Fleet Service topic IAM 141

[Dissent Equals Patriotism]

One more thing....

I would like to know from the "IAM $100k Club" that troll this forum. What they will receive if this T/A is approved? What percentage pay raise or bonus will you receive? From what I was told it is reprehensible!

There needs to be a full disclosure on this!


Jesus was sold out for 30 pieces of silver; I would like to know how much we were sold out for?

Fight the Future!

Agent "V"

 

[LuggageJockey]

The reason why mechanics got more back is they gave up a lot more in the final offer during chapter 11 than the ramp did.

Ok.

I'm saying that the company can afford to give us back more than the past two t/a's we've seen (Sept. & Now)

 

[LGA777]

I have a question about double time on the TA. In the good olde days East Fleet Service could earn double time in two basic ways (not counting holidays). It was paid if you worked at least 4 hours OT on your first day off (6th day) for any overtime hours worked on your second day off (7th day). The other was on a regular workday lets say you shift is and you work 0500-1330. You are awarded overtime for the second shift, you earned the first 4 hours at time and a half and after that it was double time for the rest of the shift.

On the TA I see the 7th day part, but I don't see the second part, where if you double on a regular work day you get 4 and 4. Did I misinterpet something and this is being offered on the TA or is it just the first part but not the second?

Thanks in advance for clearing this is up for me. Best of luck to all of us dedicated men and women in Fleet Service !

LGA777

 

[NevadaHP]

ok, there are some benies gained and some lost from the last T/A, however you look at it it is COST NEUTRAL, at best from the las T/A. However this membership on the west has been beaten down severly and I believe in the hubs wont wait any longer sad to say. My only problem with the T/A is the outsourcing.

There are alot of posters now active and thats great we need people to be active and I hope this voter turnout is large.

Some people have said that the New Direction wants this to fail. I believe that they want the best for the entire workforce. I believe there will be an update on their website stating their opinion on this matter shortly. However just because someone supports the new direction doesnt mean thats the new directions stance. I hope the new direction does update their website so we get an official word from the CANDIDATES themselves.

 

[robbedagain]

Dissents excellent post
I believe that this T/A was just thrown together simple fact is that may be Dougie and Crooks got a buy out of another airline--UA---- or merger. If I were voting due to the outsourcing and 60 day rule and even the sick, I would turn it down in a heartbeat. There should never been the stupid crappy 60 day rule and the sick is defintely in ICU plus I think Profit sharing should stay just look at other labor groups who have it

 

[isthisok]

Here's the offical response from the new direcion team to the TA I posted it before

ND08 OFFICIAL RESPONSE

Weren't you sent to the cornfield earlier. You could have come up with a better name. I see you waited a while to re-register. Busted!

 

[Rock Bottom]

Agent "V" is correct the time for passive resitance is over.

We need to stop the fighting amoug ourselves, east coast, west coast, old peidmont, old us air, old PSA, old America West. We need to become one voice!
The chairmen are not the IAM, we are! It's time we take back what is ours! To do this we must unite under one banner. We are all Brother's and Sister's! The company and the heads of the IAM have turned us against each other. We must fight to save our familes jobs!

And say with one voice We're Mad As Hell and We're Not Going To Take It Anymore!!!

As Agent "V" stated Grab your pickforks and torches it time to take back what is ours.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Greetings to all, Im back from the Local Chairman's gathering. I have to get my taxes in but I'll say a few notes about the TA now.
Hemenway and Canale Bit** Slapped and disrespected fleet with this contract that I will tag the "Wal Mart" Contract. it is far far worse than the one offered in September. It is very safe to say that this will be Canale's last Bit## Slap of Fleet service, ever. He's got like 40 something days left.

The Double time article was further depleted in this contract with a big concession. The holiday article was depleted with another big concession. Amazingly, Canale and hemenway are saying these were gains even though the language is convincing otherwise. We will put out the facts on these further concessions so that everyone can make an 'informed consent'. We will also be putting out the plan for what to do after a rejection.

Also, the west got 'hammered' even more in the scope language as the insourcing was totally eliminated.

Other than that, eliminate shift differ, eliminate pension increase, add a 6 month window for 60 day rule, and change 150 sick days to 100.

It officially sux and I'm shocked it didn't even have the 5th week of vacation.

