US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

...have been singularly focused from the outset on crippling the efforts of USAPA President Mike Cleary and Vice President Randy Mowrey.

Think about this boys

YHGTBSM!

What efforts are you talking about? Failed RICO? Failed Status Quo in NY? Failed work action? Failed DOH integration?

There is nothing to think about. APA has seen the incompetence that is USAPA and they're probably salivating at the hope of integrating with USAPA so that they can have their way.

Cleary and Mowrey have done nothing and I'm amazed that you'd even write this garbage on a public forum?

This has got to be one of the dumbest posts to date.

Wow! :blink:

 

[jetjok1]

What the hell is going on here!?!?!

I'm having more feelings.

Save your feelings........im not interested in what you think or feel. If you were paying attention, my position hasn't changed one iota.........

 

[nic4us]

And there it is on full display - the AWA scumbag stealing jobs attitude.

Those jobs required to "bring the East up to" the West vacation level were originally taken from East pilots when their vacation was decimated using the AWA contract as the target. Under NIC they will all be transferred to AWA lowlifes.

The best part is these lowlifes have absolutely totally convinced themselves that this is their right. They think that 3400 East pilots are all just out in left field.

You have got to love it...

Boeing Driver

You really are a complete moron.

First, lets say it is 90 required newhires, even "under the Nic" east would get at least 60 of those slots.

Second, if your crappy contract was written to target the AWA contract, why is there even a need to now bring you up to West AWA contract vacation levels? You should already have them if AWA was the target. That BS has been spread long enough. The "target" was a number low enough to make your bankrupt airline profitable, and guess what, they did not get enough out of you guys at levels well below the AWA contract and your airline went bust.

 

[Code Name V]

Six paragraphs of BS.

The fight is over. Look at your fellow posters here on this board - they're done. Many out east have had enough. You won't go to SCOTUS. The appeal won't go anywhere.

All those upgrades you think are coming aren't.

You may want to fight to the death, but the majority out east have had it.

You need to start thinking about your employment here and whether or not you want to continue.

The Nic is coming.

ONE poster tells you he has had enough and you apply it to over 3000 pilots. Looks like you are the one with their head up their ass?. But dream on and continue to try to convince the rest of us. You only have a few thousand left. Keep trying.

V

 

[nic4us]

The part that no one on the West will ever get is the NIC was an ALPA INTERNAL UNION PROCESS... IT WAS BINDING ON ALPA as their bargaining position... not USAPA. While a judge may impose it (doubtful), otherwise, just like any other section of the contract, everything is negotiable until it is ratified.

Keep it up with the Seeham rationalizations of why it is okay to steal the West pilots's jobs, it is going nowhere.

Here is the true fact of the matter.

An arbitration took place between the east and West pilot groups. Those two groups were represented by ALPA. Now those two groups are represented by usapa. Get it?

Representational change does not change the duty of fair representation owed to the TWO groups, and upholding the result of the arbitration they entered.

Further, the company is contractually bound to the Nic, unless it agrees with usapa to modify the TA. If the company colludes with usapa in stealing the West pilots seniority rights by modifying the TA, game over.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

what is to vote on? and the west keeps spewing out of their mouths that the NIC is Fair,,,

it clearly isn't fair or they would agree to the 10 year fence and we could move on..

but NO... all CB keeps saying is put it to a vote and all the rest say is live up to the agreement.

well I'm living up to it.. the TA says until there is a JOINT CBA there is no NIC...

and if I have my way there never will be a JOINT CBA with the NIC.

Denial
Anger
Bargaining
Depression
Acceptance

You got two more stages to go before you can feel normal

 

[Boeing Driver]

You really are a complete moron.

First, lets say it is 90 required newhires, even "under the Nic" east would get at least 60 of those slots.

Second, if your crappy contract was written to target the AWA contract, why is there even a need to now bring you up to West AWA contract vacation levels? You should already have them if AWA was the target. That BS has been spread long enough. The "target" was a number low enough to make your bankrupt airline profitable, and guess what, they did not get enough out of you guys at levels well below the AWA contract and your airline went bust.

The lowball AWA contract absolutely was the target the company was pushing throughout bankruptcy 2, which we all know now was filed to facilitate the merger with AWA. The fact that the company was able to wrest greater than the lowball AWA contract from us was due to internal politics and using the threat of the bankruptcy court.

AWA undercut the entire industry for years, and the fact that the very best you were able to achieve on your own was to get hired by AWA is pitiful - therefore, it is somewhat understandable why you are as you are.

Boeing Driver

 

[Boeing Driver]

Six paragraphs of BS.

The fight is over. Look at your fellow posters here on this board - they're done. Many out east have had enough. You won't go to SCOTUS. The appeal won't go anywhere.

All those upgrades you think are coming aren't.

You may want to fight to the death, but the majority out east have had it.

You need to start thinking about your employment here and whether or not you want to continue.

The Nic is coming.

You would be mistaken.

AWA pilots have no idea at the level of anger on the East; the average East pilot absolutely despises the AWA pilots, and this is growing everyday...

Boeing Driver

 

[nic4us]

The lowball AWA contract absolutely was the target the company was pushing throughout bankruptcy 2, which we all know now was filed to facilitate the merger with AWA. The fact that the company was able to wrest greater than the lowball AWA contract from us was due to internal politics and using the threat of the bankruptcy court.

AWA undercut the entire industry for years, and the fact that the very best you were able to achieve on your own was to get hired by AWA is pitiful - therefore, it is somewhat understandable why you are as you are.

Boeing Driver

The fact that usair would hire someone as ignorant as you, reinforces my decision to never seek employment at that POS airline.

Unfortunately, the hometown airline I went to work for became successful enough to purchase that same POS airline from bankrupcy.

Oh well...such is life.

