Gary Yingst Vote letter is incorrect.....go figure?

[Chuck Schalk]

Except for the comment about what Gary Yingst motivations are and the last paragraph you are 100% correct.

If your write in option IE: IBT, AMFA, CWA, IBEW, UFCW, TWU or IAM receives the majority of votes cast, that will be moving forward your new collective bargaining agent or Union. They will inherit your current CBA and that CBA will stand until you negotiate a new one and it is ratified by your members.

Some of your members Chuck have been advocating the notion of choosing no union. As they trust you, you may want to remind them why this should absolutely not be anyone's option.

No union means you no longer wish to be represented collectively and you place your trust in negotiating directly and individually with the company. You have chosen to be at will and in some States in a "Right To Work State" as well. Of course the company will still need mechanics and will not get rid of the majority of you but they can and more than likely will send more of your OH overseas. And it 100% does mean that you no longer will have a contract and are allowing AA to dictate the new terms of your employment.

You will put yourselves in a position that 2 of the 4 major Airlines in the US are now unrepresented. Besides giving those two airlines (AA and Delta) an advantage percentage wise, you will also be harming your union counterparts at UAL and Southwest as they will have to compete against the non union airlines. That fact could cause even further erosion to wages, jobs, and benefits.

Chose who you want but understand what that choice means and make it a wise decision.

please explain what you are saying???

 

[WeAAsles]

please explain what you are saying???

Chuck your advocacy for AMFA has led some people to the decision from the things I've been reading that if AMFA is not on the ballot then they will vote for the No Union option over the association. What I am saying is that you need to be more forceful with your members in explaining to them why they should not make that choice.

Maybe you haven't been reading here that much as of late but I have. Maybe those posters saying no union are speaking through their arses and maybe they are not. I am sure that even you would not want to chance the nuclear option?

And the why's that people keep asking me is because I have very good friends who are mechanics. That's why.

 

[Chuck Schalk]

Chuck your advocacy for AMFA has led some people to the decision from the things I've been reading that if AMFA is not on the ballot then they will vote for the No Union option over the association. What I am saying is that you need to be more forceful with your members in explaining to them why they should not make that choice.

Maybe you haven't been reading here that much as of late but I have. Maybe those posters saying no union are speaking through their arses and maybe they are not. I am sure that even you would not want to chance the nuclear option?

And the why's that people keep asking me is because I have very good friends who are mechanics. That's why.

it is sad that the members are so deflated by the TWU that they would even consider "no union" as an option.  

 

[WeAAsles]

it is sad that the members are so deflated by the TWU that they would even consider "no union" as an option.  

Chuck that comment is all fine and dandy but YOU need to tell them that that is not in any way shape or form an option that YOU would ever chose. Be it Association or your write in choice, no union is no option.

That does not in any way take away your advocacy for AMFA but as a leader that you are you should feel at least some obligation to not let your members make the worst choice they could possibly ever make.

 

[2ndGENAMT]

As it is going to require a change in certification if they tried, that would be some LARGE legal issues.

They are not trying to change certifications they want to keep their respective certifications!

 

[700UW]

They are changing the certifications, going from either the IAM or TWU to the Alliance.

 

[1AA]

They are not trying to change certifications they want to keep their respective certifications!

The way it was explained to me was that if I am currently at a TWU represented station and the Alliance is voted in with an internal vote and now I am at a station that is represented by the IAM then a change in my representation body has been made. All well and fine but in order to have a different union represent me then I believe it falls under the NMB voting process. If I wanted the IBT or AMFA to represent me then the process should be the same? The IAM is now inheriting my contract just as if we voted through the NMB. Same should apply if AMFA or IBT inherits my contract under NMB rules.
 
This is why the Alliance is trying to figure a way to pass this alliance without any possibility of decertification either through a no union choice, a write in option or a intervenor. This is coming from my union reps at AA. Not from some outsider who thinks he knows what will or should happen.

 

[WeAAsles]

The way it was explained to me was that if I am currently at a TWU represented station and the Alliance is voted in with an internal vote and now I am at a station that is represented by the IAM then a change in my representation body has been made. All well and fine but in order to have a different union represent me then I believe it falls under the NMB voting process. If I wanted the IBT or AMFA to represent me then the process should be the same? The IAM is now inheriting my contract just as if we voted through the NMB. Same would apply if AMFA or IBT inherits my contract under NMB rules.
 
