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AAA ALPA Thread 9-7 to 9-13

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Do you consider Garland a liar?

Garland does what Garland thinks will keep Garland in a happy seat at the top of what ever union is on the property. His blustering about being a tough union fighter (instead of being someone who loves ALPA and agrees with giving away the pension, etc.) is only because he realizes that USAPA is a real likelyhood, and Garland needs to position himself to be one of the "believers" who can be elected when it happens.
 
Luckily, in about 6 years, maybe more or less, you can do what you want if you're still battling east west. By then the bulk of us on the east will be retired. If your speaking to the east as a whole, then you are directing it at me personally. I am not nuts when it comes to seeing ALPA removed from the property. Thanks for the tacit admission that USAPA has a chance.

If the past under ALPA is an indication, then I'll gladly take my chances. To devolve back to a framework as before is a choice unto itself. At least this time I will get a vote to do it. And believe me the USAPA leadership are not idiots. If they were, how could we have achieved what we have in so little amount of time? It looks like your blending the east ALPA leadership and USAPA's. They are in no way connected.

Since the East agreed to a binding arbitration and since the successor union will inherit the executory obligations from the previous union, I presume USAPA will have a provision in their bylaws to support and defend the Nicolau Award, right? I mean, no fences, no restrictions - just an unconditional implementation of Nicolau along with the CBA. Am I right?
 
Lets give Junebug credit. He's been our biggest help from the west. I have collected a lot of cards from his posts alone. Even from a fence sitter classmate last week. (see previous posts somewhere) As for AWA320, now thats another story. If he really has seen the Wilson polling, how can that be? I kind of think it's another ALPA blunder. Just one more to add to the list.
Ha!! If those idiots need my help convincing them, then you guys are doing a great sell job.

P.S. How about a little something for the effort?
 
Since the East agreed to a binding arbitration and since the successor union will inherit the executory obligations from the previous union, I presume USAPA will have a provision in their bylaws to support and defend the Nicolau Award, right? I mean, no fences, no restrictions - just an unconditional implementation of Nicolau along with the CBA. Am I right?

Sure if we are all happy family in the new USAPA then we want you you to feel good. You can propose for seniority to be determined by the Nic award. We can all vote on it.
 
He's not a liar. Just stating his opinion. That's what In my View means. Or did that statement escape you? I never support someone who I share an opposing opinion with. Which is most of the time with him. But that's me.
OK, ladies, I take this real slow.

1. Garland's blast is posted.

2. USA320Pilot sends an email agreeing with Garland "100%."

3. I reference Garland's post.

4. USA320Pilot accuses me of spreading bad info - info that I got from Garland's post and that he agreed with 100%.

5. USA320Pilot backtracks.

Dear Fellow Pilot,

Garland's comments that attached are 100% accurate and I totally agree with him. Furthermore, his comment that "If this MEC doesn't have the fighting spirit to meet all comers in stopping the implementation of the Nicolau Award, even in 100 degree heat in PHX, then I belong in a Union who does."

For those of you fence sitters, do you want ALPA International Negotiating for you instead of your own pilot group? Or would it be better to have a union that has US Airways pilots negotiating for US Airways pilots?

I know for fact that ALPA is scared about being replaced and I wonder why? It is clear that we are approaching the reconciliation of our problems. What is not clear is who will negotiate for you.

Regards,

Cxxx
Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.



So which is it:

1. Is Garland spreading bad info?

or

2. Is Garland 100% correct?
 
Sure if we are all happy family in the new USAPA then we want you you to feel good. You can propose for seniority to be determined by the Nic award. We can all vote on it.

So what you're saying is that the new USAPA believes it can rewrite that which is not rewritable? Well, that's going to be a problem with the AWA pilots and trust me, we'll do something about that. Secondly, the law is going to be a bit of a problem for USAPA if anything is done that directly or indirectly undermines USAPA's inherited obligations. Ergo, Nic is untouchable and that's not an opinion of a newly licensed attorney, but rather from a respected firm that has successfully litigated in this field for quite a while. I suggest that you read the Seham letter again.
 
Wish I could take credit for this post, but alas, I cannot. I italicized it so as not to mistakenly be given credit for such a fine piece of work.

Anyway, parse away:

Total pilots 6676
AWA 1853
AAA 4823
Active AAA 3177
Furlough 1346

Removing retirements and the furloughs not returning, total pilots to vote decertification about 5200. By the end of the year no more furloughs. The new hires do not have a dog in this fight.

In order to decert you need 50% plus 1. Votes needed 2601

You know that not everyone votes in any vote. So if a large percentage do vote call it 75%

5200x75%=3900 votes AWA 1850x75%=1387 AAA 3350x75%=2513

If 10 % of the AWA pilots are mad at ALPA nation you get 139 yes votes.

Votes needed 2601-139=2462 Votes available from the east 2513

East votes needed to decertify ALPA 2462/2513=97.9% yes votes needed to decertify.

In other words everyone but 51 voting pilots need to vote yes to pull off your dream.
However the award and your contract still stand. Good luck looks like an up hill fight to me.
 
