US Pilots Labor Discussion

[end_of_alpa]

So now you want a national seniority list from ALPA. OK. Good thing you voted ALPA off the property so you can not get on that list. Leaves SWA, APA, UPS off as well.

Let me guess it would be DOH. But your DOH where? First commercial cert? First ALPA job? Can I get my commuter DOH? What happens if you work for an ALPA carrier, go to a non ALPA carrier and go back to an ALPA carrier? All of your time count only ALPA time count? What happens if the majority lose their minds and vote ALPA off all that time just go away?

So tell us. If there was a national list and AWA ans AAA merged. Would the east pilots on furlough come back as captains or would they be put at the bottom? How about AAA merging with AAA. How would that work?

Keep dreaming but there is no national list. Never going to happen. Pilots have arbitration. Either ALPA or A&M. Essentially the same process. Nicolau ruled that is our seniority list. Get used to it.

Your head in sand....we're used to it.

See you in court, oh and....

Good luck.

 

[Pi brat]

Calling mellow dramatic bs on that one. The ENTIRE EXERCISE was created, drafted, and executed with ulterior motives in an attempt put leverage in the Eastie hands. Well it blew up in Usapas face...like everything else. The whole thing was a pathetic charade. I would think you'd be too embarrassed to act like our intelligence wasn't insulted by the entire, pathetic exercise.

Let me be crystal clear..usapas fake, trumped up survey had NOTHING to do with safety and EVERYTHING to do with DOH. The company and every other living organism knows this. The shame is on your east pilots union lap.

ME, ME, ME, ME, ME. The constant song of so many westies. Believe it or not, everything in this world is not about you and the seniority fight. What in the world could it have had to do with DOH? Some people can separate things. Even if the safety survey had been developed for ulterior motives, you could have answered the questions truthfully, as I and most of the people I know did. That you and guys like you, on both sides, have to make every issue about the seniority fight is despicable. You are a disgrace to our profession, and pretty much the human race. You are no better than those you despise.

 

[nevergiveup]

Your head in sand....we're used to it.

See you in court, oh and....

Good luck.

Do it by age, Katie Scarlet, it's the only thing that matters!

 

[Res Judicata]

ME, ME, ME, ME, ME. The constant song of so many westies. Believe it or not, everything in this world is not about you and the seniority fight. What in the world could it have had to do with DOH? Some people can separate things. Even if the safety survey had been developed for ulterior motives, you could have answered the questions truthfully, as I and most of the people I know did. That you and guys like you, on both sides, have to make every issue about the seniority fight is despicable. You are a disgrace to our profession, and pretty much the human race. You are no better than those you despise.

Blah blah blah. We will have to agree to disagree on whom is a disgrace to the profession. Btw, I did answer the survey honestly. I emphatically denied there was even the slightest problem with the safety culture. It's fine. Not playing your pathetic game with safety. What a waste of time and money...truly the ONLY thing usapa has accomplished.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Sorry Pal, Some of my buddys from TWA are senior to me and I would be fine to them getting there jobs back...

Funny you should mention TWA. I'm a Westie furloughed from TWA. As you may know, the TWA pilots were denied the chance at arbitration and the APA got to impose the seniority list of their making. I have no idea if an arbitrator would've given us anything better but I sure would've liked the chance to find out. So now USAPA is trying to do to the West exactly what the APA did to the TWA pilots. Some company you find yourself with.

 

[mrbreeze]

USAPAWATCH.com Update: July 7, 2011

Watch what they do, not what they say

See Story

Why even bring this up? Just whining some more?

Of course anyone that has anything to do with USAPA wouldn't come within 100 miles of any kind of action that might be even remotely be considered against the contract.

breeze

 

[cactusboy53]

Nope...just talking to you like I talk to my little brother.

Speaking to my older brother: "Just because you are older and bigger doesn't make what you are doing right. I'm telling Mom and she'll fix you when she gets home. Mom doesn't like it when you bully me."

