US Pilots Labor Discussion

[AAviator]

That's pretty bold talk since you are just now starting down the path that USAirways East pilots walked several years ago. You don't have a clue as to the size and magnatude of the truck that is about to hit you.'

breeze

After your repeated "walks" you'd think you'd know the process....

The 1113 was filed this week. Its a modified version of this: http://www.restructuringamr.com/documents/20120321_CompanyTermSheet_1113_FINAL.pdf

The company has already backed away from the international over ride, with the exception of the Caribbean. They've come to the table on working out a freeze on the A plan, and thats reflected in the filing..

I'd have to say so far there's no surprises, and no trucks involved..

BTW, both DAL and NWA came to agreements prior to implementation of their respective 1113c sheets.

I will bet we do too.



Next?

 

[Beancounter]

Nope, guess again I'm in the top 370 or so.

Thank you, God!!!

 

[mrbreeze]

After your repeated "walks" you'd think you'd know the process....

The 1113 was filed this week. Its a modified version of this: http://www.restructuringamr.com/documents/20120321_CompanyTermSheet_1113_FINAL.pdf

The company has already backed away from the international over ride, with the exception of the Caribbean. They've come to the table on working out a freeze on the A plan, and thats reflected in the filing..

I'd have to say so far there's no surprises, and no trucks involved..

BTW, both DAL and NWA came to agreements prior to implementation of their respective 1113c sheets.

I will bet we do too.



Next?

Well, I hope you come though better than we did, however, proposals mean squat in BK. So look out for the headlights of that truck.

USAir raped us in BK #1......they didn't quite get it all, even though we had agreements with them, so they filed BK #2, raping us again, leaving us with this seniority dispute. At least we learned from the TWA boys and have fought for what is right.

An example is that when we gave up our DB plan, the company promised to make us whole to about $1million each in our Contribution Plan. They put $2300/mo into my DC plan for about 3 months. Next, they filed BK#2....our DC amounts were capped at 10% of our wages.....so now, they put about $900/mo into my account. Nothing is carved in stone at your point in time, so again.....watch your mouth.

Don't be to cocky, you are a very minor cog in the wheel.

breeze

 

[767one]

Well, I hope you come though better than we did, however, proposals mean squat in BK. So look out for the headlights of that truck.

USAir raped us in BK #1......they didn't quite get it all, even though we had agreements with them, so they filed BK #2, raping us again, leaving us with this seniority dispute. At least we learned from the TWA boys and have fought for what is right.

An example is that when we gave up our DB plan, the company promised to make us whole to about $1million each in our Contribution Plan. They put $2300/mo into my DC plan for about 3 months. Next, they filed BK#2....our DC amounts were capped at 10% of our wages.....so now, they put about $900/mo into my account. Nothing is carved in stone at your point in time, so again.....watch your mouth.

Don't be to cocky, you are a very minor cog in the wheel.

breeze

They might already have a BK 2 in the works to get what they missed in BK 1.

 

[Pi brat]

Seems like there were a bunch of pilots on here betting the F/As would ratify their T/A. As a matter of fact, I remember some west pilot saying a joint F/A contract was just around the corner years ago. Any comments?

 

[mrbreeze]

Seems like there were a bunch of pilots on here betting the F/As would ratify their T/A. As a matter of fact, I remember some west pilot saying a joint F/A contract was just around the corner years ago. Any comments?

Yep,



Again, they operate on a regional airline level, influenced by Mesa mentality. Funny that the flight attendant TA vote was so similar to the USAPA election in the percentages.

East or West, one of the groups have their perspective at least a bubble out of plumb......and it's not the East. 😉

Sorry, but it's true.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

Well, I hope you come though better than we did, however, proposals mean squat in BK.

Why shouldn't they...every other pilot group that went through bankruptcy came out better than the east...

Step #1 of the section 1113 process is the company proposal being put on the table. It defines the company's bottom line necessary for successfully restructuring. Just because east pilots repeatedly voted for more concessions doesn't mean other groups are dumb enough to do the same...

Jim

 

[Pi brat]

Yep,



Again, they operate on a regional airline level, influenced by Mesa mentality. Funny that the flight attendant TA vote was so similar to the USAPA election in the percentages.

East or West, one of the groups have their perspective at least a bubble out of plumb......and it's not the East. 😉

Sorry, but it's true.

breeze

One of the best emails my wife got during the vote was from a west F/A. She laid out the pros and cons, and she came to the conclusion that the small gains were not worth the hits, especially what she thought she would lose in seniority. Sound familiar?

 

[EastUS1]

Sea sponge? Given the big picture of what you represent, well lets just say "thats rich" 😉

I must be missing something here. While I honestly wish the folks at AA the best; is it not the case that American has already announced 400 pilots to be furloughed? Where then, is any source for such conceited glee as to how seemingly "well" things are going?

"Sea sponge?" Well....if the sea floor fits/etc.

 

[fatherabraham]

With PBS and our contract, it does not work the same way as the east for blockholders. Also, this is a big point of contention amongst the West.

But, I agree, you make a valid point. I would not call it stealing though....more like...umm...hmmm..maybe stealing is a good word for lack of a better one.


Standing by for incomeing from West time whores.

Wow Nic, 1st ever post I can agree with!
Are ya gonna start referring to above westies as scabs......considering theft and all

FA

 

[luvthe9]

Right. How about you were hired in the first few months of 1999 and thought you had it made. Guess what. You didn't.

Sorry Res, I've told you before that's my number give or take a few. I FULLY SUPPORT OUR JUNIOR PEOPLE.

 

[mrbreeze]

Why shouldn't they...every other pilot group that went through bankruptcy came out better than the east...

Step #1 of the section 1113 process is the company proposal being put on the table. It defines the company's bottom line necessary for successfully restructuring. Just because east pilots repeatedly voted for more concessions doesn't mean other groups are dumb enough to do the same...

Jim

True Jim,

But I don't know that it would be called dumb......just suckered into investing $9 billion in order to ensure that their jobs would be there in the future.....so that is one of the factors that have us where we are today. After all, the company could declare a 2nd Bk and change their proposal, which they did, but not the pilots or employees. They changed the rules at every turn, screwing us at every turn.

So, like the FA's vote today, enough is enough. Where is the return on our $9 billion? Bottom line is that they have no intention to honor their proposals.....which is my message to the AA guy.

breeze

breeze

 

[Move2CLT]

True Jim,

But I don't know that it would be called dumb......just suckered into investing $9 billion in order to ensure that their jobs would be there in the future.....so that is one of the factors that have us where we are today. After all, the company could declare a 2nd Bk and change their proposal, which they did, but not the pilots or employees. They changed the rules at every turn, screwing us at every turn.

So, like the FA's vote today, enough is enough. Where is the return on our $9 billion? Bottom line is that they have no intention to honor their proposals.....which is my message to the AA guy.

breeze

breeze

Your investment died many years ago breeze.

Time to quit trying to cash in on it. Its a whole new ballgame now.

 

[BoeingBoy]

just suckered into investing $9 billion in order to ensure that their jobs would be there in the future.

And even that didn't work...you put your money on black and red came up...

What would you call someone so easily suckered? Over and over again?

JIm

 

[mrbreeze]

And even that didn't work...you put your money on black and red came up...

What would you call someone so easily suckered? Over and over again?

JIm

Yeah, we trusted in the system and that USAir would do what they told us they would do. We did the right thing and still stand together, waiting for our return. Of course, you have no clue as to what that means, standing together.

We have all the time in the world.......with the attrition and PBGC money coming in. We can wait till hell freezes over, just on principle.

breeze