US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

No friends?

3000 +'s sounds like I have some easy fans as well. And I know it was you that cried hard enough to put me on mod review. You have a history of running to them

Your posts lately seem desperate. Sounds like you see your fight is coming to an end.

Time to embrace the Nic boo boo.

 

[mrbreeze]

No friends?

3000 +'s sounds like I have some easy fans as well. And I know it was you that cried hard enough to put me on mod review. You have a history of running to them

Your posts lately seem desperate. Sounds like you see your fight is coming to an end.

Time to embrace the Nic boo boo.

Thruthfully.....wasn't me. I have been busy with things outside of the company for the last month and wasn't paying any attention to the board for awhile. I DO know that there are others that understand how the board works and are keeping an eye on your BS tho, must have been one of them.

What I really don't understand is how you can think you can be elected to any office representing our pilots with what you post here. I mean, even the mods are watching you. I will be very surprised if you get a resonable number of votes with your attitude.

breeze

 

[CallawayGolf]

IYHO......it's a two way street, thus no TA accepting the NIC. You are not going to ___ us over!

breeze

How would accepting the results of an unbiased, neutral binding arbitration award result in the carnal knowledge as you suggest?

How is retaining the same relative seniority status you came to the merged airline with the same thing as you suggest?

As I've said many times before, USAPA has a federal mandate to negotiate for a TA/JCBA in good faith and they will soon likely have a federal injunction that demands the NIC be used for S22 of any such contract. So USAPA can fail in it primary duty to negotiate a NIC inclusive TA and suffer the consequences for not doing so, or USAPA can suck it up and put the best TA out that they can negotiate and see how the MIGS feel about it. The other choice is to fail to negotiate and get another DFR with penalties attached or get released to self-help where Management will put the NIC-inclusive contract out under their own terms. With the warring factions of east pilots plus an uncooperative west block, being released to self-help would not be a good situation for USAPA. In that case the company to a great extent and the west pilots to a lesser extent get what they want out of the deal. The east pilots, as per usual, would sit by and let others decide how the rest of their careers will go having forfeited any and all say in the matter.

So that carnal knowledge you were hoping to avoid is coming your way via your own stubborn resistance to the reality of the situation as well as from your fellow east pilots who hold the same detached understanding of reality.

 

[Move2CLT]

Thruthfully.....wasn't me. I have been busy with things outside of the company for the last month and wasn't paying any attention to the board for awhile. I DO know that there are others that understand how the board works and are keeping an eye on your BS tho, must have been one of them.

breeze

Two mods running the show and only one checks it daily.

So are you including the mouse in your pocket to pump up the numbers?

 

[mrbreeze]

How would accepting the results of an unbiased, neutral binding arbitration award result in the carnal knowledge as you suggest?

1- NIC is flawed from the get go because of the MDA pilot situation.

2- It's a windfall for the West pilots.

breeze

 

[Move2CLT]

1- NIC is flawed from the get go because of the MDA pilot situation.

2- It's a windfall for the West pilots.

breeze

1. It's not flawed and MDA had nothing to do with it.

2. It's a fair and equitable award.

 

[Move2CLT]

When did this pal crap start?

And you're starting to ramble like MM. Is that LOA93 getting to you?

You're losing it boo boo.

 

[CallawayGolf]

1- NIC is flawed from the get go because of the MDA pilot situation.

2- It's a windfall for the West pilots.

breeze

The east MEC certified the list per the agreement and per ALPA policy. So, it would seem everyone prior to May 2007 believed the MDA pilots were furloughed from mainline and thus righfully belonged exactly where the award placed them. You can't intentionally make a mistake on your tax return and then claim that you don't owe taxes and penalties for the error in calculations because a mistake was made. If it was that easy to get out of honoring your obligations then agreements wouldn't be worth the paper they were printed on. The MDA pilots go behind the last active east/west pilots at the PID date. So there is no controversy and the west and the arbitration panel had nothing to do with the certified list the east MEC presented. All of the east furloughees are back to work now anyway so this is really a non-issue or just a smoke screen to justify a violation of the agreements.

Please provide an objective definition of a windfall under ALPA policy. I have analyzed this before with another poster and proven that there was no windfall to the west, but feel free to give it another go. I don't mind going through and debunking that misconception again.

 

[mrbreeze]

When did this pal crap start?

And you're starting to ramble like MM. Is that LOA93 getting to you?

You're losing it boo boo.

Ok....my mistake, just trying to be fair. Disregard the, "pal" stuff, DH.

