jimntx
Veteran
And, the money is to come from where???? The Executive Bonus Pool? I think not.
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And, the money is to come from where???? The Executive Bonus Pool? I think not.
Garfield1966
Veteran
I would think not. The reserves get their guar pay if they fly 1 hour or 85 so back loading the reserve count for the holidays seems like a free fix.
AC AA LA FA
Veteran
Reserve is a further pay cut for more F/As now finding themselves back on after years..
I have to make further sacrifices to get by now...Its not free, fun, nor fair for f/as.
If you fly 1 hour on reserve, your still siting ready all the rest of the month..waiting for the phone call, or 6am S/B, again...you are "working" and extremely limited to what you can do in a day...
Reserve GAUR is 75 for us domestic folks...
Nor'Easta
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Mikey,
California has some of the best laws to protect employees when they're out ill. California law prohibits employers asking for a doctor's note unless the employee is out at least 7 days. If it's less then 7, they can't ask. If you commute from or live in California, these laws are great! Also, LAX & SFO f/a's have CA SK, which is another great deal. You must be based in LAX or SFO to qualify for CA SK.
So, the letter flight service placed in our mailboxes serves no real purpose to flight attendants who are based or commute from California. The company can try and challenge you but, they will loose in the end.
Garfield1966
Veteran
The CA sk is a crock. One more way for someone to get out of coming to work when they do not feel like it.
AC AA LA FA
Veteran
You paint with and awfully broad stroke Garfield...
It also enables our aging workforce to care for parents, children, and domestic partners while they are ill.
(F/As limited 1/2 accrued SK per year)
If AA expects abuse, as always, they can ask for medical substantiation...
If it wasn't for archaic attendance control policies of greedy corporations, there would be no need for CASK.
I am PROUD of our State Legislature for acknowledging this issue and doing something about it..
Vive la California..!
It also enables our aging workforce to care for parents, children, and domestic partners while they are ill.
(F/As limited 1/2 accrued SK per year)
If AA expects abuse, as always, they can ask for medical substantiation...
If it wasn't for archaic attendance control policies of greedy corporations, there would be no need for CASK.
I am PROUD of our State Legislature for acknowledging this issue and doing something about it..
Vive la California..!
Garfield1966
Veteran
What about the folks who are single? Why not just have PTO days (paid time off) Everyone gets the same. I am so tired of people with kids who get tax deductions , (and yet I help pay for their schools), people who have kids or family to take care of get time off (like it is not abused) and yet I don't. It's not my bloody fault I am healthy as well as my family. If you need time off to take care of someone, it can come out of your PTO. I'll use my for vacation. Once you are out, you can work OT to pay it back if you need more. None of this unpaid sick crap. I fail to see why a company should be forced to keep someone on payroll who does not work.
AC AA LA FA
Veteran
...I cant say I dont agree with you here man....
The landscape of who we are a Americans has changed and so collectively we need an overhaul of the system..
The landscape of who we are a Americans has changed and so collectively we need an overhaul of the system..
The real problem with this thread is people making it an either/or issue. If one ran an experiment with holiday pay versus no holiday pay I believe beyond a reasonable doubt holiday pay would make a difference. If you ran a second experiment sending out warning letters versus no warning letters, I believe beyond a reasonable doubt that would make a difference also. So the question is how much of a difference would each approach make? Or a combo of approaches. It is quite possible to do this as scientists do about treatments for any medical condition. To do it as real scientists do would be possible but you have to control for any variables that might affect the outcome. In the end you can do an Analysis of Variance (ANOVA) which would tell you how much each strategy would affect the outcome. Currently my thought is some but not all f/as feel a sense of entitlement linked to management bonuses. In other words their Corporate loyalty is being tested. Highly loyal employees are more likely to follow company policies on sick leave where less loyal employees just blow off company policy. In the end I'm certain beyond a reasonable doubt that there are some employees who will take Christmas off loyalty, holiday pay, warning letters or harmonious company atmosphere or not. AA may have come to a similar conclusion, that beyond putting a horse's head upon the front porch of abusers, there is not a great deal they can do to control the outcome. Such a deterrent may go over in Sicily but has limited use in Corporate America.
Good God Garfield. A commuter with a bed bound parent. I must be your worst nightmare. Yeah, life isn't fair is it. I'm so lucky that my dad had a massive stroke five years ago, almost died, so I can take advantage of family leaves once in a while to avoid the 200/day nursing home bill (without pay, again yay for being broke at those times when I have no other choice!) and have cask as a back up for emergencies when he needs to be rushed to the hospital. I feel for you for having your health and a healthy family...must be a sad circumstance. Be careful what you wish for.
Believe me, I would trade places with you anytime. I could live 10 minutes from the airport instead of commute 6 hours, work my trips without worry, AND live the life I had before this 2nd job even if I had to pay extra for things I don't use. At times, I'd much rather be flying which is still 90% of my full time schedule. Even so, I've never called in sick for the holidays because I haven't HAD to (even though I COULD without penalty) and rarely do as it is since I can hold bid leaves now and then, and I work a trying schedule so it does work for both myself and those I work with so my issue barely spills over. I still don't openly gripe about it. Target those who abuse it, not those who don't.
Yes, it's abused like any other allowances with a criteria we're given, but that's not the fault of those who use it for what it was originally put in place for. Just because someone uses them doesn't mean it's legitimate, although I would be more than happy to have stricter requirements since I would fall under those too if it eliminates those who abuse it freely. They can video tape it for all I care. My guess is even when the abuse is higher than normal, the ones that don't abuse it far outweigh those who do. We all pay taxes on things we'll never use so life isn't always going to be fair. Too bad I don't have kids and can't use use taxes I pay toward my dog.
