Grassroots Efforts at DL for ACS and FAs, no personal attacks.

[southwind]

Only posting here currently what Delta FA's are saying:

"You don't "lose" it to taxes. If you are not put into a higher tax bracket you will get it back. It is taxed at a higher rate because it is considered windfall. At the end of the day you should see most of that back. More importantly is the savings to company and potential losses to us because of it. Let me explain:
1) DL takes this money in the 4th quarter and posts it as a cost thereby lowering their profit and their tax burden.
2) In Feb. the profits of the previous year are lower because of the "loss" of paying out in Oct. Thereby reducing your Feb. balance check while DL still recognizes the tax break that they took in the 4th quarter of 2014.

Effing brilliant boys. And you get the minions to see this as a benefit to boot. If you get some "no" votes out of it then even more gravy. Wow. And we feel respected for this?"




"XXXXX answered the rationale for giving us this check early. It is a tax hedge for the company. Additionally, they may be able to save themselves from having to pay us the higher percentage (20% instead of 10%) if they miss hitting the next target. Read about the formula for profit sharing."




"EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!
This is what we need to all focus on.
The company isn't giving us anything *extra*...they're just giving us a portion *early*.
This isn't because they're *nice* or because they *care about us*, it's because it's what's best for them and the shareholders! Bottom line! They only ever do stuff because it benefits them and the shareholders.....EVER!
And, by doing this, at this strategic moment, we are getting less in profit sharing in February. Don't fall for it; this isn't extra money to buy Xmas presents, or pay down your credit cards. Please remember this when mgmt and the no-wayers try to spin this. Go back and read XXXXX's comment above. It's a clear, concise explanation of what the company is doing, and how it benefits them, and how it screws us."
 

 
And some people will never be happy..........so what's new?

 

[WeAAsles]

 
And some people will never be happy..........so what's new?

Guess you didn't get the invite to the party either? Aw shucks.

 

[topDawg]

The internet has made it very easy for people to pontificate on subjects they know nothing about.  The flight attendant posting the bolded part above is hopelessly ignorant of the basics of accrual accounting, tax law and the DL profit sharing scheme.
 
I'm no apologist for Delta or Richard Anderson - it's obvious that DL is paying out the first half 2014 profit sharing early to help sway any unionization vote, but DL isn't doing it for the fabricated nonsensical reasons listed by the flight attendant above.   

Word. If your going to fight against the company at lease know wtf your talking about. 
 

IIRC, both sides were relatively similarly-sized (certainly as compared to AW)... ATL is such an outlier size-wise that any comparison will be skewed, though.



Truth.
 


 

Real talk!

Thaks kev. 
 

except, commavia, DL has managed to run a far more stable and profitable business than any other airline = and Wall St. has rewarded DL with the highest market cap and far more investor confidence than AA.
er. Southwest says horse poop. 
The simple fact is that DL employees are being better compensated because they work for a MORE successful company that isn't taking away crew rest seats in order to give them profit sharing.
Still talking about that TA you haven't seen yet eh?
And all of this glee that DL is being kicked out of DAL avoids the reality which WILL be shown that the opening of DAL will have a far larger effect on AA at DFW than anyone here has been willing to admit.
not really. Southwest can't really compete in Dallas just like they couldn't really compete in Atlanta. AA is far to large and has to much mainline in major markets. 
AA is living in the honeymoon phase of the merger and they are going to wake up in a couple weeks and realize that there are wolves at the door and their bed partners is flat out ugly.
Their partner isn't ugly at all. US gives AA a Europe network with a true hub in the NE. Gives them the second best hub in the south east. 
and most importantly gives them a management team that is less worried about pissing contests and more worried about making money. I think the best thing that could have happened to is merge with someone like US. AA had a serous management problem. They have one of the best CEOs in the industry now. 

DL employees succeed and will continue to do so based on strong and improving fundamentals in the business - and because DL mgmt. is quite frankly charting a smarter path to the success of all at DL. any of that in writing? 
 
nope. 

 
 

I don't care what stations PM-NW brought online, all that matters to me is my home airport is a mainline station for DL which it is and always has been. How much longer was that list of NW stations before the bankruptcy and NWA stations got replaced with ZW (while the IAM still collected dues)?

Josh

 
good post. Thanks for the add to the topic. 

Is MHT still DGS both AW & BW? Been about 18 months since I was there.

