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Very true...

Blaming the AGC's for everything that occurs is unwarranted. I have to agree with you on the trading of places scenario. For me to do their job... it would have to pay pretty damn well!

Even at the AGC level, you are still restricted by arbitration schedules... mediation schedule's... and whole host of other red tape that is thrown in your way as an impediment to progress.

And no Jester... I'm not an AGC!

ROA
Hey Roa

As far as arbitration schedules, you know as well as I do. If the company can drag out the time line for these cases, the company knows it only makes the union look bad and not them. This is just one tool they use to get back at the union. It would be good if we could get something in our next contract that limits the time for arbitration. Right now the company can delay things as long as they want with no recourse for the worker.
 
Hey Roa

As far as arbitration schedules, you know as well as I do. If the company can drag out the time line for these cases, the company knows it only makes the union look bad and not them. This is just one tool they use to get back at the union. It would be good if we could get something in our next contract that limits the time for arbitration. Right now the company can delay things as long as they want with no recourse for the worker.


Agreed…

The company knows how to play this game like a banjo! I challenge anyone to assume the position of Shop Steward. From that perspective... you will began to see a small fragment of the whole picture.

As you file your valid grievances, and await resolution, you will you see the complexity of the process in real time. Can you spell Y-E-A-R-S?

The very first, and most important aspect of any CBA… should be concise... chronological accountability… along with enforceable penalties in regards to noncompliance for BOTH sides!

The current language penalizes only the UNION in this aspect. If we cannot enforce the agreement through a strong Grievance Procedure… the entirety of the whole agreement is literally worthless!

Ask any AGC!

IT"S TIME TO ADD MORE... AND NEWER TOOLS TO THE RUSTY OL' TOOLBOX!
 
Agreed…

The company knows how to play this game like a banjo! I challenge anyone to assume the position of Shop Steward. From that perspective... you will began to see a small fragment of the whole picture.

As you file your valid grievances, and await resolution, you will you see the complexity of the process in real time. Can you spell Y-E-A-R-S?

The very first, and most important aspect of any CBA… should be concise... chronological accountability… along with enforceable penalties in regards to noncompliance for BOTH sides!

The current language penalizes only the UNION in this aspect. If we cannot enforce the agreement through a strong Grievance Procedure… the entirety of the whole agreement is literally worthless!

Ask any AGC!

IT"S TIME TO ADD MORE... AND NEWER TOOLS TO THE RUSTY OL' TOOLBOX!
sooooooooooooooooo true!!!!!! to your whole post roa. That would make the union so much stronger, if the company was given penalties also.
 
I know in the M&R CBA if the company doesnt adhere to the time limits it pushes it to the next step, but in reality it doesnt work to the union's advantage cause it would logjam system board.
 
I know in the M&R CBA if the company doesnt adhere to the time limits it pushes it to the next step, but in reality it doesnt work to the union's advantage cause it would logjam system board.

The company is using Management 101, drag the process out, its like basketball used to be before the shot clock rule. Pass it around the corners, just to keep it away from the opponent. Thanks for the info on the pension.

I heard yesterday the District Officers just turned down a scheduled raise for the third time. I applaud the ND guys. Has anyone heard who is going to be on the Negotiation Committee? I hope that person from MCI isn't on it. I cant afford to move again.
 
I have the same question as famous freddie mentioned. Has the negotiations team been formed and who is on it ? Will we the membership be able to talk to these folks . Will they be doing station visits
to find out what the majority of us want in our up coming contract. thanks in advance for your answers
 
Also, people need to understand, that what we currently have in our pension is not affected. This only applies to future contributions after the year 2014, or until we sign another contract. So we need to wake up, because as far as Im concerned, we just became a lot pickier in our next contract negotiations. If we are going to take a hit in our pension as soon as we vote it in. Then it better be a pretty sweet deal to get my vote.
I was never an advocate of the IAM pension plan since it was not guaranteed and took the control out of the hands of the workers. Even though the IAM pension plan was a $43 million concession, the company still refused to sign on to it since it knew the defined benefit was not guaranteed. So to keep the company out of lawsuits, the IAM incorporated language in the contract that the company was not going to guarantee the benefit amount. I explained this to coworkers that this benefit was NOT guaranteed at all and explicitly written in the contract, however, the unseated AGC's told them it was guaranteed. Whether they intentionally lied to them or were ignorant is anybody's guess. As aside, the IAM goes to the mat for this pension plan and although it says there is nothing monetarily in it for them, I often wonder if that is really the case.