Also, pay no attention to Canale's lie about the company will not come back to the table. He has lied each time there has been a contract out. Last September, Boss Canale ran his mouth saying your choice will be between this contract or waiting till 2009. I told workers Canale was a liar and that Hemenway needed this contract and would be forced to come back. he did. Nothing has changed, mergers are in the wind, and Hemenway will be forced to try to clean his act up or lose his job once this contract is voted out.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[robbedagain]

Tim i dont know if you noticed in the t/a that 60 day rule appears to be different for the West than East and Im wondering if this contract is truly geared more for the West than the East? Also correct me if im wrong but it looks as though the sick goes to 3 days at 50% im not 100% sure on that but overall the TA sucks and it is what I call Walmart style sh!t

 

[freedom]

This is my reply to V , i'm in italics .


Ok, here is my take on the T/A and the reasons why I am voting NO.

First let me say, I believe Canale and his “Cabalâ€￾ have sold us out! When Canale does and “end runâ€￾ around our elected negotiating committee and negotiates this T/A behind closed doors management to management, it should raise an alarm! Let alone the neutralizing two negotiating members to put a positive spin on the agreement. When IAM members were not allowed into that meeting because they had a dissenting opinion; that is not an open democratic process it is treachery! We should be grabbing the torches and pitchforks and head to Castle IAM and rid ourselves of these Ass Clowns!

If you believe that there is corruption within the leadership of the IAM you should contact the government and not this message board . Of course thou you must realize that it takes two to tango and while you may think canale is corrupt , I doubt the 150K vp who’s conducting talks for the company feels like colluding with some union dude for what reason ?unless of course you believe it’s the COMPANY bribing our union leaders ? In which case everyone is corrupt !!!!! Oh no corruption everywhere!!! Nooooooo!!

This T/A is tainted and not worth the paper it’s printed on.

I think the TA is a hell of a lot better than nothing .

Next, what type of union negotiates a contract that will lose jobs? I guess it’s the IAM!

I don’t know , perhaps it has something to do with the weakening economy ? Perhaps it might be lingering after affects from 911 ? Hmm I forget , but haven’t a lot of the OTHER unions ALSO lost jobs ? Maybe I’ve been sleeping and this is the new golden era of the aviation industry and unions in general , OR MAYBE , unions and companies are struggling just to survive , aloha , ATA , skybus , and welcome to the party frontier !

We need to ask ourselves why does the company want the ability to contract out those 19 cities and why they want to keep sixty day rule? I believe when we merge there will be huge layoffs! Not only will those small cities be wiped out, the hubs will take a hit also. Do you think a newly merged company will operate 6 hubs? I am in East hub, but there is no way I am going to sell out those small stations! I wouldn’t be able to live with myself. So make sure to tell your families, your raise only cost the jobs of 1200 employees and the wellbeing of their families.

They want to contract out to save money , the sixity day rule appears eliminated if I read the TA right . Yes there WILL be huge layoffs if there’s a merger . Your in the east ? Wow I’m in the west and these are OUR field stations and we in the west are in favor of this TA , what could that say ? I’ll tell you what , I’d rather tell my family that daddy had to close down a field station than daddy just lost the house we’re living in and it’s time to move .

The CIC is not worthless. I would say it’s even more viable now than ever. We are the only work group that still has it and the company wants! Why, an upcoming merger? But I am willing to trade it for job protection and a fair contract.

If this company thought the COC was truly worth something as so many of you think then they would have offered MORE , they would have offered MORE last time they gave us a TA (right before the court ruling ) and there would have been some increase THIS time when we now have ANOTHER TA …


Parker and his crew and the CEO of whatever airline we merge with are personally going to make tens of millions from a merger. Do you think they are going to forgo that money because they are unwilling to give us a fair industry standard contract? Would you?

What does parker and the money he makes have anything to do with us ? Their going to merge regardless of if we like it or not , they think the CIC is worthless , I’m sure most do by now . Don’t worry thou , the corporate worlds of the aviation industry will stop all mergers because the ground crews oppose them .

I understand completely about the condition of the economy! The dollar is worthless and it’s only the illusion of its worth that keeps everything moving. Once the illusion is exposed, it is game over for our country and it won’t matter what contract we have. But until then I am going to keep making it, spending it and fighting for it!

This is by far your most frightening statement , your effectively saying , I’m doing OK so everyone else can screw off in poverty . With the economy crashing who looks money in the eye and says “nah don’t need it “ so many of us brothers and sisters can barely make ends meet as it is , and we’re going to follow advice from those who aren’t taking the necessary steps to guard against the future ?

