Defend Recall Rights, Defend Our Careers

[MCI transplant]

<_< ----- Just another piece of evidence for that law suit nr!!!

 

[eolesen]

He just sent another gem.
Since when can OCR's use their official title in expressing their private opinions, as opposed to the union's policy, to corporate executives?

Do you know for a fact that the title was used in the email to Arpey? Or is that an assumption based on what was posted (and reposted by you?) on a private chat room?

There also a chance that he's presenting the viewpoint of his "constituancy"... Even though it might violate the union's standards for communicating around the elected leadership, it's no different to me than when a certain base chair from SLT disagreed publically with then-president John Ward.

Something else to consider is that if he is DFW based, there's a good chance that he's been in face to face meetings with Arpey, and this may or may not have been discussed informally or in meetings with Overland.

 

[AC AA LA FA]

Do you know for a fact that the title was used in the email to Arpey? Or is that an assumption based on what was posted (and reposted by you?) on a private chat room?

There also a chance that he's presenting the viewpoint of his "constituancy"... Even though it might violate the union's standards for communicating around the elected leadership, it's no different to me than when a certain base chair from SLT disagreed publically with then-president John Ward.

Something else to consider is that if he is DFW based, there's a good chance that he's been in face to face meetings with Arpey, and this may or may not have been discussed informally or in meetings with Overland.

I can pretty much assure you that JN has been involved in ZERO meetings involving OGR (Overland)-

 

[nbmcg01]

I can pretty much assure you that JN has been involved in ZERO meetings involving OGR (Overland)-

LOL!!! My favorite saying about JN..His arrogance is only exceeded by his ignorance.



JN wants his name in lights. He wants to stir up issues that are only real in HIS mind. I can easily pick apart his argument without even taking a deep breath.

1. Seniority is not an issue. The fates have made their decision. People just want to come back to work to finish their career. Pay, yes we were given pay seniority BY THE COMPANY. It wasn't an issue then, why should it be now? The APFA had NOTHING to do with pay seniority. In fact JW was furious we were given one penny over new hire pay. That was the driving factor in his giving away furlough pay for no credit. Still narrow sighted, JN has not understood how the f/a job is devalued by his and JWs position. They have validated the Company's position that we should all work for new hire wages. After all, we are JUST the little girls in the back.

2. Insurance. Insurance is negotiated yearly. In a Company the size of AA, 2 thousand f/as of ALL ages is not going to significantly change the bottom line. Ah that we had that much power! Smoke and mirrors. Anyone returning still has to be able to pass medical.

3. Why can't we just get along? lol Much ado about nothing. The former TWA f/as are first and foremost professionals. On the property, on the plane, there would be no problems. You have people (whom for some unknown reason) really want to fly. Maybe to be able to retire and have at least passes to show for 30 plus years of industry work.
Doesn't mean we have to go to dinner or the mall together, but ON THE PLANE, you will see nothing but the best. AA states they don't know if we can buy into their corporate culture. That may be the highest compliment our group has ever been paid. Even during post strike/lockout, our f/as have never been nicknamed anything close to the AA f/a name, (except maybe by my ex..lol). ps..Just what is the official definition of AA's Corporate Culture? I have both PanAm and TWA under my belt. AA would be hard pressed to top the service reputations of those plus my 350 TWA commendation letters and the 30 I received in one year flying as an American f/a. I find it interesting that AA is so worried about the girls and yet never blinked as eye at the ramp or mechanics. Could it be a "little girl" thing. I think so.

I don't believe for one second that JN speaks for anyone but himself. If there was ever a reason to invoke Art. 32, I think you've just seen a fine example.

 

[Fang]

I have only posted here one other time, but I do not know why this is such a hot topic.

The TWA F/A's will probably never be recalled. In my opinion this is a shame. As a traveling passenger, I was not thrilled at all with the AA takover of TWA. Would TWA of made it after 9/11? I think so, it would not of been easy, but I NEVER have seen a more loyal group of workers than those who worked for TWA. I think it is a shame that union workers have so many arguments about others trying to work. I would think that all people involved would want AA to do so well that these F/A's are recalled. This will probably never happen.