Unfortunately, the IAM pension plan can get even worse. This time they decided to cut back future benefit amounts, but remember there is nothing in the plan that prevents them from reducing previous accrual levels. Although it wasn't mentioned, I fully and entirely suspect that this future benefit cut was birthed from the loss of 15,000 members in the plan from Northwest. The timing is highly suggestive. In essence, the IAM pension took a direct blow from losing these participants and will take an even greater blow if it lost the United airline participants. Those left in the plan would have to make up the difference.

In future negotiations, I would think it is utterly unwise to throw more money into this plan. I would be doggedly against this.
Should we keep it? Yes, but leave it alone, it is what it is. Instead of negotiating that the company throw in another dime or quarter an hour into the plan, any monies should be thrown into the wage. The wage is the main thing, but not the only thing, that we understand.

As far as AGC salaries, These AGC's are very modest folks and not too removed from the membership. They would have taken a pay cut but there are bylaws that prevent that. So instead they refused a 2.5% pay raise. The District still gets the 2.5% from the INTL but it will use the money in more resourceful ways than throwing it into salaries.

As far as negotiations, I would think the first thing on the horizon will be a screening committee and a process whereby the membership can submit proposals. IMO, that process should start by February 15, 6 months before commencing negotiations. I severely doubt that a negotiations team has been established but if you use United as a model then it is highly suggestive that there will be more Local Chairpersons on the team than AGC's. IMO, 2 AGC's, and at least 8 Local Chairman. I don't remember but I think the last US AIRWAYS negotiations team had 18 participants, including the GLR, AGC's, LC, PDGC, etc. If I remember, I think the negotiations team comprised of the following persons, with AGC's in parenthesis: Pit guy, Pit guy [MW], Phl guy, Phl guy [PF], PHL guy [BC], CLT guy, CLT guy [JR], MCI woman, PHX guy, LAX guy, BWI guy, Bos guy, GLR, Canale, LAS guy, and at least two others I'm missing. I wouldn't wish negotiations on anyone, it's a huge commitment away from home. The main thing is that everyone sticks together and doesn't start drinking the kool-aid.
 
Unfortunately, the IAM pension plan can get even worse. This time they decided to cut back future benefit amounts, but remember there is nothing in the plan that prevents them from reducing previous accrual levels. Although it wasn't mentioned, I fully and entirely suspect that this future benefit cut was birthed from the loss of 15,000 members in the plan from Northwest. The timing is highly suggestive. In essence, the IAM pension took a direct blow from losing these participants and will take an even greater blow if it lost the United airline participants. Those left in the plan would have to make up the difference.

We had a discussion in the CLT break room just the other day concerning the scenario of the Northwest Membership loss, and if it was a contributing factor. Most of us were uncertain if they were participants in the pension plan... but I think you may have just answered that question!
 
We had a discussion in the CLT break room just the other day concerning the scenario of the Northwest Membership loss, and if it was a contributing factor. Most of us were uncertain if they were participants in the pension plan... but I think you may have just answered that question!

Dear Mister Roabilly,

If what you say to be the truth regarding the loss of the NWA contributions, then this "pension" is more serious trouble than I realized. Every retiree should have pension money directly from their contributions over their lifetime of work which should be invested in such a manner which given estimated life expectancies as to provide adequate monthly income until they eventually die. In essence, everyone of us should have adequate funds today as our share of the pension based upon our contributions, such that given the years until retirement at which time investment returns could be added to the pension and the life expectancy, that should we no longer be part of the IAMNPF, there should be no effect upon the solvency of the pension.