Fight the Future!
Agent “Vâ€￾

Take necessary steps to ensure your own future

Freedom

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim i dont know if you noticed in the t/a that 60 day rule appears to be different for the West than East and Im wondering if this contract is truly geared more for the West than the East? Also correct me if im wrong but it looks as though the sick goes to 3 days at 50% im not 100% sure on that but overall the TA sucks and it is what I call Walmart style sh!t

This contract is geared towards Hemenway and the UA merger. It's neither geared towards the west or east. It hoses the west more than September, and hoses the east more than September. Hemenway has beat down the west so bad that he is fixing to walk on their backs if they finally bow down. I think he's convinced of this.
The east will vote No because "No means No." It will be interesting to see how the vote goes. Will the masses bail off the horse as it comes to the front stretch or will the masses hold their swords high as it comes to the finish line in its fight against Hemenway/Canale.

One thing is clear, everone knows this contract sux.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[Kev3188]

Wow I’m in the west and these are OUR field stations and we in the west are in favor of this TA , what could that say ?

It says there are a lot of myopic people in PHX.

 

[freedom]

{so on and so forth }

"No means No."



One thing is clear, everone knows this contract sux.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

This contract provides raises to the majority of our workers .

You mention home stretch ? You mean home stretch of the new 100k club don’t you ? Where is this OUR home stretch ? What you would demand from this company is SO unreasonable that we would have to wait until 2010 to strike , by which time we can ALL forget that idea as I’m sure the unemployment rate will be very high , and I’m not afraid to tell this to you now brothers , I WILL NOT SUPPORT A STRIKE In 2010 if the economy is in bad shape .

You were wrong about the COC tim , and now your going to chance the economic futures of the majority of our workers? Where’s your truck with that shiny new hitch eh ? Don’t gamble with the futures of poor people tim . :down:

 

[Tim Nelson]

A note: Canale just signed a letter of agreement [see IAM website] boosting UA's pay another 1% this May 1st.
Odd how Canale puts out his letter how we can't get squat because oil is at 52% more, BUT he can get United to increase the salaries [even when it doesn't have to] of the UA rampers with an additional 1% raise just negotiated. United rampers will now go to a top out of $20.61 instead of $20.43.

Remember, Continental also is operating in this industry where oil surged 52% since September and just announced a 2% pay increase to $20.45.

Don't be misled with Canale's deceit. Hemenway is expecing his big fat 200% bonus for next year [see 8k filing], the mechanics got much more back including no layoff guarantee, other airlines are moving forward with pay raises. Yet this new TA guarantees fleet service workers to be $1.50 below even non-union Continental.

Of course, vacation weeks are about 6 weeks at many carriers. Continental only has 5 weeks but that's one more than this lame contract.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[freedom]

Freedom...
Just read your long winded post. your analogy about your dying family in the desert and your gonna do anything to save them is fine, but your leaving out your 1200 cousins who are gonna die now.
Henderfuzz...
Glad to see DFW wasn't on the list of axed stations come Dec. 31, 2011... it must make your vote that much more easier to make.

Listen I am not picking on you two, but rather, making an example. It doesn't matter how you vote, but to sit on this mssg board and validate yourself and glorify this T.A. is something that you don't have to do. Yes we ALL need a raise, all 7700 of us!! It has to come at the expense of 1200 jobs unfortunately, if voted in. I guess the only saving grace is that at least people like myself will have the next 3 years to make up my mind on where to transfer to keep my job if I so value it. 3 years is plenty of time to transfer to save my job, and it means coming into one of the stations that you work in, like PHX or DFW, and bumping you down on the list. I have no problem with that, and it also opens the doors to all the East guys and gals who have wanted to take a run West of the Mighty Miss, so that cushy shift you enjoy now, will become Tues/Wed off on PM shift within the not too distant future...but hey you are getting that raise, so go for it.

bag chucker , believe me when I say I’d rather not close down your station , in fact if I recall correctly you’ve already been displaced once before , must be an awful thing , and if your where I recall your at , it’s a hell of a lot better than being in AZ . However , you know the kind of wages we make here in the west , and you also know how hard a bargaining agent this company is . Doug parker and crew are ALL about cost savings , about keeping wages low and competitive , a lot of these east guys just think that their own union negotiators are selling them out , when in fact the reality is their dealing with a VERY stingy company . The truth of the matter my brother , is if we don’t get this voted in , none of us are going to see wage increases for a LONG LONG time , that new direction team , their hardliners , they think their going to walk into the board room and this companies just going to bend over , HA what a surprise their in for … and as it takes them months , turning into years to understand what kind of company we’re dealing with , we on the very bottom rung will languish .

I’m not trying to validate myself brother nor glorify the TA, I just want to make sure the east guys understand things for what they truly are out here … There’s so much hype and half truths surrounding all of this , corruption , CHANGE OF CONTROL being worth something etc , I just don’t want to see people get lost and confused by it all .

p.s hey if I can make an honest and decent wage I have no problem working M/T pm .