OCT/NOV 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[nic4us]

I guess you forgot about 2 BK's, the ensuing 40%+ paycuts, the loss of the DB plan and LOA93.

Believe me when I tell you you are not better off becuase of USAPA. You will never see DOH at USAirways, especially if there is a merge with AA. As EOA/JJ likes to say, "Tilting at Windmills".

By the way you get 5 more years too. Working at USAirways under LOA 93 does not elicit much envy from our peer groups in the airline industry. Except for Sun Country- lowest paid non-regional pay in the industry. Envy that.

There are a lot more of my peers out here that feel exactly as I do. They just don't post on this forum.

Seham and the USAPA boys threw you under the bus when they told you throwing ALPA
off the property would negate the Nicolau Award and you'd have a new DOH contract real soon. Hasn't happened never will.

If you are the guy posters keep claiming you to be, let me say this,,,

We have met, and you got more nuts than any other east pilot.

Make no mistake, guys like seejay, flyingskier, breeze etc..would gladly steal your position if they saw a way to do it. Then they have the audacity to claim some sort of righteous crusade to rationalize their behavior.

The big difference between a senior West pilot and a senior east pilot is that guys like Bradford and Theuer (who openly told the USA Today in an interview during the merger) think they can get away with stealing the senior West pilot's positions at LCC.

Look at their posts. Constant whining about their position, and attack on yours. They are jealous ingrates who in my opinion fully deserve to remain the lowest paid, most overworked pilots on the market.

 

[mrbreeze]

Mr Breeze and all on this board:

I am sorry... My apologies to all who read or have read this. As I live in a glass house, I thank God that he has not seen fit to mete out to me what I deserve. It was a long night and i should probably try to find a breath-alyzer for my keyboard.

Again I am truly sorry.

fifi,

I just got in from Europe, so a little slow with a response. I just read your post and understand the alcohal/keyboard relationship as much as anyone......I have made my share of bad posts. Thanks for the apology, accepted, of course. Don't worry about it.

breeze

 

[nic4us]

I think that pretty much sums it up. The only further "enhancement" available to him, is to throw the East long term "downtrodden" under the bus for a pay raise, under the "guise" of "doing the right thing", what a guy! Maybe it's not about the "commute", after all it's going to be a loooooong time before there are any 330's in PHX. Then again that short commute would be a big improvement, maybe even big enough to make it worth down bidding (with a big enough across the board pay raise) if he could get in to PHX. Flying a 75 to Hawaii for the last few years, wouldn't be all that bad either. Must be nice to be senior.


seajay

So, I was under the impression the east was getting 5 more 330s this year, is that true?

The reason I ask is....the TA is very specific about growth airplanes.


Oh, I agree with you on one point...it is nice to be senior....so much so that others envy the senior positions to the point of animosity.

 

[Phoenix]

If you are the guy posters keep claiming you to be, let me say this,,,

We have met, and you got more nuts than any other east pilot.

Make no mistake, guys like seejay, flyingskier, breeze etc..would gladly steal your position if they saw a way to do it. Then they have the audacity to claim some sort of righteous crusade to rationalize their behavior.

The big difference between a senior West pilot and a senior east pilot is that guys like Bradford and Theuer (who openly told the USA Today in an interview during the merger) think they can get away with stealing the senior West pilot's positions at LCC.

Look at their posts. Constant whining about their position, and attack on yours. They are jealous ingrates who in my opinion fully deserve to remain the lowest paid, most overworked pilots on the market.

They would steal a pilot's position from someone hired before they were?
You make several references and accusations of people stealing... dost thou project too much?

 

[Phoenix]

So, I was under the impression the east was getting 5 more 330s this year, is that true?

The reason I ask is....the TA is very specific about growth airplanes.

The grievance folks should definitely be advised if the TA stipulates growth planes will be delivered to both sides equally, even before a joint contract. Is that what the TA says?

 

[luvthe9]

So..what IS your zeal for wishing to throw those junior to you under the nic-bus based on then?.....a hoped-for 30 pieces of silver? 😉

I know what it is the westies won't let him ride jumpseat to SAN and he wants to be sure he can geta a ride home. That's worth screwing your fellow co-worker I'm sure, right?

 

[luvthe9]

There is no DOH contract in your future and absent a merger no relief from LOA 93.

What's pathetic is that you're gushing with happiness about it.

No gushing, I just don't worry about like you kids do. PS if you voted for it live with it son.

 

[Walmartgreeter]

So, I was under the impression the east was getting 5 more 330s this year, is that true?

The reason I ask is....the TA is very specific about growth airplanes.


Oh, I agree with you on one point...it is nice to be senior....so much so that others envy the senior positions to the point of animosity.

When Parker replaced your 737s with larger A321s was that growth?Now he is replacing some our 737s with larger A330-200s. Is that growth?We already have some completed arbitrations that give you specific rights to some 190s and 75s that apparently fell into the growth category.But the arbitrator specifically did not limit or tell the Company where to fly what. Rather until a joint operation.Maybe soon (or maybe never) you can use your seniority to bid into a base that has 330 flying! Greeter

 

[EastUS1]

Make no mistake, guys like seejay, flyingskier, breeze etc..would gladly steal your position if they saw a way to do it. Then they have the audacity to claim some sort of righteous crusade to rationalize their behavior.