Josh

its not M/L
 

Only posting here currently what Delta FA's are saying:

"You don't "lose" it to taxes. If you are not put into a higher tax bracket you will get it back. It is taxed at a higher rate because it is considered windfall. At the end of the day you should see most of that back. More importantly is the savings to company and potential losses to us because of it. Let me explain:
1) DL takes this money in the 4th quarter and posts it as a cost thereby lowering their profit and their tax burden.
2) In Feb. the profits of the previous year are lower because of the "loss" of paying out in Oct. Thereby reducing your Feb. balance check while DL still recognizes the tax break that they took in the 4th quarter of 2014.

Effing brilliant boys. And you get the minions to see this as a benefit to boot. If you get some "no" votes out of it then even more gravy. Wow. And we feel respected for this?"




"XXXXX answered the rationale for giving us this check early. It is a tax hedge for the company. Additionally, they may be able to save themselves from having to pay us the higher percentage (20% instead of 10%) if they miss hitting the next target. Read about the formula for profit sharing."




"EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!
This is what we need to all focus on.
The company isn't giving us anything *extra*...they're just giving us a portion *early*.
This isn't because they're *nice* or because they *care about us*, it's because it's what's best for them and the shareholders! Bottom line! They only ever do stuff because it benefits them and the shareholders.....EVER!
And, by doing this, at this strategic moment, we are getting less in profit sharing in February. Don't fall for it; this isn't extra money to buy Xmas presents, or pay down your credit cards. Please remember this when mgmt and the no-wayers try to spin this. Go back and read XXXXX's comment above. It's a clear, concise explanation of what the company is doing, and how it benefits them, and how it screws us."
 

Oh Jesus. The stupid. it hurts. 

 

[737823]

Guess you didn't get the invite to the party either? Aw shucks.

Actually WCDFA regularly bans people who share viewpoints the moderators/administrators don't approve and doesn't suit their agenda. Same with Blue Notes Organizing page among other AA labor groups as well. No Way AFA (should be renamed to reflect ongoing IAM drive) tolerates alternative points of view.

Josh

 

[topDawg]

 
And some people will never be happy..........so what's new?

And then this side of the argument. 
 
Saying they wont be happy does nothing. The majority voters, yes or no, a lead by a small minority that, for the most part, tosses crap against a wall to see what sticks. The amount of complete horse crap I have seen from the IAM along with the complete horse crap I have seen from Delta is part of the problem here. 
 
That post is not any worse than you jumping in screaming UNION DUES! or WT screaming about profit sharing. 

 

[WeAAsles]

Actually WCDFA regularly bans people who share viewpoints the moderators/administrators don't approve and doesn't suit their agenda. Same with Blue Notes Organizing page among other AA labor groups as well. No Way AFA (should be renamed to reflect ongoing IAM drive) tolerates alternative points of view.

Josh

If they leave on that guy Bob Baker than they'll leave on anybody. And did you see my wonderful conversation with Miss Bennette as well? They didnt' kick her off for her anti union views. And there are others as well. So I'm not seeing that on WCDFA. As for BNO since you posted both pages I have heard that they don't tolerate anti views. Although I haven't participated yet to make that determination? I do hope that's not true because a mutual admiration society doesn't help to gain converts.

Now on the group page I admin on I do remove people who are only there to agitate and not add to a debate. Those people who are only there to propel whatever agenda they have without keeping an open mind to conversation, can find other places to go.     

 

[Kev3188]

Yes.

Josh

You sure?
 
 

I like this thread:
 

