Mechanics Beware!

[700UW]

No they didnt because there were no mechanics, you struck and NW imposed new terms.

 

[aapitbull]

Better go read the RLA, when AMFA went on strike, NW imposed a new CBA.

If you strike they impose the terms on the replacements and scabs not on AMFA quit making excuse's what was done was wrong and you are dam right I am embarassed that my union tried to hire SCABS in Kansas City to the TWA guys credit few if any took i,t but others from the area did.

I am not calling you or anyone else at US a scab, but do not defend the actions of the IAM I will not forget what they or the TWU/IBT did period.

 

[Kev3188]

Lets see how successful was AMFA at NW, AS and Horizon?

QX AMT's have been hit twice; they left AMFA for the IBT, only to see their overhaul operation completely dismantled.

The AMFA wasn't successful at NW only because your union, the IAM, scabbed them:

Using that flawed logic, so did ALPA, PFAA, TWU, NAMA, ATSA, and any other one that was on the property I forgot.

Ah I see your clueless as usual.

NW hired a 1,000 mechanics as replacement workers, they were not IAM members nor supplied by the IAM.

If receipt and dispatch, air starts and cleaning broke AMFA, then you are truly ignorant if you think that.

The IAM Fleet service at NW performed more ancillary duties at more locations than AMFA represented employees did.

When AMFA went on strike, a new CBA was imposed, it removed receipt and dispatch and ancillary duties from the CBA, the language was all ready in the IAM FSA CBA that IAM ramp did those duties when not in conflict with the AMFA CBA, which it wasnt anymore.

IAM ramp did not fix planes nor overhaul them or their components.

So show me how parking, pushing, and doing air starts broke AMFA?

Also of the IAM ramp refused to do their jobs they would be disciplined up to termination for insubordination.

So mr who thinks he knows it all, please show us how the ramp broke AMFA?

And ALPA, the PFAA (AFA after) and the TWU represented employees all went to work and flew the planes.

True, though the imposed terms for the AMT's didn't officially come until December of '05. In the interim the existing language in the Ramp & Stores agreement regarding ancillary duties (R& D, cleaning, etc.) was used. What I think some don't understand is that language had existed in both CBA's simultaneously. IMO, NW loved it, since it allowed them to play one group off the other.

This is what 58 years of the AFL-CIO has got us,

This is what a "no raid" clause gets us...

Doesn't the IAM have in all of their CBAs that they don't have to cross legal picket lines? I know US m&r has it, I would be surprised if NW didnt have it.

We did. Then we all got a letter from PDGC DePace saying that the strike wasn't legal, so they weren't going to enforce it. Those of us that chose to abide by the language anyway were on our own.

Yes they did. Some chose not to perform the struck work. There were many IAM scabs who happily volunteered to go to other non maintenance stations to learn to do the receipt and dispatch that was done by the AMFA at maintenance stations.

There were some honorable who would have no part of it (Kev?)

Correct.

What was sickening is the obvious pleasure that some like you take in citing and distorting what in the end was a defeat for labor, AFL-CIO affiliated or not. Some Unions such as the UAW saw it differently, the IAM and others, due to the fact that they have become pure business unions, that exist primarily for the benefit of the people running it instead of the people (mechanics, stock clerks, baggage handlers , etc) funding it still do not.

You say that AMFA made the mistake of alienating the other unions, well from what I've seen, read and heard over the years AMFA's existance is what causes alienation. There is such contempt for AMFA that no other excuse is needed.Yes there has been a lot of stuff that came out during organization drives that was unwarranted and derogatory towards other workers but often that was through persons acting independantly. Such things were wrong. You and others need to get over it and realize that the real enemy is the company and those that serve their interests at our expense. If you are willing to tolerate the pilots having their own union, the flight attendants having their own union and form alliances with them then why is it wrong for mechanics? Unions may battle amongst themselves but they should never ever committ treason and help a company defeat another union because such a defeat is a defeat for all of labor, not just the Union that lost.

I agree that it was a huge blow to labor. I've also said on here previously that DePace's actions set all labor back at least 10 years. And while I absolutely agree with the 2nd part of your post, I'm not sure AMFA needed any help alienating other groups. Make no mistake; there were many many great AMFA members, but there were also plenty that were all too happy to let us know they were glad to be apart from the rest of us. Add to that things like IAM stickers in the urinals, the push by AMFA to have other groups take larger concessions to offset theirs, and, well, you get the idea.

 

[700UW]

Great post Kev!

You are always a voice of reason.

 

[Kev3188]

Thanks!

BTW, one thing I'd add to all posting here: Several have noted that labor is all to eager to fight amongst themselves, while corporate America is all too happy to let 'em do it. This thread is a perfect example of just that. Josh lobs 2 small verbal grenades, and it sparks 7 pages (as of this writing) of internecine warfare. If this nation's working class is to have any chance of rebuilding itself, that needs to stop, like yesterday...

 

[lineguy43]

QX AMT's have been hit twice; they left AMFA for the IBT, only to see their overhaul operation completely dismantled.



Using that flawed logic, so did ALPA, PFAA, TWU, NAMA, ATSA, and any other one that was on the property I forgot.


True, though the imposed terms for the AMT's didn't officially come until December of '05. In the interim the existing language in the Ramp & Stores agreement regarding ancillary duties (R& D, cleaning, etc.) was used. What I think some don't understand is that language had existed in both CBA's simultaneously. IMO, NW loved it, since it allowed them to play one group off the other.


This is what a "no raid" clause gets us...



We did. Then we all got a letter from PDGC DePace saying that the strike wasn't legal, so they weren't going to enforce it. Those of us that chose to abide by the language anyway were on our own.


Correct.






