US Pilots Labor Discussion

[AWA320]

Did you come from Mesa or Transtates?

Yeah, the Company was crappy and is crappy. I never said it wasn't crappy. It will continue to be crappy. Don't think for a minute that getting your NIC number is going to make the company NOT crappy.

I used to work for Trans States as it was my very first commuter. I left and went to Air Wisconsin which was a MUCH BETTER place all around. USair is not fun to work for today because we are all unhappy. I dont know if they show these commercials back east but here in calif there is a commercial about calif dairy products. Its states "happy cows make happy cheese" we are the cows the employees and we are all very unhappy. East pilots are unhappy with the state of their careers for the last 20 yrs, west pilots are unhappy with the stagnation and being merged with an extremely unhappy group making both groups even more unhappy. East and west F/A are unhappy, east and west Mech are unhappy. It seems that the only ones happy here are management. Why do you think that is??? Dispite all this unhappiness the planes still leave and arrive on time thus resulting in management bonuses. If I were management I too would be very happy. My cows may be unhappy but they still fall in line and get the job done that makes me money.

Kinda makes you wonder now doesnt it??

AWA320

 

[No Land Green]

Where have we heard this I won't commute BS before, when MAMA needs new LUIS VUITTON, you'll commute! MM!

Heard it, but in the end, there is walk (commute) on the talk.............The A-330 and B-767 is a drug ($$$) that reaches all the way to California and beyond.......Good point MM!!!!!

 

[AWA320]

LMAO, there never was a debate intended. Just stating my opinion. Here's another one for you. The sum of the parts is greater than the whole. All the rush to the altar seems to be a West issue.......

Happy Holidays!!!

And if you can't see how that would be the end point of your flying here then you are truely blind my friend. Fragmentation is a very ugly deal for those being fragmented. I hope you dont think that a carrier would take PHL and CLT and you would be happy as clams. If that were to happen you would look more like ATA does today and we both know how that ended...

Be very carefull what you wish for...

Happy holidays to you as well

AWA320

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Yet this management continues to make money, why is that?? Because people are always looking to get the most for the least. Yes they will complain about the poor service provided by the inflight that is very upset over the fact that they are being exploited day in and day out. The customer will state that they will never fly usair again but when the time comes and the other air carriers are charging 400 to go see grandma and USair is charging 225 they will come back and save that money for Jr's Xbox.

Its all about the money MM and once you grasp that fact they rest will just fall into place.

AWA320

Really, we already grasp your "want the most for the least" but you call it NIC! You know the same theory applies to merger partners, It's all about the money and your PHX hub is well a flub! MM! Thanx for the economic lesson I'll add it to my collection Sweet Pea memorabilia! MM!

 

[crazystnic]

Where have we heard this I won't commute BS before, when MAMA needs new LUIS VUITTON, you'll commute! MM!

*******************************

agreed, where have we heard that before.. I wont commute but then goes on to say if it's 200 per hour he will.

bottom line, when the list goes together people will commute east and west.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

AWA was such a crappy little airline with bases in Phoenix and Las Vegas that no airline wanted or needed anything to do with it, other than one anyway. Help me out here, my memory is a little fuzzy, which one was that? Anyone?

 

[AWA320]

Heard it, but in the end, there is walk (commute) on the talk.............The A-330 and B-767 is a drug ($$$) that reaches all the way to California and beyond.......Good point MM!!!!!

It only appears that way to you because people have nowhere else to go. There was no west base for USAir so people had to commute and if they are in a position of no choice but to commute then hell yes I will take 76 or 330. Now give people the choice of having to commute from Cali to Phl or Cali to PHX and that dynamic changes drastically!!

AWA320

 

[crazystnic]

Now I am going to be honest here. When I got to AWA I had come from AWAC where we used line bidding. I used hate like hell going thru line after line looking for what wanted then having to bid 90 something lines and hope I get one of my top 5 choices. Lets face it after the top 5 we are all just settleing at that point for whats not going to make our stomach turn. I did however love that with line biddng I could build conflicts for vacation purposes.

Now I love PBS. I just put in things like dont start before this time dont end after this time always 3 days off between trips and weekends off. Now every now and then I put in for certain trips or to fly with certain people but for the most part its all about start and end times. I commute to Cali and hate to do that but I refuse to move. I began my career commuting from San Fran to JFK and I have no plans to do that transcon commute ever again unless forced to by base closures. There is not enough upgrade in the world for me to commute to PHL for an upgrade UNLESS its for over 200/hr and even then I would have to consider all I am giving up. Losing a day on each end causes in the long run divorce and I am certainly not considering that.

AWA320

 

[crazystnic]

bidding takes about 10 Minutes with Win Bid here.....

after talking with NC last week, they are not going to let company get away with any... "just trust Us" stuff.

We have been burned so many times with that crap.

quantify everything.

 

[No Land Green]

I used to work for Trans States as it was my very first commuter. I left and went to Air Wisconsin which was a MUCH BETTER place all around. USair is not fun to work for today because we are all unhappy. I dont know if they show these commercials back east but here in calif there is a commercial about calif dairy products. Its states "happy cows make happy cheese" we are the cows the employees and we are all very unhappy. East pilots are unhappy with the state of their careers for the last 20 yrs, west pilots are unhappy with the stagnation and being merged with an extremely unhappy group making both groups even more unhappy. East and west F/A are unhappy, east and west Mech are unhappy. It seems that the only ones happy here are management. Why do you think that is??? Dispite all this unhappiness the planes still leave and arrive on time thus resulting in management bonuses. If I were management I too would be very happy. My cows may be unhappy but they still fall in line and get the job done that makes me money.

