US Airways Pilots Labor Thread 12/8-12/15

[traderjake]

It is interesting all the integrity talk from the west. In order to survive in the early days america west airline pilots crossed picket lines in Australia and your management pilots flew drugs to stay alive for an Australian investor.

Your pilots were flying under the influence and your ceo liked to drive inebriated all his life.

It is everyones moral responsibility to acknowledge this and assure this attempted move into accreditation by society does not take place.

How many fatal accidents did America West have?

How many did we have in a 5 year period?

Your assertions on superiority are ridiculous.

 

[nostradamus]

america west weather report for the system

 

[Tiger 1050]

america west weather report for the system

That's great! I love people with a sense of humor.

 

[nostradamus]

How many fatal accidents did America West have?

How many did we have in a 5 year period?

Your assertions on superiority are ridiculous.

traderjake
Posted on: Jan 22 2003, 04:53 PM
I'M NOT GOING ON STRIKE AND LOSE 15 YEARS OF INCOME JUST BECAUSE THE OLD GUYS WHO NEGOTIATED THE "B SCALE" FOR ME ARE NOT HAPPY WITH THEIR RETIREMENT. I DON'T CARE WHAT ALPA SAYS, I'll BE HAPPY TO TAKE THEIR SENIORITY NUMBER.
traderjake"A scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class."

Only a fool believes that the guy on the street is going to (or should) stay home to protect your paycheck.

A union under the RLA is nothing but a government sanctioned labor monopoly.

traderjake

"Let me ask all of you a question. What if, say Jetblue, got a couple -five billions in financial backing and decided to buy United or AA, keeps the larger airline's name, but keeps the JB management and owning controlling interest? What answer would you all have about senority THEN?? Would you feel as comfortable with 6 year f/as going ahead of 30 year AA or UA f/as?"
Absolutely. There is a difference between longevity and seniority. If one are one number from being furloughed before the merger you should be one number after the merger. If you are at 50% before you should be at 50% after the merger. DOH is a windfall for the US F/As.

I didn't say the bankruptcy judge could decertify AFA. He can force changes to your contract. The AW F/As need to decertify AFA.

Posted on: Jun 7 2005,

I believe you are wrong. There is time to decertify AFA and I think the bankruptcy judge also may have a say in this matter.

As a USAirways employee your desire to reap a windfall at the expense of the HP FA/s in despicable.


Thank You To Whom Ever Made This Merger Possible

What happens if the AW F/A's decertifyAFA and replace it with an inhouse union? Since it's going to be 2 to 3 years before operations are merged there is plenty of time to do this.

As a US employee to all the AW employees, thank you for saving us, I hope we don't take you down.




Thank You To Whom Ever Made This Merger Possible
traderjake

Posted on: May 19 2005,
I guess the two of you are smarter than the people who have a couple $100 millon to invest in the combined company.

traderjake
Posted on: Apr 24 2005,



Slotted equipment ratio is fair for pilots. Relative position for other groups.


mwereplanes

I know I can make more money outside of the "job". I won't accept less than what the skill, training, checkrides, physicals, responsibilities, travel, etc.... is worth. You obviously will. Along with your freinds on the street. Just to make sure you understand: This profession is worth substantially more than what U is paying. Substantially more.

Our labor is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it, not what we think it's worth.

Save your "defending the profession" garbage for the union hall. I'm not falling on the sword for you or anyone else.""""""""""""""""""

You can say you live on the North Pole or South Pole. If you say you reside in both locations that would make you bi-polar.

 

[Metroyet]

america west weather report for the system

That's funny. Here in PHX, if you don't have a 3 day supply of Wonder Bread before a rain shower you're out of luck.

I stand corrected. We do, in fact, agree on ONE thing..."bad" weather in PHX is literally a joke.

 

[ClueByFour]

Funny how truth keeps creeping back into the argument.

I don't think you guys want to go there. Even if we assume that HP Pilots were flying coke in Australia, they were at least managing to keep those aircraft out of Sydney Harbour (unlike, say, Flushing Bay).

Dumb line of thinking.

 

[hp_fa]

I would think that both sides should agree that the topics of the alleged drug smuggling and the unfortunate fatal accidents should be off limits in your spirited debate. It just isn't relevant to the issues that are being argued here and unfairly and unfortunately muddies the waters with wholly unrelated non-topics.

 

[flybynite]

I couldn't agree more hp fa. That stuff is totally uncalled for. :down:

 

[cleardirect]

Just part of the history. Can we stop now? This is about seniority and agreements not what some pilots did while employed at an airline.


Armed pilot shoots hole in airliner TheStar.com - World - Armed pilot shoots hole in airliner
ASSOCIATED PRESS

March 25, 2008
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

CHARLOTTE, N.C. – The pilot of a US Airways plane may have mishandled a firearm that went off in flight, piercing a hole in the cockpit wall, a federal air marshal said Tuesday.

MOD NOTE: You may NOT post entire articles on this board without the written permission of the copyright owner. If you want the article read place a link here.

