US Pilots Labor Discussion

[BoeingBoy]

Indeed, $ 1.00 per year would, indeed, be "profitable". Especially after transferring "certain" costs to the east operation.

I see I made a mistake in leaving you off the list of those who spout stuff without a clue whether it's factual or not...

Jim

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

I see I made a mistake in leaving you off the list of those who spout stuff without a clue whether it's factual or not...

Jim

Your mistake was in leaving yourself off your own list.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Nice Sherlock:

Malicious Web Site Blocked

You attempted to access:

http://www.http.com//www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?channel=aviationdaily&id=news/ATSB07255.xml&headline=ATSB%20Agrees%20To%20Consolidate%20America%20West,%20US%20Air%20Loans

This is a known malicious web site. It is recommended that you do NOT visit this site. The detailed report explains the security risks on this site.

For your protection, this web site has been blocked. Visit Symantec to learn more about phishing and internet security.

Jim

 

[Move2CLT]

I thought you missed me, yet you want me to leave?

Why can't you answer a simple question? Is it sort of like how the LOA 93 answer was out and the CIRP team was pulled off the line to deal with the meltdown? Or the multiple consecutive profitable quarters for AWA? Or what % the bottom captain on the the Nic list was? Or one of the many other things you pulled out of your rear and posted?

When SH said you were dumber than a bag of hammers he was being generous.

I don't want you to leave hair Pi. You just have a propensity to leave after the heat gets turned up on you. You've done that a number of times and I just don't want to be hurt like that again.

My info was and is spot on. Its obvious your inability to control your frustration is starting to show after only a few posts.

And that pathetic when you have to go to SH for quotes.

 

[Move2CLT]

Since you are not a pilot, why would you care?

Priceless would be going out into the world and making it a better place rather than massaging the glass balls. In Mr. Parker's office.

God dammit that was absolutely a dumb post.

 

[Pi brat]

I don't want you to leave hair Pi. You just have a propensity to leave after the heat gets turned up on you. You've done that a number of times and I just don't want to be hurt like that again.

My info was and is spot on. Its obvious your inability to control your frustration is starting to show after only a few posts.

And that pathetic when you have to go to SH for quotes.

I never left, just nothing to add until tonight.

You were wrong about every one. You are a liar, and xxxx stirring embarrassment.

 

[Injunction junction]

To you it doesn't because your lack of understanding about the industry or inexperience about it, wouldn't let you,not meant as a slight but unless youve actually seen this industry and deregulation first hand you don't know squat! but on a side note since youve been granted class status, who will represent the WEST? AWAPPA, AOL? Or will you sue each other for the right! MM!

I am starting to think that you cant make sense. How many time must you be beaten up side your head before you get it? Dereg happened 33yrs ago and you talking about that now?? WHY??? Its of ZERO value to this situation here in 2011. This is yet another problem with you folks back east, constantly living in the past. This is not 1978 and things dont operate today like they did back then.

Let go of yesteryear and lets get on with the here and now.

Injunction

 

[cleardirect]

Why the hell should Underpants or any East pilot with a decade or more seniority over the West allow those pilots to have seniority above them? Are you crazy? Seniority is earned and worth fighting for. So, if you haven't figured it out yet...it's going to be a long bumpy flight.

Later,
Eye

Better talk to all of the arbitrators. They all disagree with you.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

I am starting to think that you cant make sense. How many time must you be beaten up side your head before you get it? Dereg happened 33yrs ago and you talking about that now?? WHY??? Its of ZERO value to this situation here in 2011. This is yet another problem with you folks back east, constantly living in the past. This is not 1978 and things dont operate today like they did back then.

Let go of yesteryear and lets get on with the here and now.

Injunction

We on the EAST don't hold on to the past, there is no future in it! Now JIM, that is a different story!

 

[john john]

Money losing hub? Which one is that?

CMH LAS

PIT, BOS, LGA

Lets not try and make the precious east sound profitable because if it were then AAA never would have been bankrupt twice in 4yrs nor would you be sitting on LOA93 wages now would you???

Injunction

BOS and LGA are/were hub's


You’re not very well informed stands to reason
DE-HUBing is a byproduct of all airline mergers the east knows this all to well. Which hub is next care to guess?


