usairways addresses the twu incident on usdaily

[HPearlyretiree]

Not to say violence is the answer to anything..

Acts of violence against a SCAB is a different story all together. SCABS know the are stealing someones job.. These TWU officials were trying to protect their members which is their job..

Jeezus H. Christ.

Acts of violence against ANYONE is wrong and against the law. Is that so hard for the goons, thugs and no-neck creeps to understand?

Just because you are in a union, you do not get a free ride to beat the hell out of people you disagree with. This isn't Somalia and you aren't a warlord.

Why is America rejecting unionism?

Buy a mirror.

 

[D M G]

almost as good as the former IAM safety guy who would ride to a fuel spill on the side of a beltloader and they shut the ramp down

Yeah, I.S. always did what was best for him, especially if it got him out of work.

 

[Snafu]

The members vote for steward and AGCs, yet Tony was a Vice President then elevated to AGC.

The members voted them in accordingly.

So maybe you need to address the membership and their democratic right to vote.

Membership votes, plain and simple, they elect their reps.

Oh my garsh!!! Look at that. A recognition of a members right to vote.
Mark this day!!!

Let the vote happen!!

 

[fanlube]

you better check the contract at NWA....its in fleet to do that work.....its in fleet at U to do it if and when IAM mechs would walk.

besides i was refering to AMFA...and you had to take your shot



of course i realize you refer to any union representation left here...

I beleive this has been discussed numerous times, I love how you IAM mouth pieces actually believe what the IAM did at NWA wasn't scabbing! When you perform work that a group was doing that is now on strike you are a SCAB!! :down:

 

[Bob Owens]

I agree, and that's one of the reasons the statement the IAM is supposed to make today will be interesting.

If the IAM denies or tries to protect certain people from the beginning it'll come back to bite them in the ass. If I were the Police I would focus on the FSA that entered the room but didn't actively participate. Let them know that they're just as responsible as the guys that threw punches and are facing the same prosecution, and I guarantee that some of them sing. Their jobs are probably gone, they may get put in jail, their wives are pissed, and the IAM is going to protect the ring leaders? Come on, I guarantee some of them talk.

The IAM needs to immediately remove the AGC and all LL1776 Officers involved.

What a load of crap. Responsible for what? All they have to say is they did not see anything clearly. What could they be charged with? Attending a lawful meeting that they were invited to and not seeing anything?

I doubt many of them will talk, after all they dont want their coworkers to think of them as snitches.

Years ago this would have never made it to the papers or the Police.

 

[D M G]

What a load of crap. Responsible for what? All they have to say is they did not see anything clearly. What could they be charged with? Attending a lawful meeting that they were invited to and not seeing anything?

I doubt many of them will talk, after all they dont want their coworkers to think of them as snitches.

You're kidding, right? This is going to turn quite a few lives upside down very shortly.

You doubt many of them will talk? How many of the rumored participants do you personally know? I know them all, and most of them will sing like an opera star when pressed by the authorities.

 

[Bob Owens]

Not to say violence is the answer to anything..

Acts of violence against a SCAB is a different story all together. SCABS know the are stealing someones job.. These TWU officials were trying to protect their members which is their job..

A few less words and you would have been correct.

"These TWU officials were trying to protect their job.."

If the TWU is out then they are back on the floor.

TWU officials could care less about their members, they only care about the dues they provide.

Has anyone looked at Jim Littles (#1 TWU position) Bio lately?

It seems he was caught in a lie so they made a few revisions.

He no longer has a NYS Teachers Liscence, now its a certificate and he no longer has his Batchelors or Masters degrees.

It still doesnt mention his long stint in AA management either.

Is the TWU really what you want? Do you want to give your dues to a known Liar with long ties to AA management?

Ask the ex TWA guys at AA how they feel about the TWU,in fact ask anyone who is not in a paid union position at AA about the TWU.

 

[D M G]

What happens when the rampers challenge the Teamsters? I'll tell you what will happen. We'll have another Meltdown in PHL because the Teamsters will put the rampers in the hospital by the hundreds. Boy Scouts they ain't.

The rampers in PHL were Teamsters before being decertified in 1991. In fact, the three AGCs from PHL were all hard line Teamsters. The guys in PHL can handle themselves, Teamsters or not.

