If APFA agrees and then the judge throws the yes vote out,then what?

AAStew

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Feb 24, 2003
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MIkey,
If he throws the Yes vote out, we will just vote Yes again. It serves no purpose anymore. WE would of voted yed if allowed to change our votes the first time around. I know Cooper believes in what she is fighting in, but I can tell you what the name of the comapny she is fighting for is not AA or AMR. She is still working towards that lawsuit for seniority integration. That is what she is all about.
By the way, I do not like Ward either, he should go next. He is just as underhanded as Carty ever was.
 

AAStew

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Feb 24, 2003
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Mike,
John could just sign the amended t/a as it is an improvement over the old t/a. He had a valid yes vote. Unfortunately he has shot himself in the foot by making all those statements about revoting. The only lawsuit that I know of is SHerry Coopers, and somehow I think the company may throw in some free legal advice here to help the APFA (ha-ha) and of course itself. That underfly really sucks. It is going to create more fights with the pilots and us, but then again with them carrying guns now maybe not. (just joking folks)
 

FA Mikey

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On 4/25/2003 9:25:46 AM oldbscaler wrote:

Mike,
Why do who want to go into Bankruptcy so bad? The deal has been sweetened and you got your pound of flesh from management. Both other employee groups have articulated their desire to stay out of BK if we can. Do you really thing we will get a better deal from the credtor commitee? Did you hear we lost over a billion dollars in the last 90 days?I just don''t get it. Maybe I am a little slow on the uptake.

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who says I want BK? I think it may be inevitable. I am simply asking for an opinion.

I did hear some where we lost a billion dollars. A war raging, SARS and high fuel prices may have had a help in that loss. The war is slowly closing and fuel is dropping. I have been railroaded in to a ridiculous TA. AA should be making money shortly.

The creditor committees are not directly involved in employee negotiations. The court will require both parties to submit to fair compromise. Good faith bargaining from both sides should render a workable mutually beneficial deal. Other wise the judge will use the information from both side and render his own. So far NO airline BK has gotten to that point. Even the tough UAL mechanics came to an agreeable workable deal with the company.
 

oldbscaler

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Mar 13, 2003
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Mike,
Why do who want to go into Bankruptcy so bad? The deal has been sweetened and you got your pound of flesh from management. Both other employee groups have articulated their desire to stay out of BK if we can. Do you really thing we will get a better deal from the credtor commitee? Did you hear we lost over a billion dollars in the last 90 days?I just don''t get it. Maybe I am a little slow on the uptake.
 

FA Mikey

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On 4/25/2003 9:12:05 AM AAStew wrote:


MIkey,
If he throws the Yes vote out, we will just vote Yes again. It serves no purpose anymore. WE would of voted yed if allowed to change our votes the first time around. I know Cooper believes in what she is fighting in, but I can tell you what the name of the comapny she is fighting for is not AA or AMR. She is still working towards that lawsuit for seniority integration. That is what she is all about.
By the way, I do not like Ward either, he should go next. He is just as underhanded as Carty ever was.

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There is no time for another extended vote. I think that has been the hold up. I understand that APFA is trying to get rid of the underfly. That would go miles towards making this TA palatable to the membership. In the end AA may have to wait out an additional vote by the membership. I dont know how by our constitution that the BOD could impose something on the group.

I would think at this point a 72 hour vote. With all the information available. AA and APFA working together, to get all the TA information to every hotel room and, give access to international crews to call in from outside the US. We could do it.
 

FA Mikey

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In negotiations everyone was being permitted to drop a single item from the TA. I guess as a goodwill gesture. APFA was going to try to lose the underfly. If they are successful, along with the other changes. Even a revote would likely come up yes.

If the court case is successful a revote will be required.
 

L1011Ret

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Oct 31, 2002
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The first vote was no. Then the second vote was yes. A suit was filed to throw out the second vote. Then APFA publicly says that the second vote was tainted by company pressure, no information about what was in the T/A, and certain irregularities. Plus there was Don Carty''s lack of candor. So we get a third vote underway. Now we say get rid of the third vote, we accept the second vote??? Bring Carty back to explain this as he is good at spin. Better yet, the Iraqi information minister is currently unemployed. Maybe he could help.
 

AAStew

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Feb 24, 2003
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I don''t think Mike is anxious to go into BK. I can''t believe anyone would be in their right mind). But the truth is AMR has always treated us (the flight attendant workgroup) with contempt. Folks I know you don''t believe it, but you should try working for this company as a flight attendant. From the day we arrived at the charm farm until the day we leave they treat us like stupid children. They rule by intimidation. I can give you petty examples like, fingernail checks at the charm farm and on the line while on probation. Checking the hem of your skirt. Measuring your ponytail to make sure it is not too long. We are not allowed to sit on any non designated seat on the airplane, we can now fly to Osaka and not get a meal. We can have a 14 hour duty day with 4-6legs, no time to eat, and then have a supervisor ghost ride us and try to fire us because we may have sat for 15 minutes on a pax seat during our last leg. Sure we can have the union fight it for us, but the conditions can be horrible. Try dealing with this for any length of time and see how angry you become.
This is why people like Mike and me too feel this T/A was shoved done our throats. This is the way they deal with us. I for one will accept it, just as I have accepted all their crap from the beginning. Because when we don''t have the supervisors (they go thru periods where they really try to enforce all this bs)this can be a fun job. It is something I have wanted to do since I was a little girl, I don''t think we are overpaid, the cashiers at the grocery store make ore than I do, we want some respect and to be treated as adults. Look at Southwest, we want to lower our cost to match theirs and we are willing to help but AMR must treat us with the same respect SW treats their employees.
 

WXGuesser

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I''m wondering if the dropping of the lawsuit is something the company is trying to negotiate in this process and that''s why it''s taking so long to get anything "official"

TANSTAAFL
 

AAStew

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Feb 24, 2003
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The lawsuit as far as I can tell was not filed by the APFA but rather by Sherry Cooper. If I am wrong please correct me. She is also part of the TWA''rs is suing the APFA also for the seniority integration.
I doubt very much that anyone at the APFA can get her to drop the lawsuit. There is much animosity between her and well I guess everyone on the BOD as far as I can tell.
 

FA Mikey

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On 4/25/2003 11:08:38 AM Flyboy4u wrote:




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On 4/25/2003 10:40:17 AM FA Mikey wrote:

Anything is possible. But its Sherry Coopers suit. They will need to be giving her something to drop it.

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They need to give her a "pink slip".  If her suit is stopping the company from going forward with it''s restructuring then it''s time for her to go.

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The lawsuit was to protect our vote.
 

AAStew

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Feb 24, 2003
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We know what she wants Mike do you think the BOD will give that up? I don''t think so...