CLT PHL PHX
Pick one

 

[cleardirect]

Is that what's said when there are no answers oh great one?? If you can not agree that through this failed quest to get doh you and the rest of this pilot group has given away millions that could have gone in our pockets then you are truly lost.

Injunction

It is official. The quest for DOH is DEAD. The "great one" the leader all the east wanted has admitted defeat. Mike Cleary the president that all of the hard core usapa supporters have blindly lined up behind.

Mark the day the idea for usapa died.

From the president's message dated November 8, 2011.

Seniority Dispute

Regardless of the hyperbolic claims of those who could benefit from the weakening of your resolve to achieve a seniority integration that is respectful of a worker's history of service to a merged airline, we have proven one thing for certain - that an unratifiable bargaining proposal from a predecessor union remains something that moves none of us towards a practical, real world solution to the seniority issue. The Company's filing seeking a Declaratory Judgment (DJ case) in the Phoenix Court has been essentially dormant since its filing in July of 2010. The Judge in that case - Judge Roslyn Silver - now has the case scheduled for greatly increased activity in the coming weeks. Although our goal - a merged seniority list that respects the legitimate expectations of all of our pilots - remains unchanged, the Board's decision to assign new counsel and the reinvigoration of this dormant case affords us an opportunity to reevaluate our strategy and tactics with regard to accomplishing our goals in the most expeditious and efficient way possible.

a practical real world solution. Where was this attitude during the arbitration? Where was that attitude when usapa was created? DOH was not a real world solution but after years of giving away money to the company, reality has finally showed up in CLT. Sounds to me like the DJ has Cleary scared. Well boys the solution is simple. Accept the Nicolau as written and we move on. There is no only solution.

Cleary and usapa have given up on DOH and is now looking for an out. A face saving exit from a failed experiment.Cleary is going to have to go back to the line flying with the angry F/O club at some point. No national position for him to hide in here. After 3.5 years of delivering nothing but legal bills to this pilots group now he wants an "expeditious" solution.

The BK LOA93 is getting costly for you east guys.

Interesting statement here.

Despite the many other issues that required our attention, your union has remained highly focused on the industry standard contract that we all deserve.

3.5 years of being highly focused has produced nothing. I wonder how these guys handle issues they aren't focused on.


usapa= a failure from beginning to end.
BTW if LOA 93 was a winner why is Cleary "highly focused" on getting a new contract? Plus kind of kills the whole BS statements from the east posters on here saying you are fine on LOA 93.

 

[Hate2fly]

clear,

You missed this part of Cleary's letter.


I have called your Board into session this week to conduct a strategy session on the DJ case. I will be proposing a variety of bold initiatives that will alter strategy and tactics but will remain true to the objective that USAPA pilots believe in to our core. Immediately following this week's meeting, I will write to you to explain in detail these initiatives.


Hate

 

[No Land Green]

It is official. The quest for DOH is DEAD. The "great one" the leader all the east wanted has admitted defeat. Mike Cleary the president that all of the hard core usapa supporters have blindly lined up behind.

Mark the day the idea for usapa died.

From the president's message dated November 8, 2011.



a practical real world solution. Where was this attitude during the arbitration? Where was that attitude when usapa was created? DOH was not a real world solution but after years of giving away money to the company, reality has finally showed up in CLT. Sounds to me like the DJ has Cleary scared. Well boys the solution is simple. Accept the Nicolau as written and we move on. There is no only solution.

Cleary and usapa have given up on DOH and is now looking for an out. A face saving exit from a failed experiment.Cleary is going to have to go back to the line flying with the angry F/O club at some point. No national position for him to hide in here. After 3.5 years of delivering nothing but legal bills to this pilots group now he wants an "expeditious" solution.

The BK LOA93 is getting costly for you east guys.

Interesting statement here.



3.5 years of being highly focused has produced nothing. I wonder how these guys handle issues they aren't focused on.


usapa= a failure from beginning to end.
BTW if LOA 93 was a winner why is Cleary "highly focused" on getting a new contract? Plus kind of kills the whole BS statements from the east posters on here saying you are fine on LOA 93.