It is not the fault of the employees of TWA what happened to the airline. It is the fault of the management. These TWA employees have my respect and full support. They went through very tough times and ALWAYS gave great service with a smile.

In all my flights with AA, most F/A's are not nearly as nice and personable as those on TWA. As a passenger, its like why are you here?

I am going to be flying this winter to BKK. On a recent flight to SJU, I asked a F/A about the AA flights to NRT. She told me "don't fly with AA, the service on these routes is very poor." I thanked her for her honesty. I can not remember poor service on a TWA flight. Sure I may be looking at the past through "rose colored glasses", but I have to honestly say these TWA F/A's are very good.

As a traveling passenger, I would rather have a F/A with a lot of expierence compared to one with less, but then again thats just me.

I have no idea why a TWA F/A would want to go back to work for AA, given what is said in this forum. I guess this is the way AA looks at all TWA staff. But as union members they should be given support. It may be them this time, but who knows who it will be next time.

 

[TWskyliner]

I have only posted here one other time, but I do not know why this is such a hot topic.

The TWA F/A's will probably never be recalled. In my opinion this is a shame. As a traveling passenger, I was not thrilled at all with the AA takover of TWA. Would TWA of made it after 9/11? I think so, it would not of been easy, but I NEVER have seen a more loyal group of workers than those who worked for TWA. I think it is a shame that union workers have so many arguments about others trying to work. I would think that all people involved would want AA to do so well that these F/A's are recalled. This will probably never happen.

It is not the fault of the employees of TWA what happened to the airline. It is the fault of the management. These TWA employees have my respect and full support. They went through very tough times and ALWAYS gave great service with a smile.

In all my flights with AA, most F/A's are not nearly as nice and personable as those on TWA. As a passenger, its like why are you here?

I am going to be flying this winter to BKK. On a recent flight to SJU, I asked a F/A about the AA flights to NRT. She told me "don't fly with AA, the service on these routes is very poor." I thanked her for her honesty. I can not remember poor service on a TWA flight. Sure I may be looking at the past through "rose colored glasses", but I have to honestly say these TWA F/A's are very good.

As a traveling passenger, I would rather have a F/A with a lot of expierence compared to one with less, but then again thats just me.

I have no idea why a TWA F/A would want to go back to work for AA, given what is said in this forum. I guess this is the way AA looks at all TWA staff. But as union members they should be given support. It may be them this time, but who knows who it will be next time.

Thank you Fang for your post. AA thinks that we do not fit into their corporate culture, and they say that they will not be extending the recall rights (unlike virtually every other airline effected by 9-11 did.) Like nbmcg01 has said this is about ALL furloughed aa flight attendants not just former TWA. The union seems to be willing to let 1000 naatives be thrown under the bus in order to prevent the former TWA flight attendants from returning. The Co has said that they will not give the furloughed flight attendants even preferential hiring when hiring begins again (most likely the day after the last furloughed flight attendants recall rights expire.)
APFA's apathy toward their furloughed members is disgraceful.

 

[TWAnr]

Do you know for a fact that the title was used in the email to Arpey? Or is that an assumption based on what was posted (and reposted by you?) on a private chat room?

I posted exactly what he posted elsewhere. The only editing I did was to replace his full name with his initials. I added absolutely nothing to the text in the quotation box.

Until I read this email of his, I don't even recall that I was aware that he was an OCR.

 

[galleyguy4u2]

This is a post from J.N.
Posts Sept 14, 2006:

You guys won't BELIEVE this one !!!

APFA Attempts To Keep Picketers Refreshed At OUR Expense!

The saga of the TWA picketers at APFA continues, and it gets even
more ridiculous.

If this were not so laughable, I wouldn't believe it myself. Last
Friday between 25-35 former TWA Flight Attendants picketed APFA
demanding Tommie fight for extension of their recall rights. While
out in front of APFA picketing and speaking to the press against the
APFA and its membership, the APFA ordered drinks, bottled water and
pizza for them at APFA expense. Yes, food and drink was ordered for
them and paid for out of the APFA Treasury! When it was offered to
the picketers, it was turned away after they learned it was paid for
by the APFA. What added to the laughable factor is that all four of
the national officers were actually in the building on a Friday
afternoon, but witnesses never saw them interacting with the
picketers. They must have known that the picketing was planned well
in advance.

