JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[pjirish317]

I have a few questions for those out there that believe that the JCBA talks are taking far too long.

1. Do you think that it's the company that is slowing down the negotiations or the Association? And why?

2. Do you think/feel that the Association should just concede to the company's proposals just to get a JCBA done?

3. Do you think/feel it's an easy task to merge 2 very different CBA's into 1 industry leading CBA?

4. How would you get a JCBA quicker than the current Negotiating Committee?

5. What do you think would have been an acceptable time frame from start to finish to have this
completed and out for us to vote on?

6. Why do you think/feel that the IAM and TWU negotiators aren't getting along, and because they aren't getting along, slowing down the process?

I'm sure that I can think of a few more questions, but let's start with these.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez,

I asked this a while ago, but I'll ask again. If I pay roughly $100 a month in medical for my Family, you're saying that I will pay $140 a month under the AA plan for family coverage? I would like to see all the plans that AA had available last open enrollment. And jusy FYI, we at LUS are trying to get back all we had to give from 2 Bankruptcies.

No Pj that comment was for Al who is single like myself. Here's a copy of the book I got in the mail. Sorry for the coffee stains. I had it on my patio table for awhile at one time.

 

[WeAAsles]

I have a few questions for those out there that believe that the JCBA talks are taking far too long.

1. Do you think that it's the company that is slowing down the negotiations or the Association? And why?

2. Do you think/feel that the Association should just concede to the company's proposals just to get a JCBA done?

3. Do you think/feel it's an easy task to merge 2 very different CBA's into 1 industry leading CBA?

4. How would you get a JCBA quicker than the current Negotiating Committee?

5. What do you think would have been an acceptable time frame from start to finish to have this
completed and out for us to vote on?

6. Why do you think/feel that the IAM and TWU negotiators aren't getting along, and because they aren't getting along, slowing down the process?

I'm sure that I can think of a few more questions, but let's start with these.

Too many questions to answer that would be purely opinions and speculative that it wouldn't be fair to give armchair Quarterback responses.

But blame for slow progress has to go all around. Actually the Members themselves also have to be counted if we want to be fair to the conversation.

When those surveys were sent out to us I'm sure no one wrote in on the comments "I'm looking for a contract that has realistic expectations" So those surveys do put pressure on those guys in the room I'm sure to bring us back major improvements on each and every article. And the fear for the Negotiators has to be if we don't like it we will vote no and then even worse vote them out for bringing it back to us?

That's an Elephant I'm sure we don't think too much about. And I also know many good reps in my career who tried their damndest for us and were still voted out because they didn't live up to our unrealistic expectations of them.

 

[bob@las-AA]

I have a few questions for those out there that believe that the JCBA talks are taking far too long.

1. Do you think that it's the company that is slowing down the negotiations or the Association? And why?

2. Do you think/feel that the Association should just concede to the company's proposals just to get a JCBA done?

3. Do you think/feel it's an easy task to merge 2 very different CBA's into 1 industry leading CBA?

4. How would you get a JCBA quicker than the current Negotiating Committee?

5. What do you think would have been an acceptable time frame from start to finish to have this
completed and out for us to vote on?

6. Why do you think/feel that the IAM and TWU negotiators aren't getting along, and because they aren't getting along, slowing down the process?

I'm sure that I can think of a few more questions, but let's start with these.

Scope
RIF
Recall
Part time
The only things really of any value, both sides are stuck on this because the company is asking for a lot.

 

[AANOTOK]

I have a few questions for those out there that believe that the JCBA talks are taking far too long.

1. Do you think that it's the company that is slowing down the negotiations or the Association? And why?

2. Do you think/feel that the Association should just concede to the company's proposals just to get a JCBA done?

3. Do you think/feel it's an easy task to merge 2 very different CBA's into 1 industry leading CBA?

4. How would you get a JCBA quicker than the current Negotiating Committee?

5. What do you think would have been an acceptable time frame from start to finish to have this
completed and out for us to vote on?

6. Why do you think/feel that the IAM and TWU negotiators aren't getting along, and because they aren't getting along, slowing down the process?

I'm sure that I can think of a few more questions, but let's start with these.

Go back and read some previous comments, you will get many answers to your many questions.

 

[robbedagain]

PJ my opin only

1. I think the company more so than the Assoc is to blame because it seems that when proposals are exchanged, particularly the major ones involving hefty money the company seems to slow up on the approach to stall speed if you will

2. No the Association should not have to concede anything Hell weve lost so much in the mid 2000s and 2 ch 11 trips its time we gain back all we lost this company is a multi billion dollar profit airline

3. its not easy but its not at all impossible take the best of both take worst of both and improve them

4 If you want a crappy one where mgmt. wants to run all over you and perform ramp duties then by all means they could just say np

5 don't know how to answer this one

6 I think both union leaders get along hashing out differences to achieve the best possible deal

 

[CremaDiLimone]

we have to acknowledge that there are 2 sides here, and one side, wants 'something', to give you more in another area(s).

in aa land, making the c/c work would be a concession. in us land, increasing the cost of insurance is a concession.

the company takes a major hit compared to dl/ua in terms of pension funding. the company can't compete with dl, in terms of compensation for p/t. going forward, the company will be fine, as parker has told the investor world the past 2 years. the company does have 2 legit (relative to competitors) gripes. this will have to be addressed.

if i'm the association, i'm willing to weigh and measure concessionary proposals related to p/t. incentivize f/t work. reward f/t work. of course, i'd look for a system and station p/t cap...