 

[Richard]

I happen to agree with the other posters. Let's refrain from the references to past historical tragedies and incidents and stay on the subject of the current situation.

We will be watching closely--please stay on topic. Those incidents have no bearing on the future and to constantly bring them up is in bad taste.

Thank you.

 

[pilotn79]

Easy trigger.

I think you got my point, time to move on to another subject.

 

[Megasnoop]

It's funny how NW and DL were able to merge their seniority lists in such a short order. However, I would suggest that this was a result of watching the US unions fight and they wanted to avoid it.

JC, where you been hiding, big guy? Not only in short order, but smoothly. Your right. Why the difference? Their 2 pilot lists were closer in DOH/relative seniority than ours. Next, They also had a contract BEFORE they had a list. And who can we blame for that? alpo, which is on the scrap heap where it belongs. It was ALPOs inability to lead that led to usapa. It was a long time coming. And after this is all said and done, both sides need to remember how alpo screwed this up when Prater comes calling 17 months from now. NOTE: I quit alpo and stopped paying dues long before usapa.

Level heads should stop and understand the NW/DL integration approach and see if it can work for US.

As I said before, nic or doh wont make much difference to me at my age and life style. I dont need a left seat commute or reserve anytime in my career. With the entitlement that the west now preceives, I dont see much chance of compromise. polarized groups tend to continue to be polarized. Getting together would make them bi-polar (I stole that one from another poster).

Stop the lawsuits and sit down and hammer it out. The only winner in this continuing argument is our competitors. We have the most to loss and at this point the least to gain by keeping the fighting going. We will end up back in Chapter 11 for many reasons however this pilot issue will haunt us for many years if people can't bury the axe and move on.

It's time to move on.

Definitely time and stop the lawsuits. West went ballistic right after alpo got the hook, instead of wating for their legal options to move forward. Mcilvena and his awappa crowd were bent on destruction and burning down the house. Hiding behind alpo, he telegraphed his plan to destroy usapa in his own hotline, if usapa elected. The aol sat back, bided its time and now controls the west agenda. I hear they put out a notice to join usapa that prompted 1000+ applications. I dont have any inside info on that. If so, thats clout. Our pilots and our union were harassed by childish and criminal west acts to the point the union had no choice but sue. Guys screwed out of Jump-seats to the point of missing trips. Those acts were done for one reason: to keep usapa from doing its job as the legally elected union. Contrary to hard-line westie claims, the lawsuit is not dead with prejudice, just forced into a different venue, state court. But if the West 18 join usapa and pay dues, I cant see how usapa can keep suing its own members. As you said, time to move on.

The PHX judge has already telegraphed how he thinks the DFR should go. A jury may or not agree with him, but either way, we could be looking at years of appeals. As I said before, the leverage has shifted west. No doubt DAL/NWA ended doh under current alpo merger policy, although even the DAL/NWA arbs noted that doh has been a long-term alpo merger standard. From the award:

To be sure, prior ALPA Arbitration Boards have merged Seniority Lists by means of date-weighted methods.

Fair and balanced, they also said:

But in this case, that method is not sufficiently responsive to the makeup of these two groups.

I read the whole thing, all you west lawyer-wanna-bes. The whole questions still is, does alpo gone negate the nic and how long do you want this to continue? JC, your right, time to end this. snooper

 

[Megasnoop]

I would think that both sides should agree that the topics of the alleged drug smuggling and the unfortunate fatal accidents should be off limits in your spirited debate. It just isn't relevant to the issues that are being argued here and unfairly and unfortunately muddies the waters with wholly unrelated non-topics.

Right on, FA (whoever you are)! But when children from either side run out of logical and pithy arguments, they resort to name-calling and attacks. Hopefully all the childishness has reached critical mass and will get sucked into its own black hole. snoop-dog

 

[BoeingBoy]

But in this case, that method is not sufficiently responsive to the makeup of these two groups.

Interesting...the arbitrator used by some to show that DOH was the only fair solution rules largely relative position in an integration where "Their 2 pilot lists were closer in DOH/relative seniority than ours." Kinda show that it's not the arbitrator, but rather the arbitration that determines the fair method.

Jim

 

[Boeing Driver]

There is one huge difference between the US Airways and the Delta merger arbitration - the Delta one used the full and correct lists. The US Airways arbitration used a partial list created after well over a year of delay tactics by AWA pilots to push the actual arbitration into the future as far as possible. During this lengthy delay US Airways parked over 60 aircraft in order to make the merger happen, and furloughed hundreds of their pilots.

This HUGELY benefited AWA pilots. If the NIC award was applied to the true and correct list we I do not believe that we would be in the mess we are.

But AWA pilots saw "a prize" and went for it. Unfortunate, to say the least.3

As it is there is no end in sight - and no matter which way the lawsuit in PHX comes out there is going to be years of this mess. The US Airways pilots are not just going to give up, and now with their newly bolstered sense of entitlement from a home town judge neither are the AWA pilots.

Boeing Driver