If this pension is looking for younger people to contribute to the pension because there is not enough funding for the current retirees, then this is a de facto Ponzi Scheme which needs a continuing group of "investors" to pay the "returns" for the earlier "investors". Now we can quibble about how much the current retirees portion of funds are returning from what is left of their contributions and the accumulated returns over their working years, but if what you are saying to be true, then clearly some portion of our future benefits will be paying for the current retirees benefits today. It makes me wonder if in the future a "Schedule C" will be created to pay for our retirement by lowering the monthly benefits to future FSAs who contribute to the pension.

I will admit to being very disappointed with the IAMNPF's handling of our pension, because I thought that once the retirement money was out of the hands of the corporate bean counters, there would be less possibility to delay or stop funding for the pension under some accounting rules or just file bankruptcy and dump the obligations to the PBGC with a reduce benefit amount to employees and retirees. As I understand the funding for the pension, when the Company pays our wages, additional money would be delivered to the IAMNPF pension, so this reduction of our monthly benefits is not a result of under payment by the Company, but rather poor administration by the union's pension managers.

I think it is going to be a tough sell during the next round of contract negotiations for the IAM to attempt to raise the pension contributions from management when the issue of suspect pension administration will become a sticking point.

So Reviews Jester.
 
It will be very bad for IAM and the fund if IAM loses representation of the UA ramp and passenger service group
 
Dear Mister Roabilly,

If what you say to be the truth regarding the loss of the NWA contributions, then this "pension" is more serious trouble than I realized. Every retiree should have pension money directly from their contributions over their lifetime of work which should be invested in such a manner which given estimated life expectancies as to provide adequate monthly income until they eventually die. In essence, everyone of us should have adequate funds today as our share of the pension based upon our contributions, such that given the years until retirement at which time investment returns could be added to the pension and the life expectancy, that should we no longer be part of the IAMNPF, there should be no effect upon the solvency of the pension.

Mr. Jester...

Perhaps I should elaborate further on my post. First, I’m not proclaiming the loss of the NWA members as absolutely, and unequivocally the only reason for our pension issues.

What I was referring to was the suspicious timing of these adjustments. I’m not sure if anyone can definitively tie the two together, but it sure raises suspicions.

As we move forward, the only thing we can take to the table is knowledge, wisdom, and whole lot of reservations about past events. This whole pension issue is now a lesson learned… and a costly one at that!

Your reference to the Ponzi Scheme as an analogy brought to mind several thoughts…

Isn’t the entire principal of what we accept as our economic reality just an elaborate Ponzi Scheme… with corporate puppeteers deftly manipulating the hand strings of politicians? Is Wall Street itself actually an unregulated, and legal Ponzi Scheme?

Think about it…

So hypothesizes…

Brobilly
 
well ive been gone a bit from posting things but here is something that all brothers and sisters need to think about, and maybe we need to send the company a message. The company thinks it is ok to do our work in phx. from marshaling in aircraft and transporting bags. i think our fellow brothers and sisters from the east need to walk into phx and take care of business with these clowns. im tired of this sh*t just like this flex crap. im out!
 
I've heard a rumor that PHX will be getting an additional 40 or so agents in response to this flex schedule mess. Any truth to this? Either way, come February 27th, they better have it figured out because these flights will be running a few days every week for at least 6 months. All the OT is great to a point, and I'm sure the company isn't too thrilled about giving it away either.
 
I've heard a rumor that PHX will be getting an additional 40 or so agents in response to this flex schedule mess. Any truth to this? Either way, come February 27th, they better have it figured out because these flights will be running a few days every week for at least 6 months. All the OT is great to a point, and I'm sure the company isn't too thrilled about giving it away either.

What is this flex schedule you are talking about?

Rogue
 
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