US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Iclubbabyseals]

Because the west was below contractual limits while the east was at least 20% above contractual limits.

So, you admit that the west was given 24% of "traditional" east flying (increasing west flying by 50%), without a merged contract. That would seem somewhat, um, premature?

Where are all the huzzahs from west pilots who normally would have been furloughed, but, were not? So, the east pilots saved over 33% of west jobs, at least in the short term, right? To the expense of those darn furloughed east pilots and all east pilot's "expectations"? Nice one, Jim.

BTW, for those west (and the few, sigh, east) pilots bereft of common sense and more than double digit IQ, this is completely different from the afterbirth known as "Nicholau".

 

[Phoenix]

I poorly worded that however I am certain that you got the jest of of my post....

Injunction

Of course, the gist of your post is that it was made in jest.

(Insert laugh tracks here.)

 

[Injunction junction]

Um, the number, 40%, is way wrong and to say a furloughee has no expectation of a pilot job is just plain stupidity.

Let us talk about the 24% of east flying "gifted" to the west pilots.

Since the east group flew about twice what the west group flew, that represents an increase of almost 50% of flying for the west, allowing at least one third of west pilots to stay on the property, i.e. not furloughed. Which means that the east pilots suffered a temporary decrease in recalling furloughees and advancement just so that some 600 west pilots would not be furloughed. That is a fact. ma'am.

Reading comprehension my man I said no expectation of a pilot position with usair. Ma'am??? Ok if that works for you to help you understand better.

Injunction

 

[Rookie Jr]

Stop while you are ahead please. What you have just start is not at all a principle of law. DOH in this case is so far from fair and equitable that even a 4 grader could understand it. This is the very reason that Nic made the list the way he did. LCC will not end up in court unless it breeches its agreement as per the TA. Now once again YOU CAN NOT TAKE TWO CARRIER WITH VERY UNLIKE SENIORTY LIST AND MAKE IT FAIR WITH DOH! Why can you seem to grasp this very elementary principle?

Injunction

How can you tell Swan to quit while he is ahead? He is so far out of the loop that he would have to catch up just to be behind.

 

[Injunction junction]

Do we need to call 911, have you suffered some kind of stroke? HAL made more sense when half his memory was pulled.

Grab another cold one and get back to the game. This can wait.

RR

No Reed and please for once in your life try to be serious. I know you clowns hope and wish but we are beyond that now. You had you illegal fence and you had better pray that there is no damages suit to follow. usloppy from what I heard in philly last week flying east routes and getting paid deadhead pay at 100% was that they are in financial trouble.

Yes I am watch my boys slaughter buffalo at the moment.

Injunction

 

[eastcoast]

The way I read the 9th it does have to do with ripeness. It's like the court told the west pilots that they were trying to prevail on something that may never happen, and for many reasons. Even though USAPA said they were going to do something that they viewed as harmful, for many reasons that may not come to fruition, so they had to wait and see what negotiations produced and then see if they were harmed. Just because the 9th said it may not be the Nic, does not translate into USAPA can do anything they want. The court concluded that any number of results COULD come from negotiations, and one could be a solution that while not the Nic, not as harmful as they view DOH.

A solution that is not the Nic and does not harm the west would be cost prohibitive. DOH with so many restrictions and high enough pay raise for the west to just give up. With their resolve and the legal wind at their back, I doubt that would be attainable.

Now the other side of that coin is what rights/responsibilities do the west pilots have? Why is section 22 different to all other sections? Why are they entitled to the Nic forever? What if we get to a point that we actually don't ratify a contract with the Nic in it, can we change it then?

No. If we get a contract with the Nic (assuming it is because of the declaratory judgement) and it doesn't pass, the ball goes back to the company to sweeten the deal until it passes. The other sections would have to be changed. Not section 22.

I guess from my POV and from talking to several guys on both sides of the argument, USAPA has the right to negotiate any section of the contract. With that right goes the responsibility to represent all members fairly. If we negotiate a contract with DOH and it gets ratified, will that pass DFR II? I don't know, and that opinion is generally split right down the east west line.