DID YOU KNOW?----------------------------------------------------------
1.) Union dues are payroll deducted just once a month, not twice!
2.) That those union dues are tax deductable when you file!
3.) That unionized Flight Attendants’ sick calls and other occurrences usually only stay on their record for 9 months!
4.) That at our company, it can be any length... 9, 12 months or up to 3 years!
5.) That with a union, you have a right to bring in a union rep. anytime you are called in!
6.) That no Manager cares if you do bring in that union rep! ( It’s common practice.)
7.) That the towers of anti-union flyers you see in the Inflight lounges would be replaced with union boards full of information and contact numbers!
8.) Do you know that our Pilots and the Pilots AND Flight Attendants at every unionized airline have something called “SCOPE!
9.) Did you know that “SCOPE” legally forbids your employer from outsourcing you!
10.) That with a union and contract that your airline can still give you a raise!
11.) That all large airlines have that special day in initial training where you watch a slide show with moving music and photos of airplanes taking off and landing! ( Flight Attendants at the other airlines also love their companies! )
12.) Did you know that Wal-mart also tells their employees that a union would ruin their special culture!
13.) That our Pilots settled their last union contract negotiations in just months!
14.) That even if it did take awhile to negotiate a contract, that many times “retro” pay comes in to play. Imagine getting a contract along with a big check!
15.) That when negotiating a contract, the union will look at what other unionized groups at your airline are getting along with what other Flight Attendants at other unionized airlines get. If the airline will not negotiate in good faith, then an Arbitration Judge is brought in!
16.) That our Pilots get 270 hours of sick time a year because of their union contract. You get 49!
17.) That with a union you can still love your company and job!
18.) That with a union you will have a Professional Standards Committee where you can voice a concern to a co-worker….without the company being able to know about it!
19.) That with a union there will be a Safety Committee that looks at things such as cart safety, carriers, galleys, etc! ( You would have a say…)
20.)That CEOs do not have to take care of you! ( Who will be our next CEO? )
21.) That we all like the A-day system and just want to make improvements on it… such as pay, and a limit to how many years one could be with 6 A-days! ( that is just not right! )
22.) That you CAN sign a card while on probation!
23.) That with a union if you get hurt on the job, you will be protected by your union!
24.) That at NWA we got COMPLETE uniform replacements every 2 years! ( For me that was 2 blazers, 4 pants, 6 shirts and ties! )
25.) That you can stop in a see your Manager anytime as a unionized F/A!
26.) That your company can NOT see, know or ask if you signed a card!
27.) That when the election is called. That you will start receiving huge glossy mailings from your company trying hard to confuse you on the subject of unionizing!
28.) You will probably NEVER have to deal with anyone from your Master union. You will not be required to attend any union meeting.
29.) That you can NOT have a witness or Lawyer with you if you are called-in on anything without a union!
30.) That “AT-WILL” means that your employment is at the will of your employer!
31.) That bad employees can be fired with a union. ( just takes longer )
32.) That as a good employee it would be very hard to be fired with a union behind you!
33.) That the union called the AFA was the force that got smoking off commercial flights!
34.) That the I AM represented Continental Flight Attendants and had the highest pay. Yes, they merged with United and voted in United’s AFA….because there were more United F/As than there were Continental F/As. ( People fear change…sound familiar? )
35.) That the I A M is the union we are trying to get in!
36.) That on our level….WE…… you, me and all the Flight Attendants here would be the union!
37.) That by law with a union our employer has to negotiate with us in regard to pay and work rules!
38.) That even with a union you do not have to wear your union pin or display a bag tag! (Your participation is up to you! )
39.) That Marin Luther King, Jr. was Pro- Union!
40.) That you will love the camaraderie a union brings!
41.) That non-union workers earn less in pay and benefits than their unionized counter-parts!
42.) That your employer knows the above and is desperately trying to keep it out for that reason and that reason ONLY!
43.) That we lost our last election by just 100 and something swing votes.
44.) That many who voted against unionization in that last election now regret it!
45.) That with a union WE as a group get to take surveys and then vote on what WE would like in OUR contract! ( Just like OUR Pilots got to do! )
46.) And OUR Pilots seem to love the company too….and they are unionized!
47.) That our probation period for new hires is in place to mimic other unionized companies. The difference is that at those other companies after probation they become permanent employees via their contracts!
48.) Did you know that XXXXXXXX is famous and a very nice person!
49.) Did you know that as an airline worker you fall under the Railway Labor Act and are suppose to have a union!
50.) With a union you have the right to see your file at anytime!

Amen.

Specifically to #50, why people at the Widget don't find the whole "electronic journaling" creepy is beyond me. For it being a supposed "direct relationship," there sure isn't a whole lot of transparency.
 
 

WeAA-
Again why are you reposting content from FB? This is a forum not an RSS feed, numerous posters here are engaged with those discussions on FB not sure what you think you are adding by cross posting it here.

Who cares? Why are you against the sharing of information?
 
 

The reality here is simple. Us PRO UNION people are wasting our time here on AF Delta and especially in this thread. I look down and am not sure that I have EVER seen more than 5 people reading here at a time? The ACTION is over on Facebook. This site is merely a diversion from getting into the thick of it where people hang out. This is like that neighborhood old man bar that no women ever come into because it smells of stale beer.

This has been covered before. Some on here want to believe that this site is a barometer of the mood at DL. It's not. It's a fun place to kibbutz, but that's about it.