Since when does the APFA use our union dues to pay for refreshments
for people picketing our union? Is this a sensible way to spend our
union dues? Keep in mind those picketing the APFA last Friday do
not pay union dues because they are on furlough and furloughed
members have no obligation to pay union dues.

END

Apparently this is true...but none of the officers went outside
to "greet" the picketers...nonetheless...the last time I picketed
at APFA I don't remember getting refreshments and I'm a dues paying
member !!!

Jay Narey
IDF
-----
Jay wrote:
Apparently this is true...but none of the officers went outside
to "greet" the picketers...nonetheless...the last time I picketed
at APFA I don't remember getting refreshments and I'm a dues paying
member !!!

Jay Narey

Yes Jay you are a dues paying member!!! but you seem to forget two
things:

a).- You are not a former TWA'er and
B).- You did not vote this administration so they would get into office.
You think they would care about the current dues paying
members? the ones actually paying their salary? I doubt that very much

JMHO
Maurilio
JFK





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------





First of all this J.N. guy needs to see a shrink. As I was one of the picketers that day I can tell you that THB, Ms. Kroll and Leslie Mayo did indeed spend time with us on the picket line.

We did not need anything in the form of food or beverages from APFA, although it was offered. We politely declined.

I just do not understand why you are afraid of us. We will not take your seniority, we will not take your pensions. The only thing we want is for those with 20+ years to be able to retire with dignity. The last TWA BK was forced on us by AMR to get rid of Uncle Carl's cheap INTERNET tickets and also to remove other debt. We were promised Two Great Airlines and One Great Future.

All I can say is what goes around comes around.

 

[Nor'Easta]

All I can say is what goes around comes around.

Hmmmm let's see...


1. American Airlines Headquarters in Texas

2. President Bush from Texas

3. See above in bold

Do you think it still comes around?

 

[galleyguy4u2]

Texas[/b]

2. President Bush from Texas

3. See above in bold

Do you think it still comes around?

So I take it that you are right up Bush alley or should I say arse.

I would bet that you would not even help out a homeless person. I guess a few slip through the cracks during the initial interview process. Most of the AA people I have met have been very gracious. YOU Nor'Easta are not one of them.

Get back on your Prozac.

 

[Nor'Easta]

So I take it that you are right up Bush alley or should I say arse.

I would bet that you would not even help out a homeless person. I guess a few slip through the cracks during the initial interview process. Most of the AA people I have met have been very gracious. YOU Nor'Easta are not one of them.

Get back on your Prozac.

First of all, I am not a DUBYA supporter . I am just stating the FACTS of life!

You have a very bitter attitude. Just a few of you on furlough have an issue with the 5 year recalls. YOU are one of them. If you're still holding onto to hope, give it up! I am just stating the obvious to you.

Speaking of slipping through the cracks...How many did you slip through? I see a BIG ONE coming in October.

It's time for you to have your Doctor refill your Ritalin!

**********************************

Now on another note...

This is Tommie Hutto-Blake, APFA President, with a Hotline Update for Thursday, September 14, 2006.

As the only independent Flight Attendant union in the nation – representing 18,071 active and 3,882 furloughed AA Flight Attendants – and as mandated by the Railway Labor Act and the labor laws governing this country, APFA has a duty to represent each and every AA Flight Attendant on the seniority roster. This is called the Duty of Fair Representation and it is incumbent upon every U.S. labor organization that is deemed the exclusive bargaining agent for a workforce to act in accordance with the standards of Duty of Fair Representation. A labor union must represent its bargaining unit “fairly, in good faith, and without discrimination.â€￾


Though the AA Flight Attendant Seniority List and the former TWA-LLC Flight Attendant Seniority List were not formally merged until the fall of 2002, the official seniority number of the greater majority of flight attendants hired by TWA is April 10, 2001. This was the will of the APFA governing body in 2001. Any flight attendant hired by TWA after the April 10th date has a December 17, 2001, seniority date. All furloughees on the AA Flight Attendant recall list remain there in accordance with Article 16 of the APFA/AA 2001 Contract, as modified in 2003, for 5 years. At that point, and in compliance with this language a flight attendant's name is removed from the list. Most flight attendant contracts in the industry have a five-year recall timeline. Prior to today, there had never been a time in AA history that a flight attendant was on furlough status for longer than two years. AA has continued to slowly reduce capacity since this industry went into a tail spin following the terrorist attacks in 2001.

