US Pilots Labor Discussion

[aquagreen73s]

"Virtue is for sissies." Umm...where's that place "Integrity" then? 😉

"but the rational and very committed group that is the West.." Oh I respect the overall group cohesion you've built up....but have little recourse other than wholesale laughter at the infantile fantasies involved. Take your own avatar: "Caution, this is Sparta"....I mean....be serious sir. As for "commited"?...Well...perhaps a few of your "unemotional" and fully "rational" should be...or at least be taught to wipe the drool and spittle off. The east certainly has candidates for that as well. My point being that infantile west fantasies of group grandeur and impeccable quality are far past laughable...as are ANY assignments ever made of universally held virtues or flaws for any size-able group of people...

What happened four years ago today?

 

[EastUS1]

Aqua: "What happened four years ago today? "

I got that one! The Pope addressed the United Nations.

http://www.uspapalvisit.org/day_1218.htm

Aqua: "I'm talking about cold, hard mettle. We've got it" It's axiomatic that some of you do..and many don't. That's how it works within any large group of people.

 

[Black Swan]

A very important election in PHL closes tomorrow. Paul Music is an outstanding candidate. this election will absolutely forecast the direction the BPR will take. Good luck to Paul.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Not steamrolling. Persevering is the word. I used to regret having to go through this but looking back now, I think the West has changed a lot. The West is much stronger and more united than any of us on the West ever thought possible. You see the strength in us now with the latest episode of the East stealing the Appeal Board election. Our advantage over you is that we have learned how to control our emotions. We can look at a situation analytically and manage the short term as well as the long term. We know where we stand legally and we know we how this will eventually play out. Call it wining or losing or whatever you like. We do know that eventually - and probably a lot sooner than later - our envelopment in the most dysfunctional group will end. APA? No problem.

I'll save this one for the archives. Should be a classic. Who said there are no flat-earthers around/

 

[nycbusdriver]

I mean no personal offense here Aqua, but; the very posting of that line provides a low threshold of credibility for that even being true in your own case. Any that can ever assign universally held "virtues" or flaws to an entire grouping of people are, without possible question, offering up nothing more than emotional nonsense. Ummm...and do you ever read your fellows' pithy postings here? 😉 Any absurd fantasies as to your merry band being magically comprised of universally rational and unemotional individuals is perhaps the most ludicrous thought you've ever forwarded. This stands equally true of fantasized, inherently imbued, and magically obtained universal "Integrity", or wholesale lack thereof, of any grouping as well.

From even just the immediately above gems from your comrades: "Sounds like desperation setting in as reality descends up their paradigm." "you mean his Grand Daughters wedding?"

Ah! Yet another freshly offered pearl of entirely rational and unemotional response: "No...If he is from CLT he means his daughter's wedding, and his nephew's."

Oh yes indeed....your bunch has redefined cool and unemotional "thought" 😉

Aqua: "Our advantage over you is that we have learned how to control our emotions." Seriously Aqua....you're smarter than that....must be just a moment of your "Playing to the pigeons/supporter base"

Nailed it!

 

[nycbusdriver]

Man! How many times do we have to hear you guys whine about working weekends or not having summer vacation or missing this that or the other thing. Boys this is the airline business. If it takes you 25 years to get off reserve it is you that dont understand the airline business. It is just your crappy airline that takes 30 years to upgrade.

20-30 at any other airline in the world makes you senior. On the east that makes you an F/O. Yes understand the word seniority. If you are e bottom guys and have 1 month 1 years or 17 years you are the bottom pilot. Not senior, junior.

It was an east pilot maybe you that tried to justify why the shuttle captain went junior by stating everyone mis bid. Bunt as you say most did it for lifestyle of the intricacies of bidding. So be it. But why do you think that the east pilots bid for reasons other than highest they can hold but you are convinced that west pilots will bid your precious WB at the first opportunity? Fear mongering.

I was in the left seat in 4 years. The pilots hired a year after me became captains in 2 1/2. The pendulum swings. Watch out, it may smack you in the teeth.

 

[cleardirect]

A very important election in PHL closes tomorrow. Paul Music is an outstanding candidate. this election will absolutely forecast the direction the BPR will take. Good luck to Paul.

