Unionization
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AIRWOMAN
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Exactly my point. No winners and this company and every other big company knows it.
Sounds like an excuse can the ibt not learn to negotiate and secure more work?This is a point 700UW has no aspect of.
Just as he like to spin his IAM bullshit off of.
READ THIS 700UW 98% of the IBT CONTRACTS THE COMPANY WAS OUTSOURCING BEFORE IBT WAS ON PROPERTY!!!!!
IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND AND SOME WERE AFTER THE IAM WALKED AWAY FROM IT'S MEMBERS, JUST LIKE CO.
NOW 7 I KNOW VIEWERS CAN READ BACK.
LET IT FLY,I HAVE MY HIP WADERS ON...🙄
Sounds like the ibt has failed its membership by not being able to secure the work being done in-house.
And when are you going to reply to all the things I took from your CBA and comparing it to the IAM's CBA?
Awa Contract
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Sounds like the IAM failed its membership by loosing work, pay, and benefits. Gee who lost more??
Did you go through two chapter 11 cases in two years?
Did you have a judge abrogate your contract?
Even with the loss of jobs, pay, benefits and work, we still have more employees on the eastside and still perform the majority of overhaul in-house.
Our GSE, Plant and Stock Clerks make more then your west ibt represented employees.
We have a DCP plan and 401k match, you only have the 401k match.
And yes we took our lumps on the eastside but our scope is way better then yours.
Looks like the ibt cant gain anywork on any carrier they represent, your planes are all overhauled by vendors and your cba permits overnight line maintenance work to be performed by vendors, your CBA just lets the work flow outside to vendors.
I love how you have to try and blame the IAM instead of acknowledging your own shortcomings.
Did you have a judge abrogate your contract?
Even with the loss of jobs, pay, benefits and work, we still have more employees on the eastside and still perform the majority of overhaul in-house.
Our GSE, Plant and Stock Clerks make more then your west ibt represented employees.
We have a DCP plan and 401k match, you only have the 401k match.
And yes we took our lumps on the eastside but our scope is way better then yours.
Looks like the ibt cant gain anywork on any carrier they represent, your planes are all overhauled by vendors and your cba permits overnight line maintenance work to be performed by vendors, your CBA just lets the work flow outside to vendors.
I love how you have to try and blame the IAM instead of acknowledging your own shortcomings.
Awa Contract
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Your canned responses are boring - seems like you blame eveyone but the ones responsible for your short comings and by the way what happened looks like your beloved IAM agrees to seperate class and craft - they lacked an objection. LOL - maybe they don't figure they are going to win this, maybe that is why they filed on the clerks. What good is scope when the union lacks balls or is in the company's pocket? We have 2 tech on furlough you have how many thousand? Just admit it your blessed IAM screwed the pooch.
Bottom Line! (WE ARE READY TO FIGHT WITH THE IBT IN OUR CORNER!!!
VOTE IBT AND GET SOME REAL STRONG IBT MEMBERS............
I PAY MY DUES FOR MY UNION TO TAKE CARE OF ME AND MY UNION BROTHERS AND SISTERS.
for the most part easties are way beyond the union rah rah rah crap....I heard lots saying they could care if it went non union.....I'm not kidding either..... :blink:
Awa Contract
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well for my two cents that beats being IAM
Awa,
Sorry if you can't comprehend what two chapter 11 cases in less then two years does to the workforce.
Look around the industry, EVERY legacy, (something were not) was in bad financial shape, AA, CO, DL, NW, US have all taken concessions to keep the majority of the employees working and keep the airlines in business. 9/11, fuel prices, the Iraqi War and bad management has gotten the employees and the airlines in the shape they are today.
Your own ibt mechanics at CO gave concessions and CO was not even in chapter 11.
ALPA, AFA,AMFA, CWA,ibt, IAM, and the TWU have all been hit hard since 9/11 and all have given concessions in one way of another.
Through the first chapter 11 case and two rounds of concessions the IAM preserved as many jobs as possible.
Since 9/11 US/East has shed over 200 planes, no airline keeps everyone on the payroll when the fleet shrinks, that is plain and simple facts.
All labor peace between the IAM and US disapeared when US farmed out the first two Airbus to Mobile, the IAM filed in Federal Court and won an injuction to stop the work, upon appeal the company was succesful in getting the injuction lifted and the was sent to arbitration.
During those months, Siegel was wanting concessions from all unions, the IAM at the request of the membership refused to meet and talk with the company due to the airbus outsourcing case. Roach, the GLRs and GCs went to all the maintenance stations and met with employees and got their feel on the situation and no one would trust the company after they violated our CBA after two rounds of concessions.