Can you take a wild guess who Mom will be portrayed by? Smile Bub, thus is drawing to a close (Gee, there have been 3 Leonidas updates in 6 days. I wonder where the USAPA legal updates are...and how great USAPA is doing?)

 

[nic4us]

I'm not playing any games with safety, you moron. You remember those accidents you guys like to throw around? Well, even though the vast majority of us have never put a scratch on an airplane or person, we all played a part on getting this airline on a firmer footing. A few people are not carrying that forward, for example using the training dept for discipline. We are safe, it's just that some of us see the trend line headed down, and power needs to be applied..................

I can see you at the supermarket, "Don't bruse my grapes your idiot, don't you know I'm already having a bad day because those mean old easties stole my seniority! Don't you know that! Are you in on it too!!!!!!! ARRRRRGGHG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Pi,

I agree 100% that training should not be used for discipline, however, the company used the excuse that they wanted to learn from the fuel school pilots and it was not intended as discipline. While I question that after the fact explanation, I will give the benefit of the doubt and let it lie. Now, I do not know how your contract works but on the West contract, if you get called in for training you get paid. So, the fuel school pilots were called in for training and paid to get the benefit of their experience so the company could understand the need for their method of operation. Big deal? If it was intended as punishment yes, but the company says it was not intended that way, and the fuel schoolers got paid, just not as much as outside consultants would have.

I did not take the safety survey, so I must ask, were there any questions on the survey regarding the safety of mixed east/West crews flying together? If so, it would seem that usapa was simply fishing for excuses to maintain seperate ops, regardless of any legal rulings regarding the Nic. So, now it seems we have usapa using safety as a bargaining tool and has made safety a seniority issue.

PS. I would not have boarded while MX was blocking the aisle. I have made that same decision numerous times and never heard one word from anybody other than the agent who seemed confused at the time.

 

[USA320Pilot]

USAPA's Safety Culture survey had questions created by the union to provide a desired result. To view the creditability of USAPA's Human Factors and Safety Culture expert click here.

How many of Unbiased Facts' facts in the article referenced in the previous sentence are wrong?

USAPA's "Be Onboard" and "Think Safety" campaign is a last ditch effort to pressure the company into granting DOH and negotiating a new contract. If successful USAPA would like the company to deal with a liability lawsuit filed by AOL. However, US Airways will not agree to USAPA's blackmail, USAPA will always be DFR, and the union cannot close a new contract because its C&BLs prevents a TA without DOH. However, USAPA's illegal job action strategy is backfiring with the company preparing for the lawsuit and terminating USAPA's zealots from employment. And, the terminations will not stop here and the potential for US Airways to prove harm by some of its pilots is a serious union/member liability risk. Remember AMR and APA's court battle in 1999. Could we see the same result here?

Separately, when is it o.k. to break a promise?

When is it o.k. to violate Section 4 of the Tranistion Agreement that requires USAPA to implement the Nicolau Award?

When is it o.k. for a group of pilots to use their voting majority to attempt to impose their will on a minority group?

When is it o.k. for a group of pilots to use their voting majority to attempt to staple 85% of another pilot group to the bottom of the joint seniority list?

I agree with USAPAWATCH. "You may want to think twice before donning your silly yellow lanyard."

 

[USA320Pilot]

I understand from another US Airways pilot that "The 'Safety First' campaign is clearly a directive from Captain Tom Kubic's safety committee to slow the operations down. Captain Kubic has been placed on notice officially by the company via a letter from LCC that he can be terminated if he continues. We'll see what kind of balls he and USAPA has moving forward."

Normally union officials have indemnity from termination actions; however, this is a very serious step in US Airways' response to the war started by USAPA.

Why has USAPA not informed the pilot group of this major development?

 

[luvthe9]

I understand from another US Airways pilot that "The "Safety First" campaign is clearly a directive from Captain Tom Kubic's safety committee to slow the operations down. Captain Kubic has been placed on notice officially by the company via a letter from LCC that he can be terminated if he continues. We'll see what kind of balls he and USAPA has moving forward.