 

[WeAAsles]

we have to acknowledge that there are 2 sides here, and one side, wants 'something', to give you more in another area(s).

in aa land, making the c/c work would be a concession. in us land, increasing the cost of insurance is a concession.

the company takes a major hit compared to dl/ua in terms of pension funding. the company can't compete with dl, in terms of compensation for p/t. going forward, the company will be fine, as parker has told the investor world the past 2 years. the company does have 2 legit (relative to competitors) gripes. this will have to be addressed.

if i'm the association, i'm willing to weigh and measure concessionary proposals related to p/t. incentivize f/t work. reward f/t work. of course, i'd look for a system and station p/t cap...

The problem we have with Medical costs which is absolutely and understandably the US guys #1 priority is the difference between the two PT groups.

The US side their PTers pay Double and subsidize those lower costs for their FT members. Essentially they have a built in system of Class warfare that they don't like to admit or talk about.

The AA side our PTers pay the same rates as FT but of course our Medical is then more expensive in comparison for FT then the US side.

I think currently on both sides the total for PT workers is around 30%?

Ok the IAM guys like to talk a lot about how it would be unfair for them to come up to our Medical costs. Well would it be fair then for our PT on the TWU side to have to pay double what I'm paying? Does forcing PT to pay double for Medical incentivize the Company to want to have the max PT count they can have contractually? If PT has to pay so much more than FT will that entice them to drop out of taking a Medical plan all together costing the rest of us who are in to pay more?

Should there be some type of discouragement to wanting to remain PT built into our JCBA? If that wound up happening should PT people be grandfathered to the lower costs and only new hires get stuck with that burden? Or should the on the clock PT be given a time frame to gain FT before their costs rise?

Lots of questions that can only be answered though once the Association and the Company begin to talk about them.

 

[WeAAsles]

And does the fact that the IAM side has already received raises close to the tune of $1600.00 per month before taxes since the merger began also have to equate into the conversation?

If the Nuclear option were to occur what is the max difference in cost per month between our top tier Family plan and their current plan? Also factoring in the deductibles of course.

From my perspective Medical costs are not anywhere near the top of my list of items to be addressed in a JCBA. From what I've been told if I was under the IAM Medical plan I'd save $40 per month and have a bit less in Deductibles.

If I had to pick a top priority to look at when the JCBA lands on my desk it would have to be Retirement improvements. I'd like to see more funds going in to Retirement accounts for my even greater old age security and maybe even some type of pre 65 Medical bridge. Something that might get me out of this dump at 60 if that's what I chose.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

yeah, i hear all that. people i work with are trying to figure out how the lus guys were originally brought up to our level of hr. pay..pay less in insurance and have more holidays (i believe). in the same light, the lus guys are left out in the cold in regards to a company pension.

the questions you ask are legit, and somebody has to make some real tough decisions because you know the company is going to get something in return - and it's not going to be pay. there is no way any t/a gets ratified, let alone presented to vote on, if the money is equal to ua. questions get more difficult as time goes by and the pressure of not having a contract. what is expendable? p/t benefits?? is that the most palatable?

i also agree that the insurance issue should not be a deal-breaker.

if aa does pay the prefund match..it appears you started at an older age and you may have a nice chunk of change. if you get that back, you could have 5-6 years to invest it in a mutual fund and use that for medical insurance prior to medicare kicking in.

 

[WeAAsles]

yeah, i hear all that. people i work with are trying to figure out how the lus guys were originally brought up to our level of hr. pay..pay less in insurance and have more holidays (i believe). in the same light, the lus guys are left out in the cold in regards to a company pension.

the questions you ask are legit, and somebody has to make some real tough decisions because you know the company is going to get something in return - and it's not going to be pay. there is no way any t/a gets ratified, let alone presented to vote on, if the money is equal to ua. questions get more difficult as time goes by and the pressure of not having a contract. what is expendable? p/t benefits?? is that the most palatable?

i also agree that the insurance issue should not be a deal-breaker.

if aa does pay the prefund match..it appears you started at an older age and you may have a nice chunk of change. if you get that back, you could have 5-6 years to invest it in a mutual fund and use that for medical insurance prior to medicare kicking in.

I've thought about and talked about this often. I refuse to let our mediocre overpriced US Healthcare system make a future economic slave out of me when I retire.

I'm seriously considering bailing on the US when I retire. There's plenty of very nice places to live in the World where the Healthcare is much better and cheaper. Even Obamacare penalizes you if you're under 65 depending on how much you want to draw out of your retirement accounts. The more you draw the less you get in subsides and the more expensive it becomes. No thanks man.

It's actually incredibly sad that everyone has to have so much focus on all these insane insurance costs. The whole thing just comes off like one big scam that has all of us suckered into.

 

[WeAAsles]

Taxes

Belize applies a territorial tax system: being a permanent resident, this means you’ll only have to pay personal income tax on income derived from within Belize (when you work as an employee in Belize, for example). This also means that foreign income is not taxed at all and is tax-exempt. This offers opportunities… Additionally, Belize doesn’t levy capital gains tax nor inheritance tax.



http://www.nomoretax.eu/living/relocation-to-belize/

 

[WeAAsles]

This is what I was talking about that I would like to see from either the Association itself, our negotiatiors or someone in Fleet stepping up to the plate to give us some more insight.

Way to go TWU Local 591 President Gary Peterson. (Who does make a point that he doesn't speak for everyone but as the Leader of his group)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?sns=fb&v=VLwfyAF_Zoc

 

[Albert]

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[Albert]

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No Pj that comment was for Al who is single like myself. Here's a copy of the book I got in the mail. Sorry for the coffee stains. I had it on my patio table for awhile at one time.

If you can call a milk crate on a window ledge a patio table. 2018 Weez freakin 2018