OCT/NOV 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[EastUS1]

Falsely accused. Cleared by the courts.

Indeed. "Falsely accused" in the matter of the data theft but "cleared". 😉 Thank you Mr. Simpson. You may now continue on your noble quest to find "the real killers".....

 

[mrbreeze]

US AIRLINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION’S MEMORANDUM OF LAW IN OPPOSITION TO USAIRWAYS, INC.’S MOTION FORRELIEF FROM JUDGMENT.

Laymen s terms, USAPA thinks the company is stalling negotiations with the aid of the west pilots. American Airlines pilots are interested in all the videos and court garbage, the west and the company are emanating.

The company knows an appeal would have been looked upon as frivolous, by the 9th Circuit Court, so they chose appealing to Judge Silver.

http://leonidas.cact...PA_Response.pdf

This should be read by all......management shouldn't be allowed to continue the delay tactics.
breeze

 

[Phoenix]

Yesterday morning the APA BOD approved to send out the Agreement in Principle (AIP) for membership ratification.. Passed 12 to 4. It stipulates that the pilots will refuse to abide by the judgements of both the 9th circuit and Judge Silver... Nah, I just threw in the last part for fun.

 

[prechilill]

Yawn.

Scottie, are you ever going back to work?

 

[Metroyet]

This should be read by all......management shouldn't be allowed to continue the delay tactics.
breeze

Who exactly are the "west pilot seniority negotiators" who are legally authorized to renegotiate seniority with USAPA?

 

[Phoenix]

Who exactly are the "west pilot seniority negotiators" who are legally authorized to renegotiate seniority with USAPA?

USAPA can legally allow/offer anyone they want to be involved in discussions that assist them in coming to a decision within a wide rage of reasonableness.

 

[Metroyet]

USAPA can legally allow/offer anyone they want to be involved in discussions that assist them in coming to a decision within a wide rage of reasonableness.

Uh huh. The DFR rights reside with the individual...not any group...of any description. Who has the authority to speak on behalf of the USAPA members in good standing based in PHX? How would their input be anymore "binding" upon the West than the Nic is upon the East? Especially in light of that pesky little you know...Final and BINDING arbitration everybody entered into willingly.

Good Luck finding your legitimate union purpose and framing an argument that a Jury would consider inside the wide range of reasonableness to arbitrarily descriminate against a minority group...to their sole detriment....to your sole gain...post Arbitration which I believe a Federal Judge recently claimed that was a "strong evidence of a fair outcome" or something to that effect.

Sure. piece of cake. Forget that first Jury that sat for two weeks trying to find your legitimate purpose. They took less than an hour and a half to decide that your side was full of it.

 

[Phoenix]

Uh huh. The DFR rights reside with the individual...not any group...of any description. Who has the authority to speak on behalf of the USAPA members in good standing based in PHX? How would their input be anymore "binding" upon the West than the Nic is upon the East? Especially in light of that pesky little you know...Final and BINDING arbitration everybody entered into willingly.

Good Luck finding your legitimate union purpose and framing an argument that a Jury would consider inside the wide range of reasonableness to arbitrarily descriminate against a minority group...to their sole detriment....to your sole gain...post Arbitration which I believe a Federal Judge recently claimed that was a "strong evidence of a fair outcome" or something to that effect.

Sure. piece of cake. Forget that first Jury that sat for two weeks trying to find your legitimate purpose. They took less than an hour and a half to decide that your side was full of it.

Make no mistake. We get your point. You have nothing but a threat, a hail Marry begging us to just give up now and give you all the benefits of the Nic now without even a wimper of a fight, rather than take our chances and see if we might not have to give you all of the benefits of the Nic later after a court someday in the far future decides the Nic really was required after all.

Yeah, just threats. Hey pay us now or we will make you pay us later. Don't doubt us. We mean it. Really.. Hey, I'm talking to you... Hey, over here. Listen to me... Please... Hey, scab, you are gonna pay in the end, unless you pay us now!