Normally union officials have indemnity from termination actions; however, this is a very serious step in US Airways' response to the war started by USAPA.

Why has USAPA not informed the pilot group of this major development?

Tell us about when you were fired from the company. What did you do to get your job back? I don't think you would want the anyone to know.

 

[luvthe9]

I understand from another US Airways pilot that "The 'Safety First' campaign is clearly a directive from Captain Tom Kubic's safety committee to slow the operations down. Captain Kubic has been placed on notice officially by the company via a letter from LCC that he can be terminated if he continues. We'll see what kind of balls he and USAPA has moving forward."

Normally union officials have indemnity from termination actions; however, this is a very serious step in US Airways' response to the war started by USAPA.

Why has USAPA not informed the pilot group of this major development?

You are the Rupert Murdoch of this board, with your yellow journalism.

 

[767one]

I understand from another US Airways pilot that "The 'Safety First' campaign is clearly a directive from Captain Tom Kubic's safety committee to slow the operations down. Captain Kubic has been placed on notice officially by the company via a letter from LCC that he can be terminated if he continues. We'll see what kind of balls he and USAPA has moving forward."

Normally union officials have indemnity from termination actions; however, this is a very serious step in US Airways' response to the war started by USAPA.

Why has USAPA not informed the pilot group of this major development?

Could be several reasons why this has not been done for instance maybe Capt Kubic has not "been placed on notice". If he has been placed on notice it could just be a company fishing expedition. Maybe you are right but I think your problem is that you post many facts that never stand up so many people just don't listen to you. As some posters are fond of saying........proof!

Bob

 

[Piedmont1984]

I understand from another US Airways pilot that "The 'Safety First' campaign is clearly a directive from Captain Tom Kubic's safety committee to slow the operations down. Captain Kubic has been placed on notice officially by the company via a letter from LCC that he can be terminated if he continues. We'll see what kind of balls he and USAPA has moving forward."

Normally union officials have indemnity from termination actions; however, this is a very serious step in US Airways' response to the war started by USAPA.

Why has USAPA not informed the pilot group of this major development?

Is this a major development, or another pilot's opinion? How does this other pilot have access to such information? You have posted an unsubstantiated allegation - not an unbiased fact.

I will take more notice when you supply some hard facts.

 

[767one]

USAPA's Safety Culture survey had questions created by the union to provide a desired result. To view the creditability of USAPA's Human Factors and Safety Culture expert click here.

How many of Unbiased Facts' facts in the article referenced in the previous sentence are wrong?

USAPA's "Be Onboard" and "Think Safety" campaign is a last ditch effort to pressure the company into granting DOH and negotiating a new contract. If successful USAPA would like the company to deal with a liability lawsuit filed by AOL. However, US Airways will not agree to USAPA's blackmail, USAPA will always be DFR, and the union cannot close a new contract because its C&BLs prevents a TA without DOH. However, USAPA's illegal job action strategy is backfiring with the company preparing for the lawsuit and terminating USAPA's zealots from employment. And, the terminations will not stop here and the potential for US Airways to prove harm by some of its pilots is a serious union/member liability risk. Remember AMR and APA's court battle in 1999. Could we see the same result here?

Separately, when is it o.k. to break a promise?

When is it o.k. to violate Section 4 of the Tranistion Agreement that requires USAPA to implement the Nicolau Award?

When is it o.k. for a group of pilots to use their voting majority to attempt to impose their will on a minority group?

When is it o.k. for a group of pilots to use their voting majority to attempt to staple 85% of another pilot group to the bottom of the joint seniority list?

I agree with USAPAWATCH. "You may want to think twice before donning your silly yellow lanyard."

Thank you so very very much on the excellent advice about wearing my silly little yellow lanyard. Because of your advice I now know beyond a doubt the proper thing to do is to..............................wear the lanyard!!

Thank you, thank you very much


Bob