 

[Awa Contract]

ANYTHING THAT GETS RID OF THE IAM IS WORTHWHILE

 

[D M G]

Well that certainly explains a great deal. Thanks! I guess it will be more like the "Thrilla in Manilla"

Place your bets. I'm going with the Teamsters and I'm giving three fractured limbs.

 

[Bob Owens]

Let's go to the videotape shall we? The use of force and condoning it is why the American Labor Movement has a declining membership and are viewed as irrevelent by large portions of the population.

Well you are wrong there. While I'm not promoting violence your statement is far from factual.

If anything the Labor Movement started its growth amid violence, usually initially perpetrated by hired thugs working for the companies. When the unions fought back they gained a lot of respect. Declining union membership comes during a period of very very little violence and even less resistance to corporate demands. Union membership is not declining because of violence, its declining because workers dont see where the union will get them a better deal, they see the unions as too timid, not too militant.

You seem to be saying that what the IAM did was all grand and good. What happens when the rampers challenge the Teamsters? I'll tell you what will happen. We'll have another Meltdown in PHL because the Teamsters will put the rampers in the hospital by the hundreds. Boy Scouts they ain't. So please explain exactly what positive came from these actions?

Well that is how you interpret it but thats not what I said. Was it wrong to rough those guys up a little bit, even after they were warned not to go to Phil? Yes. The TWU has the right to campaign, but I must admit that since the TWU consistantly violates those same rights, in less violent but just as effective ways, that I did take pleasure in hearing about it. Its kind of like when we watched Iran and Iraq go to war. Human decency dictates that we abhore the violence and killing but since we really didnt like either side we just sat back and provided weapons to both sides. Watching the IAM resort to violence and the TWUs reaction calling for the company to FIRE EVERYONE INVOLVED was bad press for both sides. Unions should never call for another union person to be fired as a result of differences between unions.Demands like this are not uncommon for the TWU. A few years back at a TWU Local 501 party a couple of officers got into a fracis with a couple of members. The party had nothing to do with the company. The officers of the Local reported the incident to management and was trying to get management to fire the members but not the officers. At the hearing one of the members told the company and the union that he had in his posession a video tape that proved that the union officer threw the first punch. The charges were dropped. Tchnically the TWU is violating their Constitution when they run to the company to report things that happen at union gatherings. The Oath of members states " not to make known any private business of the Union", the officers oath states "not to divulge or make known any private proceedings of the union".The issue should have been settled between the two unions, the company and the police should not have been brought in.

Did the unions look like modern professional organizations dedicated to the betterment of the individual? NO!

Did they look that way before the donnybrook?

Did US Airways improve its image and as a result get more bookings? NO!

Did they lose any?

Did the IAM improve its chances of remaining the ramp bargaining agent? Unlikely

Probably.

So Bob I'll wait patiently for your response. These thugs are no better than the "Baldwins" of the WV Coal Field Wars who routinely shot striking miners. Also check this out.

West Virginia miner shot dead for working during a strike
On the orders of the United Mine Workers (UMW), 16,000 miners went on strike in 1993. One subcontractor, Eddie York (who was not a UMW member), decided it was important to support his wife and three children and crossed picket lines to get to his job. He was shot in the head as he left the job site to go home. UMW President Richard Trumka (now Secretary-Treasurer at the AFL-CIO) told The Washington Times that "if you strike a match and put your finger in, common sense tells you you're going to burn your finger." UMW strike captain Jerry Dale Lowe was found guilty of weapons charges and conspiracy in York's death, and York's widow Wanda sued the union for her husband's wrongful death. The UMW fought the lawsuit for four years, but settled with Wanda York only two days after federal prosecutors announced that they would share evidence from the criminal trial with York's attorneys.

Is this what you want?

What I want is a fair paycheck. If some scab gets killed, well thats unfortunate, just like its unfortunate that all those Iranians and Iraqis died in their war, I dont feel that strongly about any job that I would kill over it, but he knew what he was doing, and others are less likely to scab now that they know how strongly some feel about their job and those who would scab.

 

[Jen]

The members vote for steward and AGCs, yet Tony was a Vice President then elevated to AGC.

The members voted them in accordingly.

So maybe you need to address the membership and their democratic right to vote.

Membership votes, plain and simple, they elect their reps.