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Metro said: "Uh huh. The DFR rights reside with the individual...not any group...of any description. Who has the authority to speak on behalf of the USAPA members in good standing based in PHX? How would their input be anymore "binding" upon the West than the Nic is upon the East? Especially in light of that pesky little you know...Final and BINDING arbitration everybody entered into willingly."


Of course DFR rights reside with each individual (and don't forget, that privilege extends to all pilots, not just the downtrodden and abused PHX based ones.) ANYONE, including professionals hired by the union, and even the Company during negotiations on Section 22 can provide INPUT. This is not some kind of sterile petri dish, there is nothing "binding" only those authorized to "speak" from having an input. Please note that USAPA has reached out to the West as a group, to West Reps, and to West Legal to seek input and ideas. Then the twisted logic reared its ugly head again, stonewalling as you determined you might "ruin" you future slam dunk DFR if you provided input. Besides, ANY input provided becomes binding only when voted on by the membership. Has that happend yet?

You refuse to participate. Eventually a vote will taken enshrining a list in Section 22 (or maybe whatever section a list resides in at APA.) Good luck pleading your case having not participated, in fact announcing to the world hundreds of times on a public forum what your goal is.

Greeter

 

[nycbusdriver]

I'm lucky I have you and Bill "Firewall" McKee to protect me from myself.

Can you guys help me find my DOH seniority list and LOA 93 snapback?

I'm assuming by your outspoken stance here that when the DOH list (with C&Rs) is instituted, you will refrain from taking advantage of any position on the list ahead of where Nicolau would have put you.

 

[cleardirect]

USAPA can legally allow/offer anyone they want to be involved in discussions that assist them in coming to a decision within a wide rage of reasonableness.

Sure usapa can "allow" anyone to discuss anything. However usapa can not just grant authority to anyone to represent a segment of the pilots.

usapa wanted and was granted exclusive rights to bargain for the ENTIRE group.

So just because usapa "allows" someone from the west to sit at the table does not mean that person speaks for or represents all west pilots. Why is this so hard for you east guys to understand?

 

[nic4us]

You refuse to participate. Eventually a vote will taken enshrining a list in Section 22 (or maybe whatever section a list resides in at APA.) Good luck pleading your case having not participated, in fact announcing to the world hundreds of times on a public forum what your goal is.

Greeter

Greeter,

You are incorrect here. The West has participated from the beginning. Our stance from the beginning has been, there will be a fair and equitable integration. When negotiations fell apart we went to arbitration, and a fair and equitable award was published.

Since then, the West has continued to participate. Even the election of usapa as the CBA has not stopped the West from participating. Our position and our contribution to the discussion is th e Nic is the only system seniority list at LCC, and it will remain that way up to and including when it is finally implemented.

Just because you don't like the message does not mean a lack of participation.

So, if it ever ends up in a courtroom again, the West will have no problem showing 5 years of participation, and the complete lack of representation by usapa, who for the entire time has not been listening, to either the West, the company, or the judges.

 

[nic4us]

This should be read by all......management shouldn't be allowed to continue the delay tactics.
breeze

You want the delay to stop?

Sure thing.....it will stop this week if you weak ladies on the east would man up, go to the NMB with the Nic, and quit your 5 year temper tantrum.

Til then, STFU.

 

[nic4us]

Make no mistake. We get your point. You have nothing but a threat, a hail Marry begging us to just give up now and give you all the benefits of the Nic now without even a wimper of a fight, rather than take our chances and see if we might not have to give you all of the benefits of the Nic later after a court someday in the far future decides the Nic really was required after all.

Yeah, just threats. Hey pay us now or we will make you pay us later. Don't doubt us. We mean it. Really.. Hey, I'm talking to you... Hey, over here. Listen to me... Please... Hey, scab, you are gonna pay in the end, unless you pay us now!

Our "hail Mary" threats hold more legal punch than your limp ditch union's parked, enjoined and about to be told insignificant opinions, on what is "within a wide range of reasonableness".

Next week will be interesting, the company's reply to the NMB is due, and we might hear what the bankruptcy judge in NY thinks of a union that wants in on the merger process so it can F it up like everything else they touch.

 

[Move2CLT]

Til then, STFU.

Well said.