Music got a paid vacation on your dime!
We at the Compass Correction have had enough of this sort of cronyism, back-scratching and money-wasting at USAPA. The Cleary Era is all but over…and still this kind of dues money wasting is going on.
Please consider carefully, before you vote in current ongoing PHL election. If you have already voted, it is not too late to recast your ballot. Unlike other elections, there is only one position on the ballot for recasting.
In his recent Blog, Glynn could not resist slamming Jamie Weidner, rather than simply singing the praises of Paul Music; that always raises our collective eyebrows. If the endorser can’t put forth positive reasons to vote for his candidate, he will generally resort to mud slinging.
Mr. Glynn states that candidate F/O Music, a Cleary and Szpyrka disciple, is uniquely qualified to represent you in the PHL Chief Pilot’s office since he has recently received important union training. Here’s the rest of the story…
Jamie was notified by PHL Chairman Szyprka, on March 22, that he had been scheduled for a March 27th training session on”representation”. He was told that this was to “educate” him on the nuances of Parrella style representation.
This three-hour class was to be hosted by none other than Tracy Parrella, our USAPA Grievance Chair. Weidner responded that he had a scheduling conflict and that any of the following dates would work for him: March 28, 29 or 30th. Also, he pointed out the fact that these dates dovetailed with the upcoming BPR Meeting. The later dates would also increase efficiency, since the new PHX Representatives, as well as new VP, Steve Bradford and new EVP, Steve Smyser would all be present at that time for the same training; which they all needed.
Here’s the training course in a nutshell:
a. Prep the Pilot
b. Take good notes
c. You can’t bring a USAPA Attorney
d. Don’t say anything stupid!
Also, the always practical Weidner pointed out that this 3 hour training class could wait until after the PHL special election, because if he was not elected, the expense and USAPA resources would not be wasted. Weidner also mentioned to Chairman Szyprka that in the meantime, three previous Representatives were available in PHL and had made themselves available, should the need arise.
For reasons unknown, Szyprka instead decided to train Candidate F/O Music, on March 27th., along with two other non-Committee PHL First Officers, hand picked by Szpyrka. As a result, First Officer Music was paid for a three day Rome trip + expenses, for attending this three hour Parrella indoctrination. This is simply another Cleary sponsored “Cash for Cronies” deal, or as Mike Cleary himself refers to it as “building credentials.” We are reminded of that credit card commercial.
Three hours work!
Three days of pay!
Political favors and campaign points obtained!
Priceless!
And it only cost you, the dues paying USAPA member, $2,717.57! (USAPA estimate).For those of you doing the math, remember; a bought trip costs USAPA a company mandated 30% (approximately)- cash penalty, paid back to Management. Mike Cleary loves to spend “other people’s money!”
The PHL special Election: An endorsement of Jamie Weidner.
We at the Compass Correction like to think we know a little about representation. In fact, at least five of our recent contributors have served as representatives for the pilots at our current bargaining agent or under our previous bargaining agent. We also know what this special election is all about.
This election is about the continuation of the nightmare many of you thought was in the rearview mirror when you elected a new president in Gary Hummel and a new approach in leadership; separate from the disasters of the past failed tirades of the Cleary administration. Under Mike Cleary, this pilot group witnessed failure after failure for 3 years with an administration that included four (AZ, NC, NY, MN) miserable court losses amid a dysfunctional leadership corp.
You see, the reason your outgoing president did not run for re-election was because his closest aides told him he was not electable. So Cleary chose to run a hidden campaign, a campaign that would allow enough support for one of those “golden flight pay loss” jobs.
It has come down to this – his one last shot! Mike Cleary needs the election of First Officer Music to join his other PHL and CLT cronies to provide the needed BPR majority to land one of those coveted positions on the NAC (negotiating) and/or Merger Committees.
Let’s be clear. A vote for F/O Music is a vote to place Mike Cleary on an important committee.A Committee where Cleary can bring us more of his failed leadership and “no results” accomplishments for this pilot group. All US Airways pilots deserve a fresh start. You deserve it and you know it!
So fellow pilots and USAPA members, particularly you the PHL voters, it is time to pay attention to this little glimpse into the current political world of Mike Cleary and his last desperate grasp for power. It is also important to note the continued political maneuvering by the current CLT and PHL reps and their disregard for your wishes, not to mention YOUR money.
We know Jamie Weidner from our days as the Council 41 leaders who were the first to declare our opposition to the NIC. Jamie was right there with us on the bus to and from Herndon and he’s never gotten off that bus since. He is the intelligent, rational and independent candidate that we can all be proud of.
Fraternally,
Eric Rowe PHL A330
Woody Menear PHL 7i
Jed Thomas PHL A330
Dave Ciabattoni PHL AB 320
Is this about the relentness thirst for power, FPL/Stipends, and not having to work for a living at the expense of thousands of people? Me thinks so...
Move2CLT
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You don't talk about anything HH.
Speaking of crying, how'd that MDA short-circuit the Nic thing pan out?
Move2CLT
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