US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Black Swan]

I am really trying my very best to give you the benefit of the doubt. YES usapa is the successor usapa is not restricted from negotiating with LCC. I know for a fact that you are leaving out the rest of his statement and so do you! Dont do yourself an injustice, be true to thy self! State the rest of his comment...

While we wait for you to print the rest of his statement, lets discuss what we do know. One, we went to final and binding arbitration as agreed by all parties in the transition agreement (its this document by the way that will ultimatly end your case) Two, there has been no attempt to overturn the arbitration and absent that LCC will not violate the TA unless a court of law states that they would be immune from law suites. Three, getting that arbitration overturned is next to impossible and again absent that you no true legal ground in which to stand. LCC knows this but they want a court to tell you that fact. The list is going to be the NIC you can bank on that fact. Now you can kick hollar and scream but that wont change a thing and actually it would serve to further bring harm to the east.

The east is setting a really bad precedent by not honoring the arbitration. What happens if LCC stops honoring arbitrations and forces everything to court??? This is a reallly bad move...

AWA320

Ok, here is some more, and it even more damaging...... "The court also wrongly held that USAPA is bound by the Nicloau Award as the product of ALPA merger policy. ALPA merger policy is an internal union procedure. USAPA cannot be bound by ALPA merger policy, since it is not ALPA......" William Wilder Baptiste and Wilder Do you want some more? Let me know because there is a huge amount of this good stuff! Oh,the part about getting it overturned, and the fact nobody tried? We don't even need to, because we aren't using Nicolau in USAPA, get that part???

 

[Black Swan]

Hmmmm has Good ol Lee told you how he gets you out of that arbitration?? Me thinks not! Know why??? Cause he cant!! Now like I said before absent that arbitration being overturned you havent a legal leg to stand on. Trust and believe that LCC will not allow you to have them swinging in the breeze over this. They have done the risk assessment and know that a realignment of a list and payment to those effected would bury LCC for good!

AWA320

Sorry you missed out on this discussion for the last yr. of your absence. Nobody is trying to get it overturned, get it???? We just aren't using it. It is that simple. 😀 And the part about LCC or USAPA not honoring arbitrations between a union and the employer? Those will be honored, because they have to. That is readily acknowledged.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

It's pretty obvious to me that AWA320 is the guy (or one of the guys, anyway) that sold this bill of goods to the Westies, to the tune of at least 2 million bucks. Now, despite the evident realities, he feels he has to continue spewing more trash or his source of revenue to pay the legal fees will go away.

It's just more uninformed garbage. The company knows they have to deal with USAPA, not AOL, Doug even said so in his latest PHX crew news. That means, in short, that the Nic is DEAD. The ONLY reason he filed for a judicial ruling is to stretch this thing out for as long as he can. He even said that the ONLY reason this company is making money is because of the artificially low pay rates. Basically, no plan "B".

Where have I heard that before, and why does it bother me so much? I think one reason may be that Doug appears to be setting up to plead poverty when/if he loses the LOA 93 arbitration. We all know that running a successful company has always been second to raping employees in the airline industry.

 

[sumadarson]

The brochure AWA 320 sent to the West pilots recently.

AWA pilot leaders brochure.

 

[mikey60]

I am really trying my very best to give you the benefit of the doubt. YES usapa is the successor usapa is not restricted from negotiating with LCC. I know for a fact that you are leaving out the rest of his statement and so do you! Dont do yourself an injustice, be true to thy self! State the rest of his comment...

While we wait for you to print the rest of his statement, lets discuss what we do know. One, we went to final and binding arbitration as agreed by all parties in the transition agreement (its this document by the way that will ultimatly end your case) Two, there has been no attempt to overturn the arbitration and absent that LCC will not violate the TA unless a court of law states that they would be immune from law suites. Three, getting that arbitration overturned is next to impossible and again absent that you no true legal ground in which to stand. LCC knows this but they want a court to tell you that fact. The list is going to be the NIC you can bank on that fact. Now you can kick hollar and scream but that wont change a thing and actually it would serve to further bring harm to the east.

The east is setting a really bad precedent by not honoring the arbitration. What happens if LCC stops honoring arbitrations and forces everything to court??? This is a reallly bad move...

AWA320

AWA...

Did you go to law school ?

 

[sumadarson]

03 Nov, last Leonidas update.

"Tomorrow at 10AM, West attorneys Marty Harper, Andy Jacob, Kelly Flood and Katie Brown will be on hand to answer your questions. Much has changed since our last meet-and-greet with the attorneys last July, and much will be happening in the coming months. Location is same as before: Crowne Plaza, 4300 East Washington Blvd.

Sincerely,

Leonidas LLC "

How did the meeting go? How come it is almost a month since the last update? I heard that the meeting did not go well and you have contributors to your cause dropping out.

 

[Black Swan]

AWA...

Did you go to law school ?

