ALPA/USAPA topic of the week 2/13-2/19

[nostradamus]

Vote how you wish, but don't even start bagging on AW and their pilots. Anyone from a company with your safety record has NO room to talk.

Please comment on the American Airlines, and South West safety record. Recent history only needed.

If you have time please comment on your pilots that flew drunk, your ceo that drove drunk, the ufo sighting, the pilot that was taken off an airplane for psychological problems and the time your pilot director of ops, chief pilot and flight crew manager who flew drugs. All these pilots were convicted of their crimes. Take any time you need to defend the unconscionable acts your pilots and ceo committed over the years.

 

[nostradamus]

america west pilots resopnse

 

[LOA93]

your ceo that drove drunk

Correction..."our ceo"

 

[nostradamus]

Correction..."our ceo"

No, he is america wests ceo, US Airways and america west pilots are run separately.

Your post below, welcome to the board.

LOA93
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Posted on: Jan 8 2008, 10:19 AM


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QUOTE (BuffaloJoe @ Jan 7 2008, 08:10 PM) *
They have a flight 257 schedule departing at 8:50pm. Is that basically a repositioning flight? I would think a PHL-LAX would work at 9pm before a PHX.


I flew it the other night and it was pretty full. The problem is it's 12:30am by the time you get to PHX so you really can't connect to anywhere. LAX would have been smarter but like you said, it might a repo flight.

 

[700UW]

Nos,

Nice try but Doug is CEO of US Airways, West and East. America West doesnt exsist anymore.

 

[end_of_alpa]

"In exchange for the stake in the combined airline, the pilot groups would help speed up the integration by agreeing in advance to contract terms, and by resolving issues related to job seniority at their current airlines. If these issues can be resolved quickly, the merger could be announced next week, the sources said."

http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/t...st-merger_N.htm

LESSON LEARNED: MANAGEMENT LEADING THE WAY....NOT ALPA!

WHEN USAPA CLEANS THIS MESS UP THEN, AND ONLY THEN, WILL WE BECOME A MERGER PLAYER!

 

[end_of_alpa]

"The unions have no formal right to approve or prevent a merger....."

"The difficulties are clear from the most recent airline merger, which combined US Airways and America West in 2005. To date, not a single combined contract has been signed by any of the airline's major unions, Roach notes."

"In fact, many US Airways pilots are threatening to leave ALPA and form a new union because of a questionable seniority ruling that would force hundreds of pilots with 15 years or more in the cockpit to become junior to pilots employed by the company for only a few years.

"The US Airways situation has been very disruptive, but it is not atypical," Roach argues. "I'm not aware of any airline merger in my 30 years that went smooth and worked effectively.....Roach says he has been unable to ascertain Delta's views and Northwest has not kept the IAM informed of the progress of merger talks.

"We are the certified bargaining agent," Roach says. "We should be kept informed."

http://www.thestreet.com/s/machinists-unio...c=cnnmoney&

Bob Roach of the IAM has got the management side of the equation figured out in this article. If ANYONE NEEDS to understand the principles of unionism the best, you should give THIS MAN A CALL!!! The mix of non-unionized workers and workers WITH a union combined with a "questionable" valuation policy regarding workers which MAY lead to force reductions and LAYOFFS, such as what the pilots here at US Airways went through, is causing GREAT CONSTERNATION among the powers that be to put such power houses together. Negotiate FIRST, then MERGE. LESSON LEARNED, brought to you by ALPA. Management WON'T keep the IAM informed because the issue of merging with their respective unions is generally straight forward...DOH.

Anyone....Bueller, Bueller???

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

This is the USAPA phone message for Wednesday, February 13th, 2008

As mentioned in the last message, we held our second Road Show in CLT on February 8th. Speakers discussed a variety of topics including the various insurance and Aeromedical options that will be available; USAPA President Stephen Bradford pointed out that, unlike ALPA, insurance and Aeromedical will be available to members and non-members alike, and will be fully portable. Throughout the day, USAPA attorneys, officers and volunteers responded to a wide variety of questions and concerns from the pilots. For the benefit of those unable to attend this Road Show, like the PHL Road Show, it was professionally video-taped. Click on the Road Show link on the USAirlinePilots.org web site for Road Show information and videos. Also, we are in the process of creating DVDs of both Road Shows. As your USAPA Officers and volunteers are still required to fly full schedules, the exact timing of the next Road Show has yet to be determined.

The NMB has received the Company's Eligibility List, and we are examining the list for accuracy. We anticipate that the NMB will issue a Finding of Dispute in one to two weeks; the ballots could issue in as little as 3 to 4 weeks with the vote count 30 days after. Based upon what we know, an estimated election date could be around the 7th to 14th of March, with a count 30 days later. All timings are estimated and ultimately determined by the NMB.

We urge all pilots to update their address with the Company; it is this address to which the NMB will send voting instructions. Pilots may update their address via The Hub, or by calling their chief pilot's office. It is also imperative that all pilots ensure they are in good standing with ALPA, so they may reject any sort of hurried TA. If you are in Bad Standing and are considering donating to USAPA, please instead use that money to bring yourself in to Good Standing. This must be done immediately to ensure you retain control of your future. Instructions for returning to Good Standing can be found on the USAirlinePilots.org web site; on the home page click on the "Bad Standing" link. Give us a call if you have any questions.

We have heard a smattering of rumors regarding denied jumpseats. We urge all US Airways pilots, regardless of opinions on the upcoming election, to show their fellow pilots the courtesy and respect we all deserve. All are entitled to an opinion, even if it does not align with your own.