I agree that it was a huge blow to labor. I've also said on here previously that DePace's actions set all labor back at least 10 years. And while I absolutely agree with the 2nd part of your post, I'm not sure AMFA needed any help alienating other groups. Make no mistake; there were many many great AMFA members, but there were also plenty that were all too happy to let us know they were glad to be apart from the rest of us. Add to that things like IAM stickers in the urinals, the push by AMFA to have other groups take larger concessions to offset theirs, and, well, you get the idea.

Kev you know I like you and it has never been personal and I do not remember AMFA asking for more concessions from the other groups but it may have happened if it did thats not right either. I do remember AMFA telling NW when they came looking for concessions they gave NW the same answer they gave us during the best of times in aviation. We have a contract see you in 2005. Thats what NW said to us in the late 1990's when we were still under a concession and the airline was making money hand over fist. Was I happy to be away from the IAm? Yes I was. Had nothing to do with ramp or agents. The IAm just did not value the mechanic and it was obvious. Only when they knew they were going to get kicked to the street they all of a sudden offered us our "own district" Well you know too little too late. I unlike other stupid mechanics did not want to take anything away from ramp or stores or agents I just wanted a union who represented our needs and for lack of a better term I felt "watered down" in a catch all union. Again if I could do it over I would have never invested in being a mechanic. Too many idiots in the ranks too many of us and the industrial unions and others and our own stupid mechanics will never let us have a craft union. NW spent a lot of money with the help of others to break AMFA because they did not want another ALPA on the property. Just wish I would have gone into dispatch 25 years ago and not wasted my time with maintenance.

 

[lineguy43]

One individual does not make a whole organization.

Answer this, how many AMFA shop stewards, officers or any kind of rep crossed the line?

Actually a few...Because some of the AMFA stewards were former IAM stewards just doing it to get out of work and had no loyalty to anyone but themselves.

 

[Kev3188]

No worries! I know it's not personal. 🙂 I also totally understood why the AMT's left 143. Wish it had played out different prior to the exodus, but hindsight is 20/20.

And yeah; I should've gone into dispatch too! Lol.

 

[700UW]

Look what I found:

Things are heating up all around Northwest Airlines and its workers and not only in bankruptcy court. Last Friday members of Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association Local 33 picketed the Hermantown home of their former president, Ken Reed, who has crossed the union picket line and gone to work for NWA, scabbing on his former union brothers and sisters. Later that afternoon the 18 or so picketers were going to go to picket the Clover Valley home of their former secretary and strike coordinator, Dennis Kiminski, who has also gone back to work for the carrier.

Northwest is not working on aircraft at the Duluth facility. Reed and Kiminski are working on ground equipment that services airplanes and passengers. The hanger is empty after scabs had restored an
Airbus A-320 that was in it. All that's left is a $16 million bond that the City of Duluth is holding on the structure.

Gee an AMFA President scabs.

And there is more:

Names AMFA leaders that SCABBED- Ken Reed - AMFA lOCAL 35 (DULUTH) President Dennis Karinski - AMFA Officer Local 35 Mark Bauman - AMFA Safety & Standards Director Alan Arendsee - AMFA Line Maintenance Shop Committee Rep. Dan Yanity - AMFA Chairman Human Rights Committee Lenny Alves - AMFA Shop Committee Rep Local 33 Andrew Tholke - AMFA Shop Committee Rep, Local 35 Dave Buchanan - AMFA Safety and Standards Rep. Keith Lacher - AMFA Safety and Standards Rep. David Laatsch - AMFA Area Rep Bldg B Robert Siebert - AMFA Shop Rep, Fuel Meetering John Pugh - AMFA Shop Rep, engine shop Tom Crowford - AMFA Shop Committee Rep DTW Rick Moody - AMFA DTW Strike Captain Jim Zack - AMFA Member Services Committe (Nov 30, 2009)

 

[1AA]

Teamsters File For Representation Elections At Allegiant Air



They are desperate to get dues from anyone. Pilots????? Oh my.

 

[700UW]

Gee you can here the birds chirping that I have showed AMFA leaders and reps scabbed.

 

[Flying low]

Teamsters File For Representation Elections At Allegiant Air



They are desperate to get dues from anyone. Pilots????? Oh my.

Isn't it the teamsters that needs money for their pension fund? What a better place to get it, as they make more than the AMT's.

 

[Kev3188]

Pilots????? Oh my.

Maybe I missed your point, but organizing pilots isn't new ground for the IBT. They already represent the following:

• ABX Air
• Aloha Air Cargo
• Amerijet
• Atlas Air
• Cape Air
• Centurion Air
• Flight Options
• GoJet
• Gulfstream International
• Horizon Air
• Kalitta Air
• Miami Air
• Northern Air Cargo
• Omni International
• Polar Air
• Republic
• Shuttle America
• Southern Air
• Trans Executive Airlines
• U.S.A. 3000 Airlines
• World Airways

*Atlas & Polar are under combined seniority list, FWIW...

 

[blue collar]

Gee you can here the birds chirping that I have showed AMFA leaders and reps scabbed.

It's not all that shocking.. There's always a few guys in union positions who are in it for themselves. Those are the ones who are gonna scab no matter what union is on strike. You still seem all too happy to point out flaws in other unions, while overlooking the flaws in your own. You are the WT of the IAM.

 

[aapitbull]

Gee you can here the birds chirping that I have showed AMFA leaders and reps scabbed.

I bet you got that info off a AMFA website I know the kept a list for a few years is there a full list of former IAM leaders that scabed I would bet if we looked close at the list you posted many would be former IAM officals. I glad to see you enjoy the loss of others who only wanted to think and fight for themselves another victory for the industrial union and their management buddies.