US Pilots Labor Discussion

[crazystnic]

Anyone who wants more than the Kirby proposal has to devote themselves to securing the leverage necessary to get any more than what the company is willing to offer - UNITY. And that means abandoning the continued abuse of the West.

If you want more than Kirby, you have to demand better than Cleary

************************************

Give it a break. I think Cleary is doing a fine job... stop trying to get us to believe a certain way... you stick you your Bs and we will believe what we want.

All your posts are just on here to sway..
NOT GOING TO HAPPEN>

I support cleary

 

[boeingplt]

I support cleary

As do 90+% of east pilots

 

[CallawayGolf]

As do 90+% of east pilots

Of course you have no way of validating that statement, but even if it were true that just means 90% of east pilots prefer to be lied to rather than think objectively about the truth of the situation for themselves. Not a very edifying commentary.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

You really do like to play fast and loose with facts. Read ALPA merger policy again and quote the EXACT verbiage of the part pertaining to windfall. It says no windfall at the expense of the other side. When you leave that part out it changes the entire meaning. The Nic award, and the resulting slotting of pilots based on category and class is not a windfall. And even if you personally consider it one (however irrelevant your opinion is to the process), it didn;t come at anyone's expense, since it keeps everyone about where they were the day before the merger.

So you are wrong. ALPA very much did honor and follow it's policies to the letter. Sorry, but you can't blame anyone else for what you have done except yourselves. I will say that you oldie, do have a persistent denial of reality and fact, and seem to favor an alternate reality you've fabricated in your mind. Keep clicking your heals. You'll never get your DOH pipe dream. And you'll never convince anyone of your propaganda, outside of your band of brothers.

Talk about "fast and loose". What is a windfall if it's not at the expense of the other side?

At least make a reasonable argument. ALPA screwed it up. PERIOD. Anybody reading your post knows exactly who is out of touch with reality, and it isn't me.

YOU LOSE!

Nic is DEAD!

 

[N924PS]

Nic is DEAD!

Mike Cleary getting news on the Nic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnwIIKnWJtg

 

[A320 Driver]

I maintain that until USAPA shows that it is willing to really hammer out a JCBA – which includes accepting the NIC – then Management has no reason to believe that any section of the contract is worth discussing.

Seriously, what is the point? I would say that a very probable outcome of all this mess is that USAPA loses the fight against the NIC which in turn leads to the decertification of USAPA. If that happens, then what good did it do to negotiate on the other sections with a CBA who was removed from the property? Even USAPA says that they have or intend to re-open all sections of the contract because the previous CBA no longer represents the interests of the pilots.

Management will continue to affirm the Kirby offer and will give USAPA virtually no negotiating time until USAPA accepts the NIC. If that should ever happen, I believe negotiations will accelerate rather nicely because most everyone, including Management, is genuinely tired of having the pilots and FAs on separate contracts. if it doesn't happen, then no contract will be in the works and USAPA is fully and soley responsible for the failure.

Wow! Your a real company kind of guy. You just stated all management's justifications for not bargaining in good faith. What has THAT got to do with your statement that USAPA negotiators are incompetent?

First you say USAPA can't get a contract because of the Nic and now you say the company has every right to stall/delay because of the seniority battle.

I stand by my statement. If the company wanted a contract, they would be negotiating one right now, Nic be damned. But they aren't are they? They are waiting for their day in court, aren't they?

BTW, I never said $100 million was too much...it ain't near enough.

Driver B)

 

[CallawayGolf]

USAPA is a one trick pony entirely focused on seniority. Management knows this and I assume figures that USAPA will never bargain in good faith with the NIC issue unresolved in the minds of USAPA. So again, what is the point of taking negotiations seriously if the other side is only interested in one single point that they will never get via negotiations?

Management has a fiduciary responsibility to not make decisions that will place the shareholders into unnecessary legal liability. Abandoning the NIC would do just that. Besides, it's not like this all rests on how far Doug is willing to go to get a JCBA. Any contract proposed or accepted would have to be approved by the BOD who would have no interest at all in putting the company on the line just to give the east pilots a DOH contract. I am absolutely certain this would not happen and therefore Doug couldn't abandon the NIC even if he lost all of his mental faculties for the briefest of moments. So the day in court is the company's only course of action until and unless USAPA comes to act rationally.

I know you didn't say 100m was enough, I said that you were claiming that current negotiations were far less than that which still speaks of USAPAs incompetence. USAPA is no threat to anyone, especially Management's negotiating team.

 

[Ames]

P.S. Not all pilot wives agree with Missfit on everything, but 10 out of 10 agree a poster will rue the day he cavalierly tangles with her.

Yeah. "She" has me shaking in my boots.

 

[Ames]

BTW, missfit doesn't threaten me in the least since there's nothing "she" can say that affects me at all. I actually find "her" posts funny as the same crew room gossip spews forth claimed as being facts.

Jim

Yep. Exactly.

 

[Ames]

Always a lot to say, supposedly does not work here, but every waking moment just hanging around tossing molatovs...... you figure it out.

I do work here. Get a clue.

 

[mikey60]

Of course you have no way of validating that statement, but even if it were true that just means 90% of east pilots prefer to be lied to rather than think objectively about the truth of the situation for themselves. Not a very edifying commentary.

If it can be used as a barometer the pension investigation was passed by over 80% of East and West and of the West pilots over 40% .....FORE!

 

[Barrister]

You really do like to play fast and loose with facts. Read ALPA merger policy again and quote the EXACT verbiage of the part pertaining to windfall. It says no windfall at the expense of the other side. When you leave that part out it changes the entire meaning. The Nic award, and the resulting slotting of pilots based on category and class is not a windfall. And even if you personally consider it one (however irrelevant your opinion is to the process), it didn;t come at anyone's expense, since it keeps everyone about where they were the day before the merger.

So you are wrong. ALPA very much did honor and follow it's policies to the letter. Sorry, but you can't blame anyone else for what you have done except yourselves. I will say that you oldie, do have a persistent denial of reality and fact, and seem to favor an alternate reality you've fabricated in your mind. Keep clicking your heals. You'll never get your DOH pipe dream. And you'll never convince anyone of your propaganda, outside of your band of brothers.

Yea...and you care sooooooo much EXACTLY WHY PRAY TELL

NICDOA
NPJB

 

[mikey60]

Yes it does but not necessarily to the same amount. If something is frozen and then reduced does it revert to it's former amount when unfrozen?



That's something no one can argue with.

Jim

Correct James but do you know why.

 

[767jetz]

I lay this mess clearly on the desk of ALPA and Prater...

Of course you do.

 

[Ames]

Calloway, we on the East are just hanging out waiting for the LOA 93 to be ruled on. If we lose, then we move on.

Just curious. Move on how?