Kinda makes you wonder now doesnt it??

AWA320

Many of your points above are well taken. However, the NIC Award destroyed ANY unity between East and West. No matter what the outcome, if it ever comes together, it will always be a severely fractured pilot group that will be powerless.


When you mention the word "stagnation" to and East Pilot, you are going to get ZERO sympathy. This is a dynamic industry as witnessed by BOTH the East and West, now and in the past. You can't expect "career expectations" to be a constant or entitlement.

Yes the cows are unhappy and management will continue to tip US, East and West, at every opportunity provided. If the Herd can be unified, then you will see the Sand Castle squirm............

 

[No Land Green]

And if you can't see how that would be the end point of your flying here then you are truely blind my friend. Fragmentation is a very ugly deal for those being fragmented. I hope you dont think that a carrier would take PHL and CLT and you would be happy as clams. If that were to happen you would look more like ATA does today and we both know how that ended...

Be very carefull what you wish for...

Happy holidays to you as well

AWA320

FWIW, we, the East, have been lied to so much in the past and continue to be lied to by Management. So if the place folds, so be it. We have no control over that. Working for free is not going to save a failing Company, if LCC is an ATA, well then it doesn't matter what we do, it's going to fail.

For once it would be nice to have a Management Team that isn't a bunch of Real Estate Flippers. Listening to the Sand Castle Realty Company, it appears as if we are again stuck with commission hungry Real Estate Flippers.

 

[AWA320]

Where have we heard this I won't commute BS before, when MAMA needs new LUIS VUITTON, you'll commute! MM!

Then let me give you mama's number and you ask her yourself:>))))))))))) She likes me being home as long as I can be. I was unhappy and always tired as hell when I was doing that longball commuting and I was YOUNGER too!

I am not one who has big airplane envy. I could finsh out my career on the baby bus and be just fine. That commute to Phl or clt from here is 4hrs then have to fly a min 8hrs and thats AFTER I lost a day to get there and have to commute back home on my first of three days off! SHITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT, that aint gonna happen.

AWA320

 

[AWA320]

Many of your points above are well taken. However, the NIC Award destroyed ANY unity between East and West. No matter what the outcome, if it ever comes together, it will always be a severely fractured pilot group that will be powerless.


When you mention the word "stagnation" to and East Pilot, you are going to get ZERO sympathy. This is a dynamic industry as witnessed by BOTH the East and West, now and in the past. You can't expect "career expectations" to be a constant or entitlement.

Yes the cows are unhappy and management will continue to tip US, East and West, at every opportunity provided. If the Herd can be unified, then you will see the Sand Castle squirm............

What can I say to that??? Lets look at something that no one really thought of. I dont see any way around the arbitration so the east mind set is burn time to gain thru attrition. Not a bad plan. They get that upgrade and that pay raise they wanted, good lines and vacation and all is good right? Then there is the time when that a contract is needed and we both know that the NIC is gonna be the list but the east got their upgrade so they are happy now.

Ok here is where it goes bad my friend. That good schedule you love and great vacation with the days off you love will start to peal away as I am more senior and I begin to take that away (not me personally) and it goes on and on. Now your are working weekends 5 numbers above res cant get the vacation you like and now you are pissed off to the highest of pisstivity. One way or another you and I are going to be pissed off at one point in this game. Welcome to mergers class 101!!!

AWA320

 

[No Land Green]

What can I say to that??? Lets look at something that no one really thought of. I dont see any way around the arbitration so the east mind set is burn time to gain thru attrition. Not a bad plan. They get that upgrade and that pay raise they wanted, good lines and vacation and all is good right? Then there is the time when that a contract is needed and we both know that the NIC is gonna be the list but the east got their upgrade so they are happy now.

Ok here is where it goes bad my friend. That good schedule you love and great vacation with the days off you love will start to peal away as I am more senior and I begin to take that away (not me personally) and it goes on and on. Now your are working weekends 5 numbers above res cant get the vacation you like and now you are pissed off to the highest of pisstivity. One way or another you and I are going to be pissed off at one point in this game. Welcome to mergers class 101!!!

AWA320

Well, look at it from this angle. If the above plays out finally in say 5 years from now, the East will have lost over 1000 pilots, almost half. It appears as if we are in the upward movement mode again in the East. Last one was earlier this decade. So the East enjoys a steady move up over the next 5 years and recaptures what was lost over the last decade. Sure there will be po"d players again.

Um, this is merger class 401 for me 😉

 

[Ames]

Many of your points above are well taken. However, the NIC Award destroyed ANY unity between East and West. No matter what the outcome, if it ever comes together, it will always be a severely fractured pilot group that will be powerless.

The Nic award may have been a disappointment of major proportions to the east pilots but what destroyed ANY unity between east and west was the east's inability to take that disappointment like men and move on with a final and binding decision. That dishonorable action in itself was the cause of the tremendous disrepect that the west has for the east.

You agreed to the process. You were bound to the result. You threw a tantrum. Who wants to be united with that baby?