Sure seems to be hard to be honest when people don't want to hear it, due to their own agendas.

LOA 93 is not a factor for me....I will be taking an A320 bid in the next round of bids, while drawing PBGC money, making more than a West Captain.....no biggie.

Sorry, but I promise that you will not get my vote. I don't trust you Move2.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

Just a word to the wise that the whole "outing" thing is a road no one needs to go down.

Plus against the board rules. Since the mods know everyone's real identity, I suspect that they're laughing at breezy and his feeble attempts at outing...

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

I suppose that those of us on the East were never given this info....first time I have seen it.

That's what happens when you allow yourself to be led like sheep. I've tried to tell ya'll that many times but as usual ya'll think you know more than anyone else...

Jim

 

[mrbreeze]

The east MEC certified the list per the agreement and per ALPA policy. So, it would seem everyone prior to May 2007 believed the MDA pilots were furloughed from mainline and thus righfully belonged exactly where the award placed them. You can't intentionally make a mistake on your tax return and then claim that you don't owe taxes and penalties for the error in calculations because a mistake was made. If it was that easy to get out of honoring your obligations then agreements wouldn't be worth the paper they were printed on. The MDA pilots go behind the last active east/west pilots at the PID date. So there is no controversy and the west and the arbitration panel had nothing to do with the certified list the east MEC presented. All of the east furloughees are back to work now anyway so this is really a non-issue or just a smoke screen to justify a violation of the agreements.

Please provide an objective definition of a windfall under ALPA policy. I have analyzed this before with another poster and proven that there was no windfall to the west, but feel free to give it another go. I don't mind going through and debunking that misconception again.

The ALPA MEC was wrong and also, in the 11th hour, USAir management agreed that the Mid Atlantic pilots were in fact part of mainline and not furloughed. So the statement, "so it seemed" does not apply. The MDA pilots deserve their rightful spot on any combined list, according to their DOH. This is the very reason that NIC got it wrong. It was flawed from the beginning.

As far as windfall....how many times do I have to state that losing 15 yrs of seniority is wrong. In your heart, you know that, so quit trying to leapfrog in your career.

breeze

 

[mrbreeze]

Plus against the board rules. Since the mods know everyone's real identity, I suspect that they're laughing at breezy and his feeble attempts at outing...

Jim

We all know that you live within your suspicions, Jim......long before this merger started it's rotting proceedure.

breeze

 

[CallawayGolf]

The ALPA MEC was wrong and also, in the 11th hour, USAir management agreed that the Mid Atlantic pilots were in fact part of mainline and not furloughed. So the statement, "so it seemed" does not apply. The MDA pilots deserve their rightful spot on any combined list, according to their DOH. This is the very reason that NIC got it wrong. It was flawed from the beginning.

As far as windfall....how many times do I have to state that losing 15 yrs of seniority is wrong. In your heart, you know that, so quit trying to leapfrog in your career.

breeze

The ALPA MEC was constituted by whom again? Also, please define 11th hour (date) and cite your source as to exactly what was said. Operating under the same certificate is an FAA issue, not a classification issue dealing with size and scope of the MDA operations. But hey, if these guy had been in the certified east MEC list you would be an unwaivering supporter of the NIC, right?

Please define "NIC got it wrong". Did the award not follow the ALPA merger policy? If not where is your proof? Did the NIC violate the RLA? If so, where is your proof? Did the NIC violate the terms of the TA? If so, where is your proof?

What level of seniority did a 15-year DOH afford at US on 9/26/2005? How many active pilots was this 15-year pilot senior to on that date? Or stated another way, how close in terms of the number of positions was this 15-year pilot to being furloughed in the next round of reductions? US was living proof that seniority does not equate to a specific DOH. Seniority is only attained by having people junior to you on the list. If you are the last name on the active list, it doesn't matter if you were hired 10-minutes ago, 10 years ago, or 25 years ago.

Being on the bottom of the list means you have no seniority regardless of the decade in which you came into the employ of the company. The only way to lose seniority is to have the population pool shrink so that you end up with less seniority than you previously had because of contrition. Likewise, the only way to gain seniority is to have people join the list after you, whether that increase at the bottom comes from attrition or growth is irrelevant. A company in decline reduces or eliminates seniority advancement while an expanding company creates seniority advancements. Which condition do you think US was in on 9/26/2005?

 

[mrbreeze]

Being on the bottom of the list means you have no seniority regardless of the decade in which you came into the employ of the company.

This is where you are totally wrong.....your number on that list is based on DOH, period.

breeze