US Pilots Labor Discussion 9/9- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[767jetz]

ONCE AGAIN:

Show us where this is documented. Otherwise quit bringing it up!

OK. And while we're at it:
- Show us where it is documented that the 9th ruled anything other than "not ripe."

- Show us where it is documented that binding arbitration means something other than legally binding.

- Show us where it is documented that the binding arbitration is between ALPA and the company and not the pilots of USAriways and the pilots of America West.

- Show us where it is documented that the company will accept any seniority integration USAPA comes up with. (and not the Nic.)

- Show us where it is documented that a contract with Nic will not pass by at least 50% +1.

- While you're at it, show us where it is documented that USAPA did not actually lose a DFR case the one and only time the merits were examined.

- Finally, show us where it is documented that all the Addington trial information including discovery and testimony vanishes into thin air as if it never happened.


"Otherwise quit bringing it up!"

 

[Pi brat]

Thanks for sharing.

Yes, Ames got it right, I qouted Scott Kirby, and he is right, usapa is incapable of getting a contract for the pilots.

Serves him pretty well, doesn't it? Question to you-how much will it benefit him personally to not get a contract? You ate it up with a spoon and asked him for more. Nice.

 

[BoeingBoy]

You ate it up with a spoon and asked him for more. Nice.

Well, it seems some East posters quote Parker/Kirby as gospel when either says something they like and calls what they say spin when it doesn't support the argument of the day.

Jim

 

[Pi brat]

Well, it seems some East posters quote Parker/Kirby as gospel when either says something they like and calls what they say spin when it doesn't support the argument of the day.

Jim

Yeah, they do and I've been quick to quote them when it favors the east, but I don't ever remember smiling when they said we can't get a contract.

 

[Barrister]

I gotta share this story with you guys. First class pax on the shuttle to BOS yesterday says to the A that he is an investment banker and had just come from a meeting with Kirby. He was doing an analysis on US for his firm as to the suitability of throwing some money Dougie's and Scooter's way. When the balance sheets and details were discussed, the matter of the separate contracts of the FA's and pilots came up.
Kirby was quoted as saying that the company was completely happy with the situation as it is - separate ops. And that it would be FOOLISH to sign new contracts that would increase the company's expenses by approx. 200 million.
Was he playing to the crowd? Or is this the true colors of management?
Remember Dougie stating in the last crew news that getting a new contract done quickly was the "right thing to do"???
The truth rears it ugly head.

A lot of ink gets devoted to this. Dougie saves AT LEAST 122M
per year sep. ops. Do you really think he wants a single contract
until a suitor is at the door???. Wasn't he willing to pay Delta wages
2 years ago, Hello anyone there?????

NICDOA
NPJB

 

[CallawayGolf]

Serves him pretty well, doesn't it? Question to you-how much will it benefit him personally to not get a contract? You ate it up with a spoon and asked him for more. Nice.

I try to make a steady diet of consuming truths. Likewise, I avoid taking in lies, falsehoods, and propaganda like I avoid brussel sprouts. I would trust Doug, Scott and the rest of the management team to tell the truth any day over anything USAPA or its blinded worshipers on this board have to say. Until USAPA tells the truth about and accepts the NIC, they really can't be trusted to say anything truthful at all.

 

[Freighterguynow]

Well, if you're an East pilot around here, you can say that the West gets what's left of what they brought to the merger, while the East gets what left of what they brought to the merger plus any additions since the merger...

If Phx grows then the America West pilots should reap the benefits. If it shrinks then they have the pain.

Same for the East bases.

If that sounds unreasonable then so be it.

 

[nic4us]

I avoid brussel sprouts.

Not me,

Every christmas I blanch a half dozen garlic cloves, mash them with butter, stir in the steamed brussel sprouts and maybe just a hint of balsamic.

Perfect with that prime rib roast, mashed potatoes and gravy.

I eat it up with a fork, not a spoon.

 

[Freighterguynow]

Actually, what the West brought to the merger was a solvent airline with 142 aircraft,

And today another 24% of your pilot group should be on the street if they were not flying someone else's routes.

Oil isn't $35 anymore, Vegas and Phoenix are the foreclosure capitals of the world.

Get a grip or join Pan Am and Eastern.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Yeah, they do and I've been quick to quote them when it favors the east, but I don't ever remember smiling when they said we can't get a contract.

Just do what I do - assume Parker/Kirby/USAPA/AOL/posters here all spin the message to fit any audience all the time. Take nothing any of them say as absolute gospel.

Jim

 

[nic4us]

And today another 24% of your pilot group should be on the street if they were not flying someone else's routes.

Oil isn't $35 anymore, Vegas and Phoenix are the foreclosure capitals of the world.

Get a grip or join Pan Am and Eastern.

Why??? I did not work at AAA.

I am actually okay with your if PHX grows the West pilots benefit scheme. Because the fact of the matter is that PHX grew right into PHL,CLT and DCA.

Your claim of the 24 % of West pilots should be on the street is very enlightening coming from a pilot who worked for an airline that absent this merger actually had 33% of its pilots on the street.

 

[BoeingBoy]

If Phx grows then the America West pilots should reap the benefits. If it shrinks then they have the pain.

Sounds fair to the Easties, doesn't it? Especially after the west has shrunk more than the east and most Easties seem convenienced that the west will shrink further while the east grows. Not what USAPA has proposed though - that is even worse for the Westies.

Jim

 

[Run Like Hell]

If Phx grows then the America West pilots should reap the benefits. If it shrinks then they have the pain.

Same for the East bases.

If that sounds unreasonable then so be it.

It is totally UNreasonable, because things change.

Only an idiot would propose that the west can have PHX and LAS, the east can have PIT, PHL, CLT DCA, BOS, LGA and all thats it.

Why? Flying will shift, flying will shift that might not otherwise occured if the merger had not happened.

That's why fences are out of favor, things change.

That's why USAPA's "generous" C/R proposal will never fly, it locks the pilots and the company into something that is impossible to manage and change.

Just look what's happened to PIT, LGA, BOS and LAS since the merger.


The old eastie diehards never thought PIT (oh the 9's, the 111's, colodny) would close as a domicle, but guess what?

 

[767jetz]

If Phx grows then the America West pilots should reap the benefits. If it shrinks then they have the pain.

Same for the East bases.

If that sounds unreasonable then so be it.

That does sound unreasonable. I think anyone who holds onto an idea like that will be sorely disappointed.

How much would US bases have shrunk if the merger never happened? How much will they grow if the company is successful? Once you merge, you have no more claim to flying, as a combined company moves assets around differently due to the new dynamic of a larger airline. That's the whole point of merging. You may have a claim to aircraft or seats, but that's determined by the merger committee, through a process that often ends in binding arbitration.

 

[Run Like Hell]

That does sound unreasonable. I think anyone who holds onto an idea like that will be sorely disappointed.

How much would US bases have shrunk if the merger never happened? How much will they grow if the company is successful? Once you merge, you have no more claim to flying, as a combined company moves assets around differently due to the new dynamic of a larger airline. That's the whole point of merging. You may have a claim to aircraft or seats, but that's determined by the merger committee, through a process that often ends in binding arbitration.

Kind of what I tried to say, but was too much in a hurry.