Believe me, I would trade places with you anytime. I could live 10 minutes from the airport instead of commute 6 hours, work my trips without worry, AND live the life I had before this 2nd job even if I had to pay extra for things I don't use. At times, I'd much rather be flying which is still 90% of my full time schedule. Even so, I've never called in sick for the holidays because I haven't HAD to (even though I COULD without penalty) and rarely do as it is since I can hold bid leaves now and then, and I work a trying schedule so it does work for both myself and those I work with so my issue barely spills over. I still don't openly gripe about it. Target those who abuse it, not those who don't.
Yes, it's abused like any other allowances with a criteria we're given, but that's not the fault of those who use it for what it was originally put in place for. Just because someone uses them doesn't mean it's legitimate, although I would be more than happy to have stricter requirements since I would fall under those too if it eliminates those who abuse it freely. They can video tape it for all I care. My guess is even when the abuse is higher than normal, the ones that don't abuse it far outweigh those who do. We all pay taxes on things we'll never use so life isn't always going to be fair. Too bad I don't have kids and can't use use taxes I pay toward my dog.
Garfield1966
Veteran
That is not the point I was attempting to make. I am sorry for the hardship you are enduring. And while this may seem heartless, it is not the problem of society. What I mean by that is that you are being given certain allowances due to your family situation. While that may be noble and all, it is not fair to those who are not being given those same allowances. If a job does not fit into a persons life style (what ever that may be) then seek a job that does. You seem to make every effort to show up for work and that is commendable. But I go back the child tax credit example. I do not have children. I do not get that nice $300. I do not have kids but I pay for their education (and yet I do not get a tax break on paying for a service that I do not use). I'm fairly healthy and I would not mind using some of my sick time as vacation time with the option of paying back into it at a later date. I would prefer to have everyone get 'x' days of PTO. You use it as you see fit. In your case to take time off to help your folks, in my case for vacation. If person runs out of PTO, then they need to start paying back into the bank. No such thing as a free ride (no unpaid sick). If you do not start picking up OT or designate x % of your time to back into the back, you are cut from pay roll (unless you are hospitalized or injured to where you cannot work ...etc). I do not feel that you should be entitled to anything different than anyone else due to your situation.
I don't think I'm entitled to something that no one else is entitled to, given the situation just because they're not in it...YET. Just because it was unfortunate for me, that's what we're paying for and that's why we pay for things we may never use. Should this apply to maternity leaves and beyond also? I WISH I could get paid sick for a family member, but I don't. I wish I could paid sick for the bid leaves but I don't. That's not my choice, and at the same time, it's what's allowed ANYONE who would has a very good chance of facing the same situation. I have absolutely no intentions on quiting when it's working for me and isn't burdening my fellow employees. If it does, then I'd be gone in a heartbeat, and for the first year I thought AA would be history. I really don't care if it's this, PTO or whatever it is...I'll just have to accept it. I think it is the point you're making, however, that I have an issue with. This is my job, I enjoy it, I do a good job and I don't use my situation as an excuse to take more than what I'm allowed. When I was single and healthy, I understood what I was paying for even though I never thought I would have to use it (it's called being young and naive). It's like insurance or even medicare. We all pay, even if we may never use it but it's there for all of us. I've never been ill, rarely see a doctor and have never met my primary care physician because I haven't had to. Am I upset because I'm cashing in less than that person that might face a terminal illness? No, because it may happen to me. Or better yet, it may not. I may not be getting that extra 300 tax deductible, but I'm sure that family's paying on me somewhere. I can appreciate tightening down, but it works IMO.
No problem, regarding the aire of insensitivity, I wouldn't expect anything more. I do appreciate your insight though. Some people just don't see why allowances are in place until it happens to them. Now I can appreciate why, in all fairness. There can be changes made to balance it out if it makes someone's skin crawl, but I wouldnt, just because I thought it was so unfair to those who aren't able to take advantage of it. I guess at this point, we have to agree to disagree.
No problem, regarding the aire of insensitivity, I wouldn't expect anything more.
I do appreciate your insight though. Some people just don't see why allowances are in place until it happens to them. Now I can appreciate why, in all fairness. There can be changes made to balance it out if it makes someone's skin crawl, but I wouldnt, just because I thought it was so unfair to those who aren't able to take advantage of it. I guess at this point, we have to agree to disagree.
Nor'Easta
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Seems Garfield "AA Manangement" 1966 is jealous of the California laws. The laws in California that protect workers are the best in the nation. S*cks you live in DAAllas!
SkyhighSteve
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While I am hesitant to say that incentive programs don't work....because I do believe they do get some people not to call in sick. To say people are wrong to use it as unannounced day off with pay is wrong as well. If the Company sees it as a benefit ( and they clearly do because they cut sick accrual in the restructuring.) Then we have a right to look at sick time as nothing more than part of the overall benefit package. And yes, use it accordingly.
[quote name='Nor'Easta' post='556427' date='Dec 28 2007, 06:50 PM']Seems Garfield "AA Manangement" 1966 is jealous of the California laws. The laws in California that protect workers are the best in the nation. S*cks you live in DAAllas![/quote]
[quote name='Nor'Easta' post='556427' date='Dec 28 2007, 06:50 PM']Seems Garfield "AA Manangement" 1966 is jealous of the California laws. The laws in California that protect workers are the best in the nation. S*cks you live in DAAllas![/quote]