This is why the Alliance is trying to figure a way to pass this alliance without any possibility of desertification either through a no union choice, a write in option or a intervenor. This is coming from my union reps at AA. Not from some outsider who thinks he knows what will or should happen.

The only way that the IAM will inherit your contract would be if you vote in the association and your station has been recognized as a station to be represented by the IAM because they previously held a majority of the membership over the TWU. Or if your write in option was the IAM and they won the majority of the votes cast under the representational election.

 

[1AA]

The only way that the IAM will inherit your contract would be if you vote in the association and your station has been recognized as a station to be represented by the IAM because they previously held a majority of the membership over the TWU. Or if your write in option was the IAM and they won the majority of the votes cast under the representational election.

This is why the association is in fear of having a vote through the NMB. My own union guys told me this in person. So the TWU knows the possibility of decertification in one form or another. Things should be interesting in the coming weeks over this issue.

 

[WeAAsles]

This is why the association is in fear of having a vote through the NMB. My own union guys told me this in person. So the TWU knows the possibility of decertification in one form or another. Things should be interesting in the coming weeks over this issue.

1AA of course they are. Both organizations would and should be afraid of the idea of decertification. We ALL saw what happened over at Delta after the merger. The reality is that YOU should be afraid of that also. Decertification doesn't necessarily mean that the write in option will prevail? I wonder sometimes especially reading this forum if people's anger will outweigh their common sense or better judgement?

The IAM put out a letter a little over a week ago that basically said yes they will be hoping that the NMB just certifies the Association as the bargaining agent. So I don't see that as any kind of backroom secret.

It's debatable if that will happen or not depending on past rulings that have allowed for the possibility of that occurring? If it does I'm very sure that the NMB will have a statement of some type explaining that decision that will be shared with all.

 

[WeAAsles]

This will be done through the Alliance. The NMB will then determine if a representation determination needs to be made through an election or if the joint filing for representation by the combined unions will be accepted fully and allow the negotiating process to begin without delay.

http://www.iam141.org/us/update.html

 

[Chuck Schalk]

Chuck that comment is all fine and dandy but YOU need to tell them that that is not in any way shape or form an option that YOU would ever chose. Be it Association or your write in choice, no union is no option.

That does not in any way take away your advocacy for AMFA but as a leader that you are you should feel at least some obligation to not let your members make the worst choice they could possibly ever make.

really, lets start with who are you?

 

[1AA]

1AA of course they are. Both organizations would and should be afraid of the idea of decertification. We ALL saw what happened over at Delta after the merger. The reality is that YOU should be afraid of that also. Decertification doesn't necessarily mean that the write in option will prevail? I wonder sometimes especially reading this forum if people's anger will outweigh their common sense or better judgement?

The IAM put out a letter a little over a week ago that basically said yes they will be hoping that the NMB just certifies the Association as the bargaining agent. So I don't see that as any kind of backroom secret.

It's debatable if that will happen or not depending on past rulings that have allowed for the possibility of that occurring? If it does I'm very sure that the NMB will have a statement of some type explaining that decision that will be shared with all.

Delta has had a non union culture since water was invented for the M&E. The AMT's from NWA were a much smaller group and the AMFA executive council decided to concede instead of trying to pursue a representational run off. The AMFA knew the non union culture that was in existence at Delta for years was going to be a monumental task. At least they realized this. Here at AA the AFL-CIO is spear heading this alliance and the IAM/TWU are held with the responsibility to take the brunt of its failures and negativity. The TWU was one  of many unions and attempts to try to unionize Delta in one group or another. We all see how well that played out to this day. Now that I mentioned Delta to your response guess who will chime in soon.

 

[WeAAsles]

Delta has had a non union culture since water was invented for the M&E. The AMT's from NWA were a much smaller group and the AMFA executive council decided to concede instead of trying to pursue a representational run off. The AMFA knew the non union culture that was in existence at Delta for years was going to be a monumental task. At least they realized this. Here at AA the AFL-CIO is spear heading this alliance and the IAM/TWU are held with the responsibility to take the brunt of its failures and negativity. The TWU was one  of many unions and attempts to try to unionize Delta in one group or another. We all see how well that played out to this day. Now that I mentioned Delta to your response guess who will chime in soon.

Oh NO PLEASE do not let that nutball notice your comment. You and I may have our arguments but that guy is Coo coo for Coco puffs.

 

[WeAAsles]

really, lets start with who are you?

Chuck you know my name. All you have to do is ask Bob. And you also know I have zero title.