US Pilots Labor Discussion 9/23- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

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Richard

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Dec 15, 2005
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OK,

Here is your new pilot's labor thread for the period.

Inasmuch as we are constantly reminding you to read the rules of the board posted atop every forum, apparently some of you are having difficulty doing that.

Therefore, you will see the rules posted below. Read them. Know them. Live them.. Most importantly, OBSERVE them.


1. No personal attacks, remarks, comments, insults, name calling etc. Posts should be aimed at a group, NOT an individual. If you want to have a dialog with a specific poster, take it to PM.

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The moderators and administrators at AirlineForums.com will determine what constitutes a violation and act accordingly. We reserve the right to delete or edit entire posts, and to place members on moderator preview in addition to suspension.

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Black Swan

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Dec 13, 2009
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With regard to the Lance issue. Some from other airlines said he has support.Nothing could be farther from the truth. He was swept out the door right along with Prater and ALPA. He kept up the ALPA mantra right to the end, the one that was always espousing "live to fight another day.." Problem was there was always the other day, but no fight. The pension vote sealed his sentence.He was not one who voted to do it, but he was aligned with those who did. The other councils had no way to get rid of Svendson and the other weak sisters without taking out the Mother Ship. When ALPA was removed, so were ALL the hangers on. The pension- We had no say, it was done in the night. THAT, was the last time that MEC and ALPA ever had a chance with me ever again. Regardless of how anyone feels about the condition of the pension fund, it should have been the individual decision of each and every beneficiary as to whether to risk his/her livelihood with a yes or no vote, not someone else making that decision for them.
 
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LSS

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Mar 31, 2008
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Regardless of how anyone feels about the condition of the pension fund, it should have been the individual decision of each and every beneficiary as to whether to risk his/her livelihood with a yes or no vote, not someone else making that decision for them.

For me... it was not only the pension debacle... but also ALPA National playing fast and loose with the recalls in CLT and PHL. ALPA National did everything they could to keep the "good ole ALPA boys" in power.
 

luvthe9

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Aug 30, 2002
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And now the Delata pilots want to form their own in house union and dump ALPA, no suprise there!!! ALPA will be made up of mostly RJ pilots soon. it will be re-mamed RAPLA. (R-Regional)
 
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Pi brat

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Jan 25, 2007
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Guys, Lance and his unbiased buddies are the best allies USAPA has. Don't let the west know the truth about him, let them keep eating it up! It will serve them well.
 
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snapthis

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Dec 23, 2009
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And now the Delata pilots want to form their own in house union and dump ALPA, no suprise there!!! ALPA will be made up of mostly RJ pilots soon. it will be re-mamed RAPLA. (R-Regional)

Usapa wrote the book on how not to operate an in-house union. What a joke! Never heard of Delata Airlines. :lol:
 
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BoeingBoy

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Nov 9, 2003
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Guys, Lance and his unbiased buddies are the best allies USAPA has.

The trouble for the DOH hardliners isn't so much people like Lance and others who are against USAPA and want ALPA back since that basically fixed number (although if there is ever a representational election we all know which way they'll vote).

The problem is those who generally support USAPA but are growing tired of the fighting between the pilot groups and not having a new contract. As one recently put it on another website, "It's time to stop fighting among ourselves and join together to get the best contract we can get." The number of those who were happy to see ALPA gone but are unhappy with what's happening now appears to be increasing.

Jim
 
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Pi brat

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Jan 25, 2007
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The trouble for the DOH hardliners isn't so much people like Lance and others who are against USAPA and want ALPA back since that basically fixed number (although if there is ever a representational election we all know which way they'll vote).

The problem is those who generally support USAPA but are growing tired of the fighting between the pilot groups and not having a new contract. As one recently put it on another website, "It's time to stop fighting among ourselves and join together to get the best contract we can get." The number of those who were happy to see ALPA gone but are unhappy with what's happening now appears to be increasing.

Jim

He is no problem for USAPA at all, he's an asset. Other people remember him just as you do, and when he runs his mouth about USAPA it has the opposite effect than what he wants, for most of us.

There are a lot of people fed with with this seemingly unending fight and are ready for a contract. Enough to affect change? I don't know.
 
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Black Swan

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He is no problem for USAPA at all, he's an asset. Other people remember him just as you do, and when he runs his mouth about USAPA it has the opposite effect than what he wants, for most of us.

There are a lot of people fed with with this seemingly unending fight and are ready for a contract. Enough to affect change? I don't know.
Yes, the fight is no good deal. I really see nobody ready to throw in the towel on either side though. I do believe if there was a decent compromise out there, it might fly.
Most of the East pilots are seriously focused on the LOA 93 deal, which could come any day, and go any way. That will obviously drive some decisions in a dramatic fashion because of the possible enormity of the outcome. Kasher could deny it totally, or award it in a lessor degree, or fully. Either way, it won't be much longer.
 
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Run Like Hell

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Sep 12, 2010
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Yes, the fight is no good deal. I really see nobody ready to throw in the towel on either side though. I do believe if there was a decent compromise out there, it might fly.
Most of the East pilots are seriously focused on the LOA 93 deal, which could come any day, and go any way. That will obviously drive some decisions in a dramatic fashion because of the possible enormity of the outcome. Kasher could deny it totally, or award it in a lessor degree, or fully. Either way, it won't be much longer.



Even if Kasher awards it (which I doubt) the company won't have to pay it, right?

According to Userpa, binding arbitration is only a proposal.

If the company doesn't like the "proposal" then they don't have to abid by it.

Let me guess, this is different.........
 
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Run Like Hell

Member
Sep 12, 2010
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Yes, the fight is no good deal. I really see nobody ready to throw in the towel on either side though. I do believe if there was a decent compromise out there, it might fly.



Nope compromise not possible, even if the west were open to one (which it is not) The Userpa election removed the wests representation no one left to negotiate with, Now any Userpa action to compromise the Nic, ripens the DFR.

I'm paraphrasing here a bit but one of your east reps pointed that risk out during the campaign and said something to the effect of "The surest way to insure that the nic gets inplemented as-is, is to vote for USAPA"
 
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Ames

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Nope compromise not possible, even if the west were open to one (which it is not) The Userpa election removed the wests representation no one left to negotiate with, Now any Userpa action to compromise the Nic, ripens the DFR.

I'm paraphrasing here a bit but one of your east reps pointed that risk out during the campaign and said something to the effect of "The surest way to insure that the nic gets inplemented as-is, is to vote for USAPA"

Absolutely no compromise possible. We came this far in the courts, why quit now? I believe that it was former AAA MEC chairman Jack Stephan who made that statement about the vote for usapa insuring the Nic.
 
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L

luvn737s

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Absolutely no compromise possible. We came this far in the courts, why quit now?
Well, there have been no home runs in this game on either side, and winning Addington only provides for Nicolau being in the TA to be voted on. I think many people are so engrossed in the process, they lose sight of what the goal is.

No, you can't bargain away the Nicolau, but you need to move beyond it as the sole issue. The east will continue to have a numbers advantage and USAPA has had uncontested control over the flow of (mis) information. Ignoring these facts will make any expensive Addigton victory a hollow one.
 
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