.....that's not the way I read Cleary's message.............NLG out........

 

[nic4us]

It is official. The quest for DOH is DEAD. The "great one" the leader all the east wanted has admitted defeat. Mike Cleary the president that all of the hard core usapa supporters have blindly lined up behind.

Mark the day the idea for usapa died.

From the president's message dated November 8, 2011.



a practical real world solution. Where was this attitude during the arbitration? Where was that attitude when usapa was created? DOH was not a real world solution but after years of giving away money to the company, reality has finally showed up in CLT. Sounds to me like the DJ has Cleary scared. Well boys the solution is simple. Accept the Nicolau as written and we move on. There is no only solution.

Cleary and usapa have given up on DOH and is now looking for an out. A face saving exit from a failed experiment.Cleary is going to have to go back to the line flying with the angry F/O club at some point. No national position for him to hide in here. After 3.5 years of delivering nothing but legal bills to this pilots group now he wants an "expeditious" solution.

The BK LOA93 is getting costly for you east guys.

Interesting statement here.



3.5 years of being highly focused has produced nothing. I wonder how these guys handle issues they aren't focused on.


usapa= a failure from beginning to end.
BTW if LOA 93 was a winner why is Cleary "highly focused" on getting a new contract? Plus kind of kills the whole BS statements from the east posters on here saying you are fine on LOA 93.

Clear, you are one of my go to guys for opinions of what all the different trials, rulings and motions mean, but I think you got it wrong in this take on Cleary's letter.

The "real world solution" he is talking about is the usapa DOH seniority theft scheme.


On a completely different topic though, what do you think of judge Conrad scheduling a jury trial for 10-22-2012, with the pre-trial stuff due 6-12-2012? I thought once the injunction was granted that pretty much ended usapa's illegal work action and we could all just get along.

Is this just to hold something over usapa's head in case of non-compliance with the injunction, or are we going to send Cleary and his scab union officers to the big house?

 

[cleardirect]

.....that's not the way I read Cleary's message.............NLG out........

Over the years we have all come to understand that you east guys have a reading comprehension problem.


But keep the faith brother. Believe what you want but Cleary just told you DOH is dead.

Seniority Dispute

Regardless of the hyperbolic claims of those who could benefit from the weakening of your resolve to achieve a seniority integration that is respectful of a worker's history of service to a merged airline, we have proven one thing for certain - that an unratifiable bargaining proposal from a predecessor union remains something that moves none of us towards a practical, real world solution to the seniority issue. The Company's filing seeking a Declaratory Judgment (DJ case) in the Phoenix Court has been essentially dormant since its filing in July of 2010. The Judge in that case - Judge Roslyn Silver - now has the case scheduled for greatly increased activity in the coming weeks. Although our goal - a merged seniority list that respects the legitimate expectations of all of our pilots - remains unchanged, the Board's decision to assign new counsel and the reinvigoration of this dormant case affords us an opportunity to reevaluate our strategy and tactics with regard to accomplishing our goals in the most expeditious and efficient way possible.

I have called your Board into session this week to conduct a strategy session on the DJ case. I will be proposing a variety of bold initiatives that will alter strategy and tactics but will remain true to the objective that USAPA pilots believe in to our core. Immediately following this week's meeting, I will write to you to explain in detail these initiatives.

Why change tactics and strategy if it is working?

What usapa pilots core value is Cleary talking about? East or west core values? Does usapa and Cleary represent west pilots or not?

a merged seniority list that respects the legitimate expectations of all of our pilots - remains unchanged,

Did a furloughed pilot have a legitimate expectation of being senior to a west captain?

Cleary is going to have to explain in detail what he is doing. If DOH is not dead what does he have to explain? Why did he not just say as he has before that it is in the usapa C&BL therefore there is no discussion? Nope no talk of DOH anymore. DOH is DOA November 8, 2011. Can usapa be far behind since that was the reason for being. Oh that's right the IBT is warming up in the wings. usapa gives up on DOH then just gives up.

You guys going to open your eyes or ride this wreck all the way to the dirt? The Nicolau is coming. You can accept it and move on or resist and be shocked.