We have noted that ALPA remains "concerned" with USAPA's law firm - we think this is a good thing. We are very pleased with the advice and service we have received and find that our law firm fares very well in any ethical comparison to ALPA Nationals choice. The current AWA Chairman and the ALPA president have both used the services of USAPA's law firm in the past and thanked them in writing. In any case, remember that our choice of law firms has no bearing on the question at hand.

In closing, as we have mentioned, you may anticipate a barrage of communications from the current collective bargaining agent over the next few weeks. We suggest that you stay informed and stop by the USAPA web site often for updated information - in particular have a quick look at the updated "Rumor Control" section. Informed, you'll find it will be fairly easy to determine the motivations behind the various communications. As always, please contact us by phone or email with your questions, concerns and suggestions. USAPA is your union, but to truly make it so we need to hear from you.

Fly safe, and thank you for your continuing support.

 

[wopr21]

LESSON LEARNED: MANAGEMENT LEADING THE WAY....NOT ALPA!

WHEN USAPA CLEANS THIS MESS UP THEN, AND ONLY THEN, WILL WE BECOME A MERGER PLAYER!

Yes,The company has responded in a timely manner with the NMB requests, because they want to get a contract ASAP. They don't care who the bargaining agent is , they just want to negotiate and get a contract in place for any mergers possibilities.
Hopefully things will change soon so we can get a contract we can all live with.

Regards,

wopr21

 

[flyinawa]

WHEN USAPA CLEANS THIS MESS UP THEN, AND ONLY THEN, WILL WE BECOME A MERGER PLAYER!

(yawn) Whatever.

 

[tripnic1]

end of alpa,

It looks like you are a USAPA insider. So I have a question. I like the election process and contract approval clauses that USAPA has proposed in their constitution. Good stuff. The consternation I have is that having pilot representatives is not all that different from ALPA. I was hoping for something a little more radical. Why not have full time professionals represent us? I just don't see that there's a huge difference between two unions that both have elected pilots running the show.

Looking forward to your input,

-TripNic-

 

[end_of_alpa]

end of alpa,

It looks like you are a USAPA insider. So I have a question. I like the election process and contract approval clauses that USAPA has proposed in their constitution. Good stuff. The consternation I have is that having pilot representatives is not all that different from ALPA. I was hoping for something a little more radical. Why not have full time professionals represent us? I just don't see that there's a huge difference between two unions that both have elected pilots running the show.

Looking forward to your input,

-TripNic-

Remember, we have a union...and that the major part of the problem is PILOT involvement or the LACK thereof. If all pilots, East and West, would have been educated from early on in our careers on how the fundamentals of unionism work...we wouldn't be here right now. However, the pilot reps IS different because WE ELECT OUR OFFICERS...NOT OUTSIDERS! That right there is a HUGE difference.

Election is a part of the DEMOCRATIC process. The courts look at labor unions as a DEMOCRATIC microcosm of our society...broken down into a craft and/or class. Much like a guild. The difference between us and a guild, however, is that the guild controls the license of whatever it is they do that is so special, like plumbers and steamfitters. Their STAMP OF APPROVAL. You can't get the license without the apprenticeship in the guild. Loose your membership, loose your license. Not so with pilots. We let the government issue the license...hence no unity or guild mentality with pilots. It's every man for himself....something Behncke tried and failed to establish. Pilots are TOO smart to recognize the fundamental principles.....hence the "whipsaw" we see now.

As far as "radical" is concerned, the reason for the USAPA structure being "mirrored" after APA was to prevent any representational violations from occurring in court if USAPA gets voted in. Radical is something you do after measured thought among a COMPLETE group and not an "experiment"on a group of "East versus West" or vice versa.

 

[prechilill]

Remember, we have a union...and that the major part of the problem is PILOT involvement or the LACK thereof. If all pilots, East and West, would have been educated from early on in our careers on how the fundamentals of unionism work...we wouldn't be here right now. However, the pilot reps IS different because WE ELECT OUR OFFICERS...NOT OUTSIDERS! That right there is a HUGE difference.

Why don't you guys discuss this USAPA stuff on your own exclusive USAPA message board? You know, the one that no West pilots are allowed on to in the spirit of keeping your little union efforts strictly confidential with the east pilots. Heaven forbid if USAPA actually were to show any across the board unity in their desires to promote "fairness" for all- that would run completely counter to the founding fathers' principle of "protecting our seniority".

 

[sharktooth]

Why don't you guys discuss this USAPA stuff on your own exclusive USAPA message board? You know, the one that no West pilots are allowed on to in the spirit of keeping your little union efforts strictly confidential with the east pilots. Heaven forbid if USAPA actually were to show any across the board unity in their desires to promote "fairness" for all- that would run completely counter to the founding fathers' principle of "protecting our seniority".

I am no "insider" with USAPA but the message board was shuttered last fall, I think. I remember seeing a message to that effect and have not tried to access since. They specified "issues" of having a forum and not including everyone. I thought it was an intelligent move.

Next question.

 

[EastUS]

Why don't you guys discuss this USAPA stuff on your own exclusive USAPA message board? You know, the one that no West pilots are allowed on to in the spirit of keeping your little union efforts strictly confidential with the east pilots. Heaven forbid if USAPA actually were to show any across the board unity in their desires to promote "fairness" for all- that would run completely counter to the founding fathers' principle of "protecting our seniority".

Do I have this right? = An open discussion's occurring here, and you would rather it be held on some "strictly confidential" site instead...so that you'd then have something "justifiable" to whine about?

A minor question: How does anything that serves to "promote fairness for all" logically run at all counter to "protecting our seniority"? :blink: Ooops.... I forgot for a moment: prechilill: "Ho Ho Ho!..St Nic is coming to town!"