As for me? Absolutely not an attorney. Not to say there aren't some in the family, but they are not labor attorneys. You don't have to be a pilot and an attorney to beat Harper and Jacobs. You just need to talk to the right people who DO know something about arbitration and labor law. And Baptiste and Wilder are spot on for reference. We told you long ago that Wake was in deep serious trouble when he made that court his hobby. You didn't listen. Who was right guys??? 😀 We also told you the 9th was coming our way too. Now we are going to give you one more lead. You are going nowhere with Judge Silver, except an exceedingly painful clarification on why the Nic will NOT be required, that is if she does not just reference the 9th with no comment. Probably will be so clear that you will not even be able to put your typical spin/slant on it without really looking far worse than the norm. But that would be surprising, as she is painfully aware of the fate of her judicial colleague Wake and what happened when he pontificated on something he never should have touched.

 

[AWA320]

Ok, here is some more, and it even more damaging...... "The court also wrongly held that USAPA is bound by the Nicloau Award as the product of ALPA merger policy. ALPA merger policy is an internal union procedure. USAPA cannot be bound by ALPA merger policy, since it is not ALPA......" William Wilder Baptiste and Wilder Do you want some more? Let me know because there is a huge amount of this good stuff! Oh,the part about getting it overturned, and the fact nobody tried? We don't even need to, because we aren't using Nicolau in USAPA, get that part???

Ok now I get it, you wish to be able to pick and choose which parts usapa inherited huh??? Let me say this again because you keep missing it and I know that its on purpose but such is life with you "Im entitled" types". If you can not get the arbitration overturned you have NO CASE. There is this law its called "CONTRACT LAW: maybe you've heard of it. There IS a contract between EAST, WEST and COMPANY! Its also refered to as THE TRANSITION AGREEMENT. You with me this far? East singed it, west signed it and LCC signed it. Would you like for me to read to you the sections governing seniority lists and how we all agreed to handle them?? If you cant read I will be more than happy to read it to you just say the word ok??

When you SIGN A CONTRACT YOU ARE BOUND TO THE TERMS OF SAID CONTRACT. I know it hurts BUT you can not breach a contract without severe penalty. Would you like me to go over breach of contract with you as well because again I dont mind?? LCC is not going to be placed in a position of beach because you can not seem to understand contract law.

Now for you and oldiebutgoodie, mike60, Lss and the rest of the group. The Nic will be the list going fwd so get this other nonsense out of your heads. You have no case what so ever and grasps at every straw that comes along. The sooner you understand that LCC will NOT ALLOW YOU TO PLACE THEM IN HARMS WAY the better off you all will be.

THE NIC WILL BE THE LIST GOING FORWARD...

AWA320

 

[luvthe9]

THE NIC WILL BE THE LIST GOING FORWARD...

AWA320

In your own mind and liittle world Skippy is the only place the NIC will be, cherish it. P.S. Are you still reading your old ALPA magazines!!!!

 

[AWA320]

As for me? Absolutely not an attorney. Not to say there aren't some in the family, but they are not labor attorneys. You don't have to be a pilot and an attorney to beat Harper and Jacobs. You just need to talk to the right people who DO know something about arbitration and labor law. And Baptiste and Wilder are spot on for reference. We told you long ago that Wake was in deep serious trouble when he made that court his hobby. You didn't listen. Who was right guys??? 😀 We also told you the 9th was coming our way too. Now we are going to give you one more lead. You are going nowhere with Judge Silver, except an exceedingly painful clarification on why the Nic will NOT be required, that is if she does not just reference the 9th with no comment. Probably will be so clear that you will not even be able to put your typical spin/slant on it without really looking far worse than the norm. But that would be surprising, as she is painfully aware of the fate of her judicial colleague Wake and what happened when he pontificated on something he never should have touched.

That is very telling of you knowledge of the law. Having read what you posted one would think that the case was dismissed on a number of procedural issues rather than ripeness. So ok I will play along because I know you are big on quotes. What was the quote coming out of the 9th???? Did it have something to do with "under the pain of an unquestionably ripe case" So my son how do we get there??? Pass a DOH list and get LCC to sign off on that and we are right there!!! This is where I would much rather be anyway because it a swift death to usapa as opposed to the slow blood letting thats going on now.

AWA320

 

[RSVP767]

Freighterguynow,

The east new hires will always vote with the east pilots for the quick upgrade. They will be Captains in 5 years!

Hate

And for the same reason, the East will always have the majority as long as we are under separate ops!

 

[oldiebutgoody]

He's got to keep up the B.S. He can't pay the legal bill by himself.

AWA320, I hope you didn't secure the legal team by mortgaging your house.

 

[AWA320]

03 Nov, last Leonidas update.

"Tomorrow at 10AM, West attorneys Marty Harper, Andy Jacob, Kelly Flood and Katie Brown will be on hand to answer your questions. Much has changed since our last meet-and-greet with the attorneys last July, and much will be happening in the coming months. Location is same as before: Crowne Plaza, 4300 East Washington Blvd.

Sincerely,

Leonidas LLC "

How did the meeting go? How come it is almost a month since the last update? I heard that the meeting did not go well and you have contributors to your cause dropping out.

It went very well thank you for asking. We mostly discussed your snapback wages. Hows that been working for you by the way?

Lowest pay till the last day right fellas? Just make sure you get my name correct on my PROFIT SHARING CHECK 😛

 

[oldiebutgoody]

...Lowest pay till the last day right fellas? Just make sure you get my name correct on my PROFIT SHARING CHECK 😛

Just think of all the badgebackers you can buy. No really. You may have to buy 'em.

 

[mikey60]

Boy are you in for a rude awakening.