Nov/Dec 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Reed Richards]

 
The east hysteria is definitely reaching uncharted heights.  Truly funny to watch, keep posting M, you're wrong with just about everything you have predicted, beginning with USAPA and DOH.  How's that looking for ya?  LOL
 
A fool truly is born every minute, you carry on the tradition well,
 
Here's a point you neglected to even address- the Addington case is owned by the union.  APA will assume the case if you were to appeal it- USAPA and the community college graduates on the east will no longer own it.  That's APA's deal and they have already declared no interest in the east's jihad against the west.  Sorry M, you're done.   USAPA is done.
 
Oh, and once the APA is the legal CBA, all funds remaining go to the APA or must be returned to the members.  Care to debate this?  Didn't think so...

[SIZE=10.5pt]Read the USAPA CBL and get back to me on the remaining funds distribution. [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=10.5pt]I have told you all for years you cannot and will not ever get the NIC implemented in ratified  agreement, nor will a pilot with 17 years ever go behind a new hire. Never going to happen.  Much to be thankful for today, including USAPA getting you the highest rates of pay you have ever had in the history of your pilot group.  And of course the treatment of furloughs by UAL. Good times, good times. Not a tear shed on our side seeing USAPA go, the job is for all intents complete. Don't light that first fire before your check for that dead "ho ho ho" St Nic trapped in your chimney. RR  [/SIZE]

 

[Reed Richards]

For those few that cannot read:
 
C. Within three (3) business days of either the NMB decision or membership vote triggering dissolution (hereinafter, the "commencement date"), the National Officers shall make a determination as to whether existing circumstances present, or may present in the future, the need for collective legal action on behalf of the pilot group, including, but not limited to, representation in seniority integration proceedings. In the event the majority of the National Officers determine that such a need exists, the dissolution commencement date will be deferred until, in the judgment of a majority of the National Officers, the need for collective legal representation no longer exists. If, in the judgment of a majority of the National Officers, available funds exceed the expected costs of collective legal representation, the excess monies may be distributed in accordance with paragraph A of this section. The President shall break any tie votes among the National Officers.

 

[snapthis]

 
Gee. Do you think that the east pilots wouldn't form USAPA, LLC, and collect money to carry on the fight?  With the new pay rates, it will be pocket change.
 
Maybe they will give me a Coolest-Dude T-Shirt, just like you guys got from AOL.

 
I've already saw this mentioned on this forum. How's the fund drive going?

 

[Reed Richards]

 
I've already saw this mentioned on this forum. How's the fund drive going?

Going great. Right now the West Class is matching us at about 50% of our contributions. Keep those moneys coming!  This is silly.  Why would the East need any "fund drive" right now?  Question, with any kind of loss in front of Silver is the West Class going to continue to fund Harper, or simply cut him off? RR

 

[Reed Richards]

At a clock time yet uncertain, LOA 96 (the Transition Agreement) becomes null and void a week from Monday;  and the new Transition Agreement (the MOU) becomes our ratified contract.  Please notice that agreement has no mention of the NIC being imposed, nor of a West Seat at the table.  If Parker wants that seat, he can negotiate with the parties.  Absent a complete new contract agreement voted in by East and West before that time with a combined seniority list, we remain by law as separate, both represented by USAPA at the M/B table.  We have a lot to look forward to, December 9th cannot get here any faster. RR

 

[nycbusdriver]

Going great. Right now the West Class is matching us at about 50% of our contributions. 

 
And, of course, we do appreciate their financial support.  :LOL:

 

[Pi brat]

 
The east hysteria is definitely reaching uncharted heights.  Truly funny to watch, keep posting M, you're wrong with just about everything you have predicted, beginning with USAPA and DOH.  How's that looking for ya?  LOL
 
A fool truly is born every minute, you carry on the tradition well,
 
Here's a point you neglected to even address- the Addington case is owned by the union.  APA will assume the case if you were to appeal it- USAPA and the community college graduates on the east will no longer own it.  That's APA's deal and they have already declared no interest in the east's jihad against the west.  Sorry M, you're done.   USAPA is done.
 
Oh, and once the APA is the legal CBA, all funds remaining go to the APA or must be returned to the members.  Care to debate this?  Didn't think so...

Did the APA inherit the TWA DFR?