Music is an outstanding candidate if you are a Cleary supporter and want 2 more years of dysfunction and fighting.

Cleary has had 4 years ans accomplished nothing. Read his last message. Politics and in fighting. Untruthful comm messages. Not a mention of a contract. After 4 years nada. So vote for music if you want 2 more years of that.

 

[Metroyet]

Music is an outstanding candidate if you are a Cleary supporter and want 2 more years of dysfunction and fighting.

Cleary has had 4 years ans accomplished nothing. Read his last message. Politics and in fighting. Untruthful comm messages. Not a mention of a contract. After 4 years nada. So vote for music if you want 2 more years of that.

Cleary belongs in prison accompanied by an astonishing lack of lubricants. Sounds like the RICO game may be coming to the doorsteps of a few organization leaders. The difference this time is actual merit.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Cleary belongs in prison accompanied by an astonishing lack of lubricants. Sounds like the RICO game may be coming to the doorsteps of a few organization leaders. The difference this time is actual merit.

It'll get funded like Santa Claus will be the filing attorney.

 

[aquagreen73s]

I'll save this one for the archives. Should be a classic. Who said there are no flat-earthers around/

Please do. Btw, what happened four years ago today?

 

[traderjake]

Nailed it!

Two guys justifying their unethical behavior.

There is no ambiguity here, it is unethical to renege on a mutually agreed upon arbitration process.

 

[EastCheats]

Well,other than the east furloughees whom AWA hired, and the few east pilots who quit their jobs from the sinking ship on the east to take employment at AWA, you are on to something here.

Us Westies are clueless as to how an airline actually operates under those archaic work rules and procedures that are left over remnants of your thrice bankrupt failure of an airline.


On second thought, I think it is you who has no clue how LCC actually operates.

They think we want widebodies and assume we are missing out on something. Been there, done that. I have no desire to fly those routes again. Three time zones is enough for me. We'll leave it up to Bob to down a few in an Irish pub and chase all the wide bodies he can find over there. Then brag about it on this forum

 

[Move2CLT]

They think we want widebodies and assume we are missing out on something. Been there, done that. I have no desire to fly those routes again. Three time zones is enough for me. We'll leave it up to Bob to down a few in an Irish pub and chase all the wide bodies he can find over there. Then brag about it on this forum

I second that. You easties can have all the WBs you want. I'll be happy flying a 320 domestically out of CLT until I retire.

 

[Ames]

Please link us to the minutes to prove your point.

I don't need to. Just read the transcripts. Pay particular attention to the part where Mr. Nicolau tells the east MC that DOH is unlikely and he gave them one last chance to negotiate.

 

[Ames]

I am serious.

I can't figure out how it worked out. How many months did the company go below West fleet mins?

There are some people on the list who look like they got one months difference between reserve guarantee and line average, while others got that same number for months, even if they were senior enough to hold lines but choose to bid reserve.

On top of that I can't figure out if it is even the difference between reserve guarantee and line average, I am just assuming that part.

I am not on the list because I did not get bumped to reserve, which is my understanding from the arbitration as to who would get the payout, so maybe that is why I can't figure it out.


I guess the biggest point I would like to make is not going to be a popular one. If the distribution was determined as part of the follow up to the arbitration and ordered this way by the arbitrator, then I think the best course is to go ahead an recieve the payout as ordered. However, if this is just the grievence committee dividing up the money based on who was on reserve for those months, then maybe it needs to be massaged a little.

I believe the arbitrator determined that the company furloughed properly and that the furloughed pilots and subsequent downgraded captains would have been in that position anyway. The harm went to lineholders forced to reserve and the pot of around $1 million was to be split by those. It was up to the grievance committee to take it from there and I wasn't kidding when I suspected that it was done in such a way as to piss us off. There is no rhyme or reason to how it was done. Senior captains who would never have been forced to reserve appear to have gotten the biggest awards. I was given an award and, although downgraded, never sat reserve.

It was either done by lazy, thoughtless people or those with a wish to divide our group. Either one fits the knitting lady.