Then the IAM and its members won the Airbus Arbitration with about $10 million in damages, seeing the IAM would not come to the table to negotiate concessions the company filed bankrutpcy once again and their one goal was to bust the IAM and eliminate the maintenance department. If you don't believe me go ask Pitbull, she was there with her union and witnessed what the company was doing to the IAM.
The company then filed a Section 1113E motion to force emergency paycuts on all employees, I was at the hearings along with the leadership of various unions on the property. It was very apparent that the company was going to get its way as it was assigned to Judge Mitchell, the very same Judge who gave a rubber stamp to US Airways during the first chapter 11 case and the very same judge who approved the POR which failed. And Judge Mitchell imposed a 19% paycut on all unionized employees except ALPA, who had all ready agreed to concession once again, management only got a 5% paycut and the CEO Bruce Lakefield too NO paycut.
Then the company filed a Section 1113 C motion which is for contract abrogation. For three months the IAM held talks with the company, the company was very slow on getting information to the committee and the financial advisors and much of the information provided was incorrect. From day one of negotiations the company wanted to eliminate over 50% of the maintenance department, they never in the three months of negotiations moved off thier position.
The first week of January after much hard work the Negotiating Committee gave the company a full and comprehensive proposal that met thier "ask" except the NC would not agree to a pension termination, as we all ready knew, the courts would do this no matter what.
The proposal would have preserved the majority of the jobs, the shops and eight stations for line utility, eventhough the proposal met their "ask" the company rejected it as it kept too many people employed and they did not want to manage the workforce.
Then on 1/6/05 Judge Mitchell abrogated the CBA, the company presented a final offer to the IAM and the International agreed to send it out for a vote and let the members decide their own fate.
The members approved the final offer, which was their right under the democratic way.
The IAM and its members made the best out of a bad situation and with all the cuts, we still perform more work in-house then you do, and our AMTs are paid just about the same, GSE and Plant Mtc mechs are paid more on the East side then the West as are the Stock Clerks.
Sorry if you don't want to understand the severity of the bankruptcy and its consequences and what transpired, maybe you need to take the time and educate yourself, instead of making yourself look foolish with your canned responses.
Sorry if you can't comprehend what two chapter 11 cases in less then two years does to the workforce.
Look around the industry, EVERY legacy, (something were not) was in bad financial shape, AA, CO, DL, NW, US have all taken concessions to keep the majority of the employees working and keep the airlines in business. 9/11, fuel prices, the Iraqi War and bad management has gotten the employees and the airlines in the shape they are today.
Your own ibt mechanics at CO gave concessions and CO was not even in chapter 11.
ALPA, AFA,AMFA, CWA,ibt, IAM, and the TWU have all been hit hard since 9/11 and all have given concessions in one way of another.
Through the first chapter 11 case and two rounds of concessions the IAM preserved as many jobs as possible.
Since 9/11 US/East has shed over 200 planes, no airline keeps everyone on the payroll when the fleet shrinks, that is plain and simple facts.
All labor peace between the IAM and US disapeared when US farmed out the first two Airbus to Mobile, the IAM filed in Federal Court and won an injuction to stop the work, upon appeal the company was succesful in getting the injuction lifted and the was sent to arbitration.
During those months, Siegel was wanting concessions from all unions, the IAM at the request of the membership refused to meet and talk with the company due to the airbus outsourcing case. Roach, the GLRs and GCs went to all the maintenance stations and met with employees and got their feel on the situation and no one would trust the company after they violated our CBA after two rounds of concessions.
Then the IAM and its members won the Airbus Arbitration with about $10 million in damages, seeing the IAM would not come to the table to negotiate concessions the company filed bankrutpcy once again and their one goal was to bust the IAM and eliminate the maintenance department. If you don't believe me go ask Pitbull, she was there with her union and witnessed what the company was doing to the IAM.
The company then filed a Section 1113E motion to force emergency paycuts on all employees, I was at the hearings along with the leadership of various unions on the property. It was very apparent that the company was going to get its way as it was assigned to Judge Mitchell, the very same Judge who gave a rubber stamp to US Airways during the first chapter 11 case and the very same judge who approved the POR which failed. And Judge Mitchell imposed a 19% paycut on all unionized employees except ALPA, who had all ready agreed to concession once again, management only got a 5% paycut and the CEO Bruce Lakefield too NO paycut.
Then the company filed a Section 1113 C motion which is for contract abrogation. For three months the IAM held talks with the company, the company was very slow on getting information to the committee and the financial advisors and much of the information provided was incorrect. From day one of negotiations the company wanted to eliminate over 50% of the maintenance department, they never in the three months of negotiations moved off thier position.
The first week of January after much hard work the Negotiating Committee gave the company a full and comprehensive proposal that met thier "ask" except the NC would not agree to a pension termination, as we all ready knew, the courts would do this no matter what.