 

[Pi brat]

For those few that cannot read:
 
C. Within three (3) business days of either the NMB decision or membership vote triggering dissolution (hereinafter, the "commencement date"), the National Officers shall make a determination as to whether existing circumstances present, or may present in the future, the need for collective legal action on behalf of the pilot group, including, but not limited to, representation in seniority integration proceedings. In the event the majority of the National Officers determine that such a need exists, the dissolution commencement date will be deferred until, in the judgment of a majority of the National Officers, the need for collective legal representation no longer exists. If, in the judgment of a majority of the National Officers, available funds exceed the expected costs of collective legal representation, the excess monies may be distributed in accordance with paragraph A of this section. The President shall break any tie votes among the National Officers.

Certain people only get their information from the west board. If something is repeated 3 times it's fact. It is the internet after all.

 

[EastUS1]

If the ruling goes against the West pilots, Leonidas is funded and prepared.

 
Funded and prepared for what?....Printing up more T-shirts? Whatever's to come from the current proceedings; you've certainly my full support for feeling perfectly free to maintain your self-inflicted confinement in PHX for however long it suits you. I rather expect an appeal will occur regardless of whatever ruling is given. Have fun.

 

[EastUS1]

 
The east hysteria is definitely reaching uncharted heights. 
 
A fool truly is born every minute, ..........

 
If you believe your first, then the second's well-demonstrated. Speaking of that second notion: Have you any fresh "T minus" countdown clocks to offer for our amusement? 😉

 

[EastUS1]

 
Gee. Do you think that the east pilots wouldn't form USAPA, LLC, and collect money to carry on the fight?  With the new pay rates, it will be pocket change.

 
That's a bit of a harsh assault on their naive arrogance.  Per: "Maybe they will give me a Coolest-Dude T-Shirt, just like you guys got from AOL."...Well...we can at least dream...but somehow...I just don't see "dire wolf" T-shirts coming from within our group. 😉

 

[Piedmont1984]

When USAPA appealed Addington I they made several arguments, remember that? The issue of ripeness was only one. Another was the unfairness of the Nic and how the Wake court was biased. Yet another was the issue of subject matter jurisdiction. Altogether I recall there were four or five separate arguments. In the end the 9th ruled only on ripeness. Had they ruled in favor of USAPA on more than just the ripeness issue we would likely NOT have languished on LOA 93 for another three years, nor would our leadership at the time made the gamble to conduct a work to rule action which resulted in a permanent injunction thereby crippling the union. The point being we have been disappointed but not defeated by the 9th.

The issue of west class representation was not raised in the previous appeal. Silver may be justifiably careful not to contradict the dicta in the 9th's opinion, but a 3 way is something new. She can be activist while at the same time not going against the grain of the 9th. By doing so she also throws a bone to the west, a consolation prize if you will.

I know what the law says, just like it said in Wake or the subsequent appeal. I also know that the courts love to engage in 'kick the can' and that in the real world 'we don't always get what we want'.

USAPA would be wise to prepare a strategy in the event of a 3 way. They should focus on the orderly deconstruction and dismantling of the union which is now inevitable. They should stop wasting time, effort and resources fighting over the status of the president in the short time remaining.

Just my humble opinion.

'84

 

[snapthis]

 
The east hysteria is definitely reaching uncharted heights.  Truly funny to watch, keep posting M, you're wrong with just about everything you have predicted, beginning with USAPA and DOH.  How's that looking for ya?  LOL
 
A fool truly is born every minute, you carry on the tradition well,
 
Here's a point you neglected to even address- the Addington case is owned by the union.  APA will assume the case if you were to appeal it- USAPA and the community college graduates on the east will no longer own it.  That's APA's deal and they have already declared no interest in the east's jihad against the west.  Sorry M, you're done.   USAPA is done.
 
Oh, and once the APA is the legal CBA, all funds remaining go to the APA or must be returned to the members.  Care to debate this?  Didn't think so...

 
RR is real good at making predictions and theorems which fall flat. It's a joy watching him flounder. It's a good thing he doesn't make decisions for West pilots.
 
He just can't stand the idea he's not going to be negotiating for West pilots.
 
He'll probably compete for space with the bathrooom attendant in CLT selling artifacts from an extinct airway to start funding the Angry FO Club.

 
DOH

 

[Piedmont1984]

deleted

 

[snapthis]

 
Funded and prepared for what?....Printing up more T-shirts? Whatever's to come from the current proceedings; you've certainly my full support for feeling perfectly free to maintain your self-inflicted confinement in PHX for however long it suits you. I rather expect an appeal will occur regardless of whatever ruling is given. Have fun.

 
Oh, we are preparing for a celebration to welcome the new American Airlines and the demise of the airway. 
 
We'll send you the party pics.
 
About that appeal...how's the fundraising going?