Grassroots Efforts at DL for ACS and FAs, no personal attacks.

[Kev3188]

Not making anything up.

Then you'll have no problem citing what specifically got you thrown off of WCDFA; a site that almost goes out of it's way not to kick people off.

 

And again I am not anti-worker I am anti-union, you have acknowledged there is a distinction.

Josh

There is. IMO, you're both.

 

[737823]

You know full well an admin/moderator on one of those groups can make an arbitrary judgement and label content as flamebait or abusive leaving me no recourse.

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

Yes I been disciplined for sharing my feelings and preference to be unorganized.

Josh

Are there many bankers out there who hang around Airline worker sites like here and Facebook who are worried about an organizing drive? Are airline workers a fascination or an obsession for you OR are you actually really one of us?

 

[WeAAsles]

You know full well an admin/moderator on one of those groups can make an arbitrary judgement and label content as flamebait or abusive leaving me no recourse.

Josh

Why does a Banker care what goes on among Airline workers rather than what is going on in his own industry? 

Do you also frequent social media sites that have to do with the banking industry and your issues within that field of employ?

Could you please answer the question Mr Kramer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqZ2hWWbVFk

 

[737823]

Ask BLUTO or roabilly, I've answered that plenty.

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

dawg,
plz quote OUTSIDE Of someone else's quote if you want to maintain a dialogue.

There is no doubt that AA had a serious mgmt. problem; you got that right. but US succeeded as much as it did based on Parker's amazing ability to dazzle his labor while paying them far less than their peers.

US simply could not support the network it has if it had to pay labor rates.

There are plenty of people like FWAAA who has long agreed with me on that point and it is because the data is available to show it. US' int'l network was heavily dependent on low fare flow traffic and by undercutting competition.

They cannot do that any longer because labor costs are going up and because AA's network is large enough that DL and UA can undercut AA if they use that kind of strategy any longer.

It is far from apparent how much of AA's network is sustainable at current and future labor rates (based on CBAs) and current levels of revenue generation.

 

Well Joshie there is a particular individual here under the erroneous impression that Delta employees are all happy go lucky, singing in the rain and skipping through the park over the idea that they are well taken care of at that company. My point is merely to try and get that individual to see the light of day and de-cult him. (Not possible I'm sure)

The reality here is simple. Us PRO UNION people are wasting our time here on AF Delta and especially in this thread. I look down and am not sure that I have EVER seen more than 5 people reading here at a time? The ACTION is over on Facebook. This site is merely a diversion from getting into the thick of it where people hang out. This is like that neighborhood old man bar that no women ever come into because it smells of stale beer.

Hey Kev, the Delta FA Pro page is humming and I also joined the Pro Fleet page as well. It looks like most of the momentum right now is with the FA's. I believe once that turns from red to green, your guys will start to hum as well. It's only a matter of time and inevitable. 

I suggest the few of us who comment on here get out of this bar and join the party over at FB. They're calling and they're very nice and fun to hang around with.

WRONG.
no one said that all of ANY group of people are happy.

but they aren't stupid and won't CUT their pay in order to get a union.

you can click your heels all you want about how great the CBA is but the simple fact is that AA's CBAs don't come anywhere close to fully valuing the profit sharing program at DL.

And because of that, AA employees will be underpaid relative to DL employees.  
 

The internet has made it very easy for people to pontificate on subjects they know nothing about.  The flight attendant posting the bolded part above is hopelessly ignorant of the basics of accrual accounting, tax law and the DL profit sharing scheme.
 
I'm no apologist for Delta or Richard Anderson - it's obvious that DL is paying out the first half 2014 profit sharing early to help sway any unionization vote, but DL isn't doing it for the fabricated nonsensical reasons listed by the flight attendant above.

 
+717

and perhaps the bigger reason is that 2 medium sized bumps in pay (one check could still be worth 3-4 weeks of additional pay) provide a bigger emotional hit than one gigantic check.

and it is possible that there are people who will benefit from pushing some of their profit sharing into 2014 instead of 2015.  

and some people may be able to put more money into their 401K with the profit sharing payout this week.

Paying out early has no financial impact for DL but it absolutely could help some employees. At the minimum it won't hurt them if their remaining check in Feb 2015 is equal to the size they got in Feb 2014.

 

Bingo.

How better to distract people than throw some cash at them? Oh, and while everyone's dazzled with money they would've gotten in Feb. anyway, the company quietly announced an elimination of an HRA plan, to be replaced with an HSA option. I'm no finance whiz, but even I know that could very well mean a massive savings for DL, and an massive shift of costs onto employees...

sorry, Kev, but money is not a distraction to the vast majority of people who actually work for a living.

If they were doing it for charity, then, sure they could care less about the Money.


and what is the point of all of these ENDLESS "you have no right to participate" posts?