Following no less than two years of efforts by APFA to encourage the Company to extend recall rights to all American Airlines Flight Attendants, AA Senior Management told us late last week, following several hours of discussions on this topic, that the only possible way to even consider a change to this language was to open Contract talks early, exposing not just Article 16 containing furlough language, but our entire Collective Bargaining Agreement to the very real possibility of more concessions.


The fact is our 2001 Contract, as modified in 2003, has an April 30, 2008, amendable date. APFA has no intentions of opening our Contract early during a time of such industry uncertainty. Simply put, our Collective Bargaining Agreement is closed.



A couple of important notes: First, any extension of furlough recall rights will apply to all APFA members in the event that we suffer more furloughs in the future due to further capacity shuts or worse, impacts from the growing consolidation movement in the aviation community. Also, any major change to our current Contract would be subject to the requirements set forth in the APFA Constitution.



APFA is greatly distressed to report that on October 1, 2006, five years after their furlough date in 2001, 867 American Airlines Flight Attendants – 697 originally hired by AA and 170 originally hired by TWA – will be removed from the Seniority List due to the language in Article 16 of our Collective Bargaining Agreement. This is the first of nine scheduled expiration dates for our flight attendants furloughed between 2001 and 2003. On October 7, 2006, we will lose another 289 more American Airlines furloughed Flight Attendants. While any division among our ranks only serves the employer, the fact remains that our strength is in our unity and in our members. On October 8, 2006, our strength in numbers will be reduced by 1,156 American Airlines Flight Attendants.

APFA will continue to address the issue of extending the industry-standard of five years for AA Flight Attendant recalls with Senior Management outside of opening up our Contract. As your President, it is my duty to represent ALL AA Flight Attendants in the event that we are faced with even more furloughs, bankruptcy, or the chilling idea that we may merge with or be acquired by another airline.

 

[USstew23]

Hey why don't you move on!!!! Hey TW, every single US Airways (at least original US Airways) Flight Attendant is on your side on this. You guys really are the true definition of class and we love you for that!! Some of these AA flight attendants should take some notes. You are truly missed, Good Luck.

 

[MCI transplant]

<_< ----- Read above nor'easta! This is something you'll never see! It's called "RESPECT!!! Something you'll never understand!----- Your too worried about number one! :down:

 

[nbmcg01]

<_< ----- Read above nor'easta! This is something you'll never see! It's called "RESPECT!!! Something you'll never understand!----- Your too worried about number one! :down:

Once again, TH-Bs Hotline is in error. TWA experienced a furlough that neared the 5 year mark, and that is how we wound up with 7 years. 9-11 has been used as "the reason". While it may have been true in the beginning, everyone should be outraged that AA is still getting milage out of that tragic event. If 9-11 is still "the reason" then just because of the unique circumstances there COULD be a LOA, with a no precedent, no referral, to address this situation. Talk about taking the high ground! Just think how much "good press" AA could get for that gesture. It would be a win, win, for all concerned, (except JN). Due to 9-11, many other companies chose to alter their furlough agreements to address this unprecedented event. Good people are wishing to be able to return to work. They are not trouble makers. Unfortunately, they are being held hostage by the Company AND the Union, using people's careers, retirement, and lives as political pawns. There does not HAVE to be a lot of discussion, just grown ups doing the right thing.

 

[Nor'Easta]

<_< ----- Read above nor'easta! This is something you'll never see! It's called "RESPECT!!! Something you'll never understand!----- Your too worried about number one! :down:

I wish they would recall but AA wants NOTHING TO DO WITH IT! You need to get that through your head. I don't care about this job (not career) anymore. I just fly what I need to and drop the rest of my trips. I have better things to do with my time then fly for AA. If any furloughee wants my job...YOU CAN HAVE IT!


MCI transplant...

Maybe you should start to do your job and the planes would have no issues. Deferring all the MX items day after day is called LAZINESS!!!!