There is a reason for the FRESH START -INFO TO ALL IAM MEMBERS. Havent seen it? You can check it out on local580.org ! Oh and TWU turned down the companies offer to your concessionary contract and payscale, Because we all deserve more, especially all of you that have only been taken and taken from!
We have the cards in! Can you say Vote TWU? But this is everybody out theres choice. Do what YOU CHOOSE!
Almost a week to get that pathetic piece of S*#T statement from Your UNION?
Better yet..... Didnt sign a card but still would like the oppurtunity? local580.org PRINT IT OFF! Already have enough in to vote!!! But the NMB is still accepting cards for TWU at this time!!! Mail ASAP to
Richard Edelman
1300 L Street,N.W. Suite 1200
Washington D.C. 20005
Its still a free country! TWU believes in YOU having and exercising and keeping these rights! Go TWU!! B) GO IBT!!!! VOTE IBT/TWU

 

[Bob Owens]

Thats pretty funny considering, thats the way TWU works.
There is a reason for the FRESH START -INFO TO ALL IAM MEMBERS. Havent seen it? You can check it out on local580.org ! Oh and TWU turned down the companies offer to your concessionary contract and payscale, Because we all deserve more, especially all of you that have only been taken and taken from!
We have the cards in! Can you say Vote TWU? But this is everybody out theres choice. Do what YOU CHOOSE!
Almost a week to get that pathetic piece of S*#T statement from Your UNION?
Better yet..... Didnt sign a card but still would like the oppurtunity? local580.org PRINT IT OFF! Already have enough in to vote!!! But the NMB is still accepting cards for TWU at this time!!! Mail ASAP to
Richard Edelman
1300 L Street,N.W. Suite 1200
Washington D.C. 20005
Its still a free country! TWU believes in YOU having and exercising and keeping these rights! Go TWU!! B) GO IBT!!!! VOTE IBT/TWU

Thats NOT how it works with the TWU. An AGC is pretty much the equivilent of a TWU International Rep. Internatioanl Reps for the TWU ATD are appointed by the ATD Director who is appointed by the President who is elected at a Convention where the majority of the delegates have taken an oath to support the President, thats why the elections are usually unchallenged and unanimous.

The TWU has been found guilty of violating members rights, is presently being sued for violating members rights and they use COPE money to fight efforts to force unions to disclose how they use members dues.

The only thing worse than the IAM is the TWU.

Did they ever release the names of the TWU officials? Was one of them Roberts and the other McCann? Those two guys are the sons of former TWU officials. I dont think they ever actaully had real jobs but they are supposed to be the saviors of airline workers.

 

[Jen]

Actually "The only thing worse than the IAM"IS THE TWU/IBT AND ALL IAM MEMBERS THAT WANT OUT BEING STUCK WITH THE BS CONCESSIONARY CONTRACTS!

I will go back and edit that just for you!

Regards & BRIGHTER FUTURES!
Vote IBT/TWU!!!

 

[Bob Owens]

Indeed he did and last time I looked it was still against the law to beat or kill someone. See unlike Iran & Iraq we believe that each individual has the right to live his/her life without fear in his home or workplace. Just so you can gain some perspective:
I've found 15 to 20 more of these incidents. It's not 1920 in the coalfields of WV. See Bob I'm a student of history too. First and foremost I believe in individual freedom & Liberty and reject the use of force for economic or political gain. I find the actions of the "Baldwins" in the coal fields just as offensive and wrong as what the IAM did. Freedom & Liberty enables people of like mind and good will to form organizations to advance their common interests. They should not be persecuted in any way for that and neither should those who disagree.

Ok so you found 15 to 20 incidents out of what 15 million union workers? And thats over a period of years. I would say that percentage wise that puts union members as more lawful than Catholic Priests.

You reject the use of force for economic or political gain. Under most circumstances so do I. Then its also safe to say that you are against the use of force in Iraq? After all people have been living there over 5000 years, Tigres Euphrates river valley, the birthplace of civilization, yet because there is oil there we feel we have the right to go over and force them to accept our beliefs and values. To me its hypocrotical to condem a man who kills someone who is threatening his livlyhood while staying silent or supporting the use of deadly force on a much larger scale for similar reasons.

To me scabbing should be against the law, I look at it the same way as when a thief gets shot. Stealing is not generally a capitol offense but I certainly do not feel as bad for a thief as I would if some innocent bystander was shot.