The simple fact is that the forum would shut down if the 2 DL rampers who support unionization were all that participated.

Kev wakes up every day PRAYING (well probably not) that WeAAsles and 700 and a cast of thousands will show up and help validate his cause, even if Kev's peers have repeatedly said they aren't interested in further unionizations - and did it where it counts - at the ballot box.

 

[737823]

For those keeping score pretty sure the only active DL employees are:
1) Southwind
2) metopower
3) Kev3188
4) topdawg
How come you haven't asked others to stay away? I'm not opposed to WeAA posting just saying he should add something original and not simply restate what is already being discussed.
Josh

5) yoyodyne

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

I doubt Kev worries about that as much as you think and I'm sure he participates in other places where he can guage the pulse of his group far better than the 3 pro and 3 anti people here.

And I bet you wake up everyday PRAYING (Absolutely) that Josh, Southwind and a cast of thousands will show up and help validate your cause as well.

I think the man just uses you to keep his skills sharp personally.

 

[southwind]

Bingo.

How better to distract people than throw some cash at them? Oh, and while everyone's dazzled with money they would've gotten in Feb. anyway, the company quietly announced an elimination of an HRA plan, to be replaced with an HSA option. I'm no finance whiz, but even I know that could very well mean a massive savings for DL, and an massive shift of costs onto employees...

I'm sure throwing cash at peeps , would not sway the pro-union peeps, come election time. If so, apparently they really didn't want a union to begin with.

 

[WorldTraveler]

if Kev was half as in touch with the pulse of his peers as he or you hope he is, he would have figured out years ago that I was right when I told him after the merger was announced that DL would retain its non-union status.

I, not Kev, have been right.

I said before and I will say it again.

Kev will leave DL as a non-union employee. The timing of when he chooses to leave is up to him; his status as a non-union employee has been and will be decided by thousands of others who don't agree with him.

 

[Kev3188]

You know full well an admin/moderator on one of those groups can make an arbitrary judgement and label content as flamebait or abusive leaving me no recourse.

Josh

I also know that doesn't happen on WCDFA. So again, what specifically did you do/say to get kicked off of there?
 
 

dawg,
plz quote OUTSIDE Of someone else's quote if you want to maintain a dialogue.

Maybe you could show him how. I'm willing to bet someone did the same for you.

...or maybe he just likes writing like that...

but they aren't stupid and won't CUT their pay in order to get a union.

Who says they'd have to? Demanding pay regression would constitute bad faith bargaining on DL's part. Surely, you don't think they'd do that, do you?

and perhaps the bigger reason is that 2 medium sized bumps in pay (one check could still be worth 3-4 weeks of additional pay) provide a bigger emotional hit than one gigantic check.

Boom.

And there you have it, folks. For once, WT nails it. We were talking about it last week, we'll be talking about it again later this week, probably some more as the End of Summer celebrations occur, and again on 2/14. All the while being distracted from what may or may not be going on around us.
 

and it is possible that there are people who will benefit from pushing some of their profit sharing into 2014 instead of 2015.

...And it's possible that there will be people who are harmed financially by unilateral change in insurance coverage(s)...

 

[Kev3188]

I doubt Kev worries about that as much as you think and I'm sure he participates in other places where he can guage the pulse of his group far better than the 3 pro and 3 anti people here.

Correct.

 

[FWAAA]

I believe that the reason that dawg is placing his text inside the quotes (with bolding) is that the board software no longer accommodates chopping up quotes into several bits like it used to.    Previously, we could use the UBB Code to close the quote and respond, then open the quote again and respond.   Now, if you do that, it causes everything to go haywire.    My preference would be to use bright colors to denote the response, as the bolded text isn't that much different from the very light gray regular text.   

 

[737823]

I also know that doesn't happen on WCDFA. So again, what specifically did you do/say to get kicked off of there?  

Comments about unions being self-serving for the interest of the leadership, untouchable and unaccountable for their actions. Remarks that many of the F/As have unreasonable expectations and will never be happy with what the company provides. Calling posters "union thugs". Is any of this really a surprise to you?

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

I believe that the reason that dawg is placing his text inside the quotes (with bolding) is that the board software no longer accommodates chopping up quotes into several bits like it used to.    Previously, we could use the UBB Code to close the quote and respond, then open the quote again and respond.   Now, if you do that, it causes everything to go haywire.    My preference would be to use bright colors to denote the response, as the bolded text isn't that much different from the very light gray regular text.

The ability to make changes and play around with text is the main feature I enjoy about the Forums. #1 I think it appeals to my creative side and #2 I think if done correctly it can seriously help to highlight a point. I use RED for money since some people focus so much on that above seemingly everything else.

I like money as much as the next guy but I don't let it be my master. Too many other things in life have to count for something as well.