Hey Kev, the Delta FA Pro page is humming and I also joined the Pro Fleet page as well. It looks like most of the momentum right now is with the FA's. I believe once that turns from red to green, your guys will start to hum as well. It's only a matter of time and inevitable.

Both have decent traffic coming & going. It's nice to see the push-pull that each campaign is having with the other. 🙂


 
 

Actually WCDFA regularly bans people who share viewpoints the moderators/administrators don't approve and doesn't suit their agenda. Same with Blue Notes Organizing page among other AA labor groups as well. No Way AFA (should be renamed to reflect ongoing IAM drive) tolerates alternative points of view.

Josh

This is patently false.

In fact, it takes quite a lot to get the boot from that site. If you are banned, you either spammed the page, made homophobic comments, or repeatedly tried to post swaps.

OTOH, NoWay doesn,t have to kick a whole lot of people off 'cause they never let them join in the first place.

 

[737823]

Well you'd have to address that with the admins on the respective groups but my personal experience has been different. Much like I have come to the realization that bigots on the left hide and denounce their bigotry, bigots on the right at least make their bigotry well known to all and it's no different here. The DL groups (along with AA CWA) are full of retirees, family members and people not actively employed by the carrier who will not be participating in any possible election.

Josh

 

[Kev3188]

...I'm no apologist for Delta or Richard Anderson - it's obvious that DL is paying out the first half 2014 profit sharing early to help sway any unionization vote...

Bingo.

How better to distract people than throw some cash at them? Oh, and while everyone's dazzled with money they would've gotten in Feb. anyway, the company quietly announced an elimination of an HRA plan, to be replaced with an HSA option. I'm no finance whiz, but even I know that could very well mean a massive savings for DL, and an massive shift of costs onto employees...

 

[Kev3188]

Well you'd have to address that with the admins on the respective groups but my personal experience has been different. Much like I have come to the realization that bigots on the left hide and denounce their bigotry, bigots on the right at least make their bigotry well known to all and it's no different here. The DL groups (along with AA CWA) are full of retirees, family members and people not actively employed by the carrier who will participate in any possible election.

Josh

Great. Why don't you tell us why you were banned so we can judge for ourselves? Oh wait, didn't you say you were an "active member" on there?

What's with the blitzkrieg of white noise today, anyway?


BTW, which of these supposed outside groups/bigots you mentioned do you identify with?

 

[WeAAsles]

Bingo.How better to distract people than throw some cash at them? Oh, and while everyone's dazzled with money they would've gotten in Feb. anyway, the company quietly announced an elimination of an HRA plan, to be replaced with an HSA option. I'm no finance whiz, but even I know that could very well mean a massive savings for DL, and an massive shift of costs onto employees...

Remember Crandal famously stating how he removed some olives in onboard salads and saved a Million a year. During AA'S lean years I noticed alot less Pistachios in the roasted nuts. Never heard that announced.

Seems to me that maybe Delta is removing a few pistachios from your healthcare plans Kev.

 

[737823]

I don't identify with any extremist or bigoted groups. I'm referring to homophobic, racist, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian, anti-Muslim, etc activists that cover up their true feelings by saying "we aren't critical of Jews, we are just very critical of the actions of Israeli government and it's right to exist". Or "I am not homophobic, I just don't approve of their lifestyle [labeled by some as a choice] and want nothing to do with them".

Are you a moderator or administrator on any of those groups? Yes I been disciplined for sharing my feelings and preference to be unorganized.

Josh

 

[Kev3188]

Nope. WCDFA is a one-man band. There is no shortage of anti-worker posts on that site, so to be banned really takes some doing. What specifically did the admin cite as the reason?

...Or are you really just making this all up to divert the thrust of the conversation?

 

[Kev3188]

Remember Crandal famously stating how he removed some olives in onboard salads and saved a Million a year. During AA'S lean years I noticed alot less Pistachios in the roasted nuts. Never heard that announced.

Seems to me that maybe Delta is removing a few pistachios from your healthcare plans Kev.

Some people are going to be in for a seriously rude awakening come Open Enrollment time... It'd be interesting to see how much cost is ultimately shifted from the company to the workers, but I doubt that info will ever see the light of day...

Keeping up appearances and all that, ya know...

 

[737823]

Not making anything up. And again I am not anti-worker I am anti-union, you have acknowledged there is a distinction.

Josh