We already know you are a liar, Junebug, thanks to your repeated lies about seeing the Wilson poll results.

Now we know you are dumber than dirt. The rambling summary of NMB procedures you posted is absolute nonsense, and comes after multiple explanations of the correct procedures on this board. It isn't that difficult to grasp, so read carefully:

We need 50% + 1 to trigger a representational election. Got that?

In the representational election, if 50% + 1 cast ballots, then the union that receives the most votes is the winner. Got it?

If USAPA receives 2000 votes and ALPA receives 1700, then USAPA wins. Memorize the following:

If a majority of eligible voters in the craft or class vote for representation, then the organization that receives the majority of the votes cast "wins" the election.


No wonder your bretheren didn't want you in a leadership role. You're not intelligent enough. :down:
 
We already know you are a liar, Junebug, thanks to your repeated lies about seeing the Wilson poll results.

We need 50% + 1 to trigger a representational election. Got that?

Um.... I think thats what Junebug was saying. At least thats how I understood it. Only thing wrong is the "+1". So instead of 51, the number should be 50.
 
We already know you are a liar, Junebug, thanks to your repeated lies about seeing the Wilson poll results.

Now we know you are dumber than dirt. The rambling summary of NMB procedures you posted is absolute nonsense, and comes after multiple explanations of the correct procedures on this board. It isn't that difficult to grasp, so read carefully:

We need 50% + 1 to trigger a representational election. Got that?

In the representational election, if 50% + 1 cast ballots, then the union that receives the most votes is the winner. Got it?

If USAPA receives 2000 votes and ALPA receives 1700, then USAPA wins. Memorize the following:

If a majority of eligible voters in the craft or class vote for representation, then the organization that receives the majority of the votes cast "wins" the election.


No wonder your bretheren didn't want you in a leadership role. You're not intelligent enough. :down:

Hey tardo, reread my post. We actually agree on something!!

You're a mental giant!!!

And the Wilson poll says you're going to cave!!

Just ask Garland.

BOS Pilots,

Head's up, and you're hearing it first.

In my view:

1. The Rice Committee is going nowhere in formulating a "consensual solution" acceptable to either East or West. They're on square one, and will remain there.

2. As a result of ALPA National's poll of US Airways pilots, Prater, the Executive Council and the Rice Committee now believe that the East pilots have a price at which they can be bribed to accept the Nicolau Award.

3. The AWA Executive Vice President (EVP), representing them on the Executive Council (we don't have an EVP of our own, because some members of our MEC voted for an Atlantic Southeast pilot instead), will be bringing a Resolution before the EC later this month that will force the immediate release of the Nicolau Award.

4. As we on the East are no longer participating in JNC negotiations until we reach Pay Parity with the West, ALPA National may be informing us shortly that they intend to negotiate at the JNC in our behalf.

5. The MEC's decision to not follow through with our "Pay Parity Now" Picketing event at the Company's HQ in Tempe was a huge mistake, and will be viewed by Prater, the EC, the West and Doug Parker as a weakening in our resolve to remain a separate operation with a separate, equivalent value contract (after all, the mover of that Resolution voted against taking our fight to PHX, and the seconder's votes weren't even counted, as he neither showed up nor left his proxy).

I see a sellout coming, and I'm no longer sure who is really for or against it.

As I've told you, not on my watch. If this MEC doesn't have the fighting spirit to meet all comers in stopping the implementation of the Nicolau Award, even in 100 degree heat in PHX, then I belong in a Union who does.

We shall soon see.

Garland
"You must take the war to the enemy. You must attack and go on attacking all the time."
— Major Willy Omer François Jean Coppens de Houthulst, Belgian Air Service, 37 victories W.W.I..
 
Um.... I think thats what Junebug was saying. At least thats how I understood it. Only thing wrong is the "+1". So instead of 51, the number should be 50.

His thread was nonsense. He can't grasp that once we get 50% + 1 to call for an election, we do not need 50% + 1 of the pilot group to win the election. All we need is a majority of votes cast. If we win 1700 to 1600, we win the election. We do not, as he stated need 2462 out of 2513 East votes in the election. The man is dense. No wonder the west union wanted nothing to do with him.

There is no intelligent life in Tempe. :lol:
 
You're a mental giant!!!

Thanks for the complement. Wish I could return it. You've been claiming to have read the Wilson results since before they were collated and released! I knew the staus of the results when I saw your posts, proof positive that you and your defective friend AWA320 were lying through your teeth. :down:


By the way, can you clarify the following idiocy for us again. How many votes do we need in an election to avoid a "sellout?" :lol:

If 10 % of the AWA pilots are mad at ALPA nation you get 139 yes votes.

Votes needed 2601-139=2462 Votes available from the east 2513

East votes needed to decertify ALPA 2462/2513=97.9% yes votes needed to decertify.

In other words everyone but 51 voting pilots need to vote yes to pull off your dream.
However the award and your contract still stand. Good luck looks like an up hill fight to me.[/i]

I don't pay too much attention to Garland Jones. He is a bigger drama queen than you are. :lol:
 
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