How can you possibly make any such assumption about people you've never met and don't personally know?.....Umm....Unless you're just turning on that good old, massive projector again? 😉

"Then they have the audacity to claim some sort of righteous crusade to rationalize their behavior."...? HUH!!?? THAT....Coming from an ardent nicster "each case turns on it's own merits"...seniority is "relative"/etc?..and from a group that fantasizes themselves mighty "spartans", righteous "knights", and overall, grand and glorious "heros" who've "fought with valor in many battles" in some imaginary "war" inside Fantasyland...and yourself on record as a "dragon slayer"..? Ok..Thanks for the best Joke of the Month, at the very least. 🙂

Whew!....You just can't make this stuff up. 😉

 

[N924PS]

I know what it is the westies won't let him ride jumpseat to SAN and he wants to be sure he can geta a ride home. That's worth screwing your fellow co-worker I'm sure, right?

With one noteable exception, and that was over 2 years ago, the West pilots have been more than gracious and accomodating to all of the SAN commuters.

I say more than gracious because they have to pay dues twice. Once to the union that "represents" them and again to AOL to protect themselves against the tyranny of the majority.

Try again Luv. Wrong again.

 

[Piedmont1984]

I know I'll get some incoming for this, but is it fair to state that none of us know for sure exactly what the majority of pilots, whether east, west or both are thinking at this point in time.

We in the east are beginning to feel the positive effects of attrition and claim we have adjusted to LOA93. But I know we chafe under this POS contract if only for the idea of being short changed by the company we work for.

I believe in the will of the majority, but there has been no scientific poll of the rank and file on the issue of the seniority dispute since USAPA was elected. Anecdotal input via email, phone calls, random conversations at meetings or in cockpits do not constitute a scientific poll. But this is exactly what the BPR is getting for feedback. There is a more silent majority out there that avoids web boards and doesn't speak out at union meetings.

The current leadership pledged during their campaign that frequent polling would take place.

I think its long overdue for a poll, similar to the safety culture poll or the ALPA Wilson poll. Pick your vendor, but lets ask the membership how they feel about certain things and how they would like to proceed. Kinda like a practice bid, only different.

I would be curious to have the answer to such questions as:

How many would vote to stay the course?
How many would vote to change course?
How many............................................change the C&R's?
How many............................................change the Constitution?
How many............................................vote for the Nic?
How many............................................vote to drop the Nic?

Pick your own question. Make some questions domicile specific. Fifty or so questions would say a great deal about where we are today and where we want to go. I've asked Hummel and Bradford for this but they don't answer my emails.

Maybe someone here with more pull could get a petition started. Now that's one I would be willing to sign.

 

[nycbusdriver]

So, I was under the impression the east was getting 5 more 330s this year, is that true?

The reason I ask is....the TA is very specific about growth airplanes.


Oh, I agree with you on one point...it is nice to be senior....so much so that others envy the senior positions to the point of animosity.

Yes, the east is very definitely getting 5 more A330-200s in 2013.

Hope you enjoy watching us fly them as much as we enjoy do so!

As far as "growth" airplanes, neither the east nor the west is growing the number of hulls. These are replacements for the retiring 737s.

It just means about 100 more east pilots will get a raise next year to a rate that exceeds the top west rate. (And that doesn't even consider the rest of the upgrades.)

 

[Phoenix]

 

[nic4us]

Yes, the east is very definitely getting 5 more A330-200s in 2013.

Hope you enjoy watching us fly them as much as we enjoy do so!

As far as "growth" airplanes, neither the east nor the west is growing the number of hulls. These are replacements for the retiring 737s.

It just means about 100 more east pilots will get a raise next year to a rate that exceeds the top west rate. (And that doesn't even consider the rest of the upgrades.)

Do you know the retirement schedule for the 737s they are replacing?

BTW, seems some West aircraft will also be retiring. wonder what they will be replaced with?

I do not suspect it will be 330s, as a matter of fact, I suspect it will be no airplanes.

Keep enjoying that 330 flying, and don't count your chickens before they hatch.

 

[nic4us]

When Parker replaced your 737s with larger A321s was that growth?Now he is replacing some our 737s with larger A330-200s. Is that growth?We already have some completed arbitrations that give you specific rights to some 190s and 75s that apparently fell into the growth category.But the arbitrator specifically did not limit or tell the Company where to fly what. Rather until a joint operation.Maybe soon (or maybe never) you can use your seniority to bid into a base that has 330 flying! Greeter

Yes we did have some completed arbitrations regarding 757s and the 190s but the company and usapa colluded in a disproportionate furlough in 2008 allowing east scabs to return east in direct violation of the TA.

I am not interested in 330 flying at this time...I am only interested in violations of the TA in which the company and usapa collude to the West's detriment, and the perpetuation of separate ops to facilitate the same.