The proposal would have preserved the majority of the jobs, the shops and eight stations for line utility, eventhough the proposal met their "ask" the company rejected it as it kept too many people employed and they did not want to manage the workforce.
Then on 1/6/05 Judge Mitchell abrogated the CBA, the company presented a final offer to the IAM and the International agreed to send it out for a vote and let the members decide their own fate.
The members approved the final offer, which was their right under the democratic way.
The IAM and its members made the best out of a bad situation and with all the cuts, we still perform more work in-house then you do, and our AMTs are paid just about the same, GSE and Plant Mtc mechs are paid more on the East side then the West as are the Stock Clerks.
Sorry if you don't want to understand the severity of the bankruptcy and its consequences and what transpired, maybe you need to take the time and educate yourself, instead of making yourself look foolish with your canned responses.
try living for some 16 plus years with the mismanagement of your beloved company dwindling daily,times where employees knew and realized that we didn't have enough cash to go ch.11,only 7....then somehow making it to die another day......you keep haranging the IAM and dude...they did what they had to do with a bucket of crap...was all they could do...they made the best out of a terrible situation.they didn't deal their own hand...we had industry leading contracts for years only to see them pilaged by continual idiotic management decisions daily resulting in what once was a proud labor group who continually stood up and contributed to help save their company only to,in the end have to take concessions to save what jobs they could......with full knowledge that alot wouldn't be coming back....and many voted in these concessions knowing they would most likely never come back...
so dude ,don't judge us until you've walked in our shoes,you guys in the west have a fairy tail union experience,I hope you never ever have to deal with what the men and women at US Air had to.
so dude ,don't judge us until you've walked in our shoes,you guys in the west have a fairy tail union experience,I hope you never ever have to deal with what the men and women at US Air had to.
Awa Contract
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You are both right they deserve better treatment that they have had - that is why it is time to dump what they have had and go IBT.
And what has the ibt done except lead the industry in outsourcing?
Former WN CBA, CO, UP and HP, all outsource more maintenance then anyother union's CBA in the industry.
If the ibt is so great why did CO ibt represented AMTs take concessions when CO was not in bankruptcy and why did they take concessions when they stated those concessions were contingent on EVERY union at CO taking concessions?
Gee the IAM Represented Flight Attendants voted down their concessions yet the ibt still enacted their concessions on their mechanics after they said they wouldn't?
The CBAs speak for themselves, the ibt has not done anything to secure heavy maintenance at any airline they represent.
Former WN CBA, CO, UP and HP, all outsource more maintenance then anyother union's CBA in the industry.
If the ibt is so great why did CO ibt represented AMTs take concessions when CO was not in bankruptcy and why did they take concessions when they stated those concessions were contingent on EVERY union at CO taking concessions?
Gee the IAM Represented Flight Attendants voted down their concessions yet the ibt still enacted their concessions on their mechanics after they said they wouldn't?
The CBAs speak for themselves, the ibt has not done anything to secure heavy maintenance at any airline they represent.
Awa Contract
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Lets keep it personal - the IAM has lead the US Airways folks into outsourcing resulting in thousands out of work and lower pay and benefits for those that remain in place. Yep, I want that kind of representation, WHEN HELL FREEZES OVER!! Now is the time to rid themselves of that problem known as the IAM
I am glad your dog didn't show up because he would have been totally blown away. If you believe in what 700 has to say (the brocken record it is) than you have been drinking the same IAM Kool-Aid as he does. Take it from a TECHNICIAN not stock clerk that has been in the IAM for 17 years and the IBT for the last two. It is not even close. Is there a reason the IAM has only USAirways left which they represent in the industry???
Now I want you to know 700 spends countless hours here and at other boards but his information is twisted to IAM's favor. Just read some. Ask him why we voted twice? His lame excuse is usually 1) it was the members 2) the judge made us do it bla bla bla. Truth is we voted NO and the IAM didn't have the balls to tell the company not to come back for another vote period. So please keep your dog on the sideline.
Are you not capable of learning what happened?
I and many others have explained to you exactly what happened and yet you fail to grasp it.
The IAM face with many challenges did the best they could, ultimatly it was up to the members.
Yes once again you are a typical ibter and fail to respond to any questions poised to you about why the ibt has failed its AMTs in regards to outsourcing.
I know I would not want someone who keeps dodging the truth from representing me.
I and many others have explained to you exactly what happened and yet you fail to grasp it.
The IAM face with many challenges did the best they could, ultimatly it was up to the members.
Yes once again you are a typical ibter and fail to respond to any questions poised to you about why the ibt has failed its AMTs in regards to outsourcing.
I know I would not want someone who keeps dodging the truth from representing me.
