AA's operational performance already suffering?

[WorldTraveler]

As for the argument that US/AA will be back in bankruptcy, if that is the case then probably all of the airlines will have to go back thru BK. The new AA/US will be as strong if not stronger as any of the others and better positioned through immuned joint ventures with more desirable BA-Heathrow and JAL-tokyo. Not to mention dominance in the South American markets...but I'm not saying anything all of the naysayers who would like to see this deal nixed already know.

if you want to rest on the hope that if AA/US fails, then the whole industry will be possible, you might want to take a look in the rearview mirror at PA, TW, and EA among others.
The industry did not go through bankruptcy even when those carriers failed.

If AA cannot turn itself around quickly on its own and either merge successfully with US - in a process that will take an enormous amount of time - or survive as a standalone or with a partner of AA's choosing, then other carriers will pick up the business.

AA is in the position it is in precisely because other carriers moved on and are succeeding and AA did not move on and are not succeeding.

No asset that AA or US has now or could have together is enough to stop the competitive forces that will continue to play out... .whether it is WN and B6 in east coast markets or DL and UA in international markets.

 

[tadjr]

http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2012/09/18/book-away-from-american-this-fall-pilot-feud-has-made-airline-too-unreliable/?mod=yahoo_hs

 

[dfw gen]

So let's see the companies about to fu*k the dog sh*t out of tulsa and they come to the rescue on a field trip. Amazing simply amazing you deserve everything you voted for plus a little extra in the shorts.

 

[dfw gen]

What's the company going to do when there less then 1,000 mechanics in tulsa? Who bales them out then?

 

[johnny kat]

WorldTraveler:

if you want to rest on the hope that if AA/US fails, then the whole industry will be possible, you might want to take a look in the rearview mirror at PA, TW, and EA among others.
The industry did not go through bankruptcy even when those carriers failed.

If AA cannot turn itself around quickly on its own and either merge successfully with US - in a process that will take an enormous amount of time - or survive as a standalone or with a partner of AA's choosing, then other carriers will pick up the business.

AA is in the position it is in precisely because other carriers moved on and are succeeding and AA did not move on and are not succeeding.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________

WT, of course others will pick up the pieces, there will always be an airline industry. Do we want a industry that is always in failing flux or one that is stable and producing decent paying jobs? It would be a travesty to let AA become the lowest paid in the industry with a second trip thru BK (believe me I know, having endured US 2 trips thru). While it may mean bragging rights for airline CEOs' to sit around and talk about who has the lowest labor costs, there is no way it is good for the industry or the employees.

If AA goes thru a second time don't you think that things will be rearranged at some point at the remaining airlines who have already worked so hard to succeed to the point they are today? A restructured AA with 2 trips thru BK under its' belt would surely be the lowest of the low and would certainly make DL and UA have the highest labor costs in the industry, not to mention even WN. And we all know when you have a competitor with that labor cost advantage how it eventually decimates the others.

AA needs US as much as US needs AA in order to keep wages from fallling thru the floor and once again making a mess out of the entire industry. Because next time around it may be DL on the chopping block.

 

[paul1]

And so now a MD-80 full of Tulsa AMT's head to DFW to save the day?

The TWU Local 514 leadership had not the guts to take a stand and fight our own fight, and now they sit on their hands while their membership goes to fight someone else's apparent battle with the company.

I have no idea what is happening with the Out of Service Aircraft, but the Tulsa based AMT's voted 75% yes to not fight, so they need to stay at home and not go make extra pay while fighting the fight that another work group is fighting.

This is not your fight Local 514, tell your members to stay at home and live with the results of the yes vote you advocated and wanted so badly.

To go an profit with overtime from another union man's battle, is not much different than a SCAB, crossing an official picket line of another union group.

what a waste of manpower all those guys need a escort to do there job. I'm sure they don't have dfw airport id's

 

[paul1]

same for fuel tank crews and anybody else that wants to work on are aircraft they need a airport id for that location if they don't they need a escort.