 

[nic4us]

You would be mistaken.

AWA pilots have no idea at the level of anger on the East; the average East pilot absolutely despises the AWA pilots, and this is growing everyday...

Boeing Driver

Really??

What are you folks angry about??

You got your LOA93 dream job and all the seperate ops attrition that goes with it!!

 

[nic4us]

Sorry Charlie,

You may think you won something here or that Silver will somehow impose the Nic but you are no closer than you ever were. Even if you are correct and a vote would pass, you wouldn't see it for years and years and years. By then, so many will have upgraded that you will have nowhere to go. You may think you won some victory but what your limited mind cannot see is that the greatest way to unify a people is to have an attack on your own soil. Nicalou was an attack, Wake was an attack, and Kasher was THE attack.

The anger that resulted in tossing ALPA is nothing in comparison to what is happening right now. So go ahead and gloat. You will be your own worst enemy. The resultant escalated hatred towards you and the company will prevent any future merger as there isn't a management company out there that would come within light years of dealing with this polarized group. In the end, if DUI Doug wants a merger he will have to either sell you off or convince a partner that there won't be a meltdown.

I also wonder how you think a vote is even in the making? News flash, Einstein; you can't vote without a complete contract and they are years and years from having one. Even then what makes you think that the NAC would even send it out to vote with their view of the Nic and the fact that the head of the NAC would be one of the ones hardest hit? Even then, should Dougweiser even make an offer that comes close to acceptable, it would then have to pass the BPR just to go to vote. With the current stance on DOH and no alteration in the bylaws, and their determination of an industry standard contract, that is not likely. On top of it all, should the Nic be forced into consideration, you can expect a complete reversal of the NAC and how and what they negotiate for. By the time it ever made it to vote, those that think the Nic would give them the windfall they believe they deserve will be sadly disappointed that they waited so long for so little.

But hang in there and keep those donations coming. Since I think it is likely that we will be back to the Ninth again and You will be back to the SCOTUS, everyone is going to need funds, so please keep those donations coming and keep your union dues paid up. We need them to continue the ongoing fight against you. You are quick to remind us how much more you make. Good for you as you will need them to support two competing attorneys.

In addition, regardless of what you may believe, most here continue to understand the meaning of a fight to the death. There will be no capitulation. One of us will become a casualty of war and it is pretty hard to overcome the majority. My bet will remain on the East.

You think the fight is over. I see it as just beginning and it just got a big reinforcement. Get ready. Once the shock of Kasher is over, this group will pick up the fight with a vigor you have yet to witness.

V

Hey V,

Ever occur to you that it might be the trouble making morons out east that get sold off??

I mean seriously? What makes you think it would be the West that got sold off?

Oh, I know, it is that same complete lack of situational awareness that has gotten the east into trouble since day one.


Have another question for you. Are you in anyway a usapa rep? Like BPR member, or NAC member, or Committee chairman/member. Do you have any post within usapa whatsoever, other than MIG?

 

[Move2CLT]

ONE poster tells you he has had enough and you apply it to over 3000 pilots. Looks like you are the one with their head up their ass?. But dream on and continue to try to convince the rest of us. You only have a few thousand left. Keep trying.

V

One?

Ok Boo boo, you keep telling yourself that. And go back a few pages - you'll learn something.

And no one hs worried about an east meltdown. We've seen how well you pull that off. LMAO.

 

[Move2CLT]

Save your feelings........im not interested in what you think or feel. If you were paying attention, my position hasn't changed one iota.........

Uh oh, you need a hug.

 

[Move2CLT]

You would be mistaken.

AWA pilots have no idea at the level of anger on the East; the average East pilot absolutely despises the AWA pilots, and this is growing everyday...

Boeing Driver

Blah, blah, blah we are pissed blah, blah.

Too bad you guys don't have a modicum of intelligence to harness all that anger. I'd actually be worried then.

As for the rest - Bull crap.

It's a small group. You guys aren't that majority your perpetual wet dream leads you to believe.

Piedmont, driver, and a few others gave figured it out.

You will too.

 

[aquagreen73s]

The lowball AWA contract absolutely was the target the company was pushing throughout bankruptcy 2, which we all know now was filed to facilitate the merger with AWA. The fact that the company was able to wrest greater than the lowball AWA contract from us was due to internal politics and using the threat of the bankruptcy court.

AWA undercut the entire industry for years, and the fact that the very best you were able to achieve on your own was to get hired by AWA is pitiful - therefore, it is somewhat understandable why you are as you are.

Boeing Driver

I'm grossing $110k this year and I'm gone from home 8 nights a month. I pay $350/month less in health insurance than you. I get 28 days of vacation each year, 4:17 in training, and full pay on deadheads. And....I'm an F/O.

Lowball my a$$.

You would be mistaken.

AWA pilots have no idea at the level of anger on the East; the average East pilot absolutely despises the AWA pilots, and this is growing everyday...

Boeing Driver

Hmmm. That hasn't been my experience. Whenever I have the opportunity to chat with an Eastie on the jumpseat, they don't bat an eye when I tell them who I am and what I've done to stop DOH. They seem to follow the logic when I explain to them why the Nic is it and that there can be no compromise due to USAPA's own actions of getting rid of the West MEC. Most will freely admit that DOH is a fool's errand but that the lunacy on the East has been going on long before AWA came along.

Like it or not, we're turning a corner and you DOH west haters are becoming quite isolated. The Nic is no longer an "if" but "when." I'd say sooner than you West haters care to imagine and yes, the thought of just you specifically having to swallow the Nic or man up and quit is a pleasurable thought. I harbor no animus towards the East. We will get a joint contract and we will move forward and for the handful like yourself who can't handle it, then we'll all celebrate your firing. Life is too short and this job is too good to put up with useless people like yourself.