A DOH contract (absent my first point of a hugely expensive carrot) will certainly trigger DFR II. I think we all agree on that. So based on past performance it is more likely than not that DFR II would be successful. Not a given by any means, but probable. And that's also assuming the DJ was unsuccessful, since we would not even get to a DOH section 22 without the company being released from responsibility. USAPA might be willing to throw caution to the wind and move forward, but the company will not.

There could be things out there that make this all moot. SWA seems to have found a way around all of this and McCaskill Bond. Will that be in our future?

If the company played hardball with us, they could threaten BK#3 and shutter us unless we accept their terms. (basically what SWA threatened Air Tran pilots)

But the bottom line of this discussion is a choice between DOH with a contract that does not harm the west (and would pass with 100% since only one pilot can file DFR II), or Nic with a contract that is acceptable to 51% of us on the east. Given those two choices, the more likely, less costly scenario is Nic with a decent contract.

 

[Rookie Jr]

So, you agree that binding arbitration is simply a tool. Thanks.

When did I say that? It is a means to an end, final and binding. You obviously will never understand. Keep trying, sealbeater. Your desperation is certainly amusing.

 

[Injunction junction]

Of course, the gist of your post is that it was made in jest.

(Insert laugh tracks here.)

Why not insert a photo of you and the rest of the angry f/o club? Insert CLOWN photo

Injunction

 

[Rookie Jr]

Nobody "compared west pilots to pedophiles", child. Don't you wish.

The coaches (as in plural) are not being prosecuted for sexual molestation, something you, in particular, seem to be very familiar with. The issue is the cover up, something tempe also seems familiar with. You seem to deliberately misread the situation just to create chaos. Like Mover.

As much as you easties like to defend your own home grown (upskirt) pedophile I guess it is you that should be compared to Paterno and his group.

 

[Injunction junction]

How can you tell Swan to quit while he is ahead? He is so far out of the loop that he would have to catch up just to be behind.

I know but its be kind to a clown week.

Injunction

 

[Rookie Jr]

Um, the number, 40%, is way wrong and to say a furloughee has no expectation of a pilot job is just plain stupidity.

Let us talk about the 24% of east flying "gifted" to the west pilots.

Since the east group flew about twice what the west group flew, that represents an increase of almost 50% of flying for the west, allowing at least one third of west pilots to stay on the property, i.e. not furloughed. Which means that the east pilots suffered a temporary decrease in recalling furloughees and advancement just so that some 600 west pilots would not be furloughed. That is a fact. ma'am.

I know it's futile to try to confuse you with the facts but flying has simply been redistributed as east flies former west flights, etc. The block hour grievance is proof that flying on the west had been reduced and now, having won, is currently being held around minimum for the west.

That being said, sealbeater, keep trying. You look so desperate and oh, so weak.

 

[mrbreeze]

I know it's futile to try to confuse you with the facts but flying has simply been redistributed as east flies former west flights, etc. The block hour grievance is proof that flying on the west had been reduced and now, having won, is currently being held around minimum for the west.

That being said, sealbeater, keep trying. You look so desperate and oh, so weak.

It should be obvious that the company is playing the East and West against each other and will do anything they can to save a buck.

You guys should really give up on this NIC idea and join the party going on here in the East.
breeze

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

Reading comprehension my man I said no expectation of a pilot position with usair.

Sorry, my friendly girl, but, every furloughee has an expectation of a pilot position at the carrier from which they were furloughed. Otherwise, they would, and, should, sign away their "seniority rights" and get on with their lives. Making them no longer furloughees. Right?

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

A solution that is not the Nic and does not harm the west would be cost prohibitive.

Why don't you let management decide what is "cost prohibitive" or not? What, exactly, do you know about it? It seems your desire to be in the left seat has overcome your possible reasoning capabilities.

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

It is a means to an end, final and binding.

Indeed, little girl. "means to an end" is generally considered, amongst rational folk, as a tool. Thanks for playing. Let us know when your IQ increases to double digits.