 

[dfw gen]

You know you are required to call dfw dps when you see someone in a restricted area without is

 

[iluvaa]

You know you are required to call dfw dps when you see someone in a restricted area without is

Report anyone that doesn't have a badge it's your duty. I'm so ashamed to be part of Tul

 

[eolesen]

This is not your fight Local 514, tell your members to stay at home and live with the results of the yes vote you advocated and wanted so badly.

To go an profit with overtime from another union man's battle, is not much different than a SCAB, crossing an official picket line of another union group.

So, you're saying this is a union sanctioned restriction of output?....

 

[iluvaa]

Shut it Eric, stop stirring the pot 😉

 

[Barfbag]

except that airlines failed in the regulated era, too.

Even with price and capacity controls, there were airlines that didn't make it.

Bad management survived in the regulated era and they can still survive today. The repercussions of the errors are greater today - and it is harder to hide.....but bad mgmt is timeless.

True bad managers continue to exist, but how can you price a seat when the price doesn't even cover the cost? You're flying at a loss, and you keep it going until you hit a wall, called bankruptcy. Then you abrogate union contracts, screw the creditors in a kangaroo court and start all over again? This you call success? The whole thing ( deregulaion ) is a colossal failure. The entire industry is now McDonalized, with minimum waged no benefit employees. For what purpose but to serve the undeserving, passengers who should be pack packing on Greyhound buses now flying in airline seats for less than what they should be paying.

Since deregulation its been mostly red ink, before it was black ink for most of the industry. Yes LUV has been the consistent profiteer in this debate, but passengers yearn for more services on longer flights. So the LUV formula, works for them not the once legacies like AA.

Again, tell me how is deregulation a success for the airline industry and its employees?

Deregulation washed the pride out of this business plain and simple, and replaced it with shame.

 

[DNTULSA]

True bad managers continue to exist, but how can you price a seat when the price doesn't even cover the cost? You're flying at a loss, and you keep it going until you hit a wall, called bankruptcy. Then you abrogate union contracts, screw the creditors in a kangaroo court and start all over again? This you call success? The whole thing ( deregulaion ) is a colossal failure. The entire industry is now McDonalized, with minimum waged no benefit employees. For what purpose but to serve the undeserving, passengers who should be pack packing on Greyhound buses now flying in airline seats for less than what they should be paying.

Since deregulation its been mostly red ink, before it was black ink for most of the industry. Yes LUV has been the consistent profiteer in this debate, but passengers yearn for more services on longer flights. So the LUV formula, works for them not the once legacies like AA.

Again, tell me how is deregulation a success for the airline industry and its employees?

Deregulation washed the pride out of this business plain and simple, and replaced it with shame.

Deregulation has been a success for the passengers and for the upper echelon of management; no matter how badly they screw up, they still float off on a golden parachute.

That's why so many of them would sell their mothers to a brothel if it would get them a high position in the company.

 

[AC Tynker]

So, you're saying this is a union sanctioned restriction of output?....

What he is trying to say is that he has no idea what is going on out there and that he is an idiot that has no idea to keep all references that he has made in his post to himself because he has to be the person in the conversation that knows everything. He hasn't a clue what he can cause by his Ignorant Arrogance on the net or by running his mouth around the wrong people at work in reference to things he knows nothing about.

If you can not read between the lines Informer by all means print this thread/post and have someone you know explain it to you. For being so smart about everything Union you sure can show your Stupidity! sometimes. Try something new and know when to shutup.

 

[AC Tynker]

I was told on very good authority that DFW has unlimited OT and is under manned to deal with everything going on so Tulsa isn't stepping on anyones OT. If there are yes voters among the field trip AMTs they are doing exactly what they voted to do anyway, to work and make a paycheck and it's their right to do that as per our agreement anyway. The big question is, How many of the AMTs are No voters also wanting to work and make a paycheck