US Pilots Labor Discussion 1/26- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[BoeingBoy]

but I got my attirtion now!

Better not count those chickens before they hatch...

Jim

 

[Black Swan]

What good is an industry leading contract if the company can't pay the bills? Us Air was always a lousy operation brought to Tempe. They are the poster child for a dysfunctional company that should have died long ago.

You can't fix stupid.

Lets' talk dysfunction. You have the AWA chief pilot, vp of flight ops and a check airman busted in a DC-6 in Aruba filled with weed. This was a real goin' concern..........

 

[EastUS]

(boeingplt @ Feb 6 2010, 01:17 PM)
Are you saying that if US Airways pilots had another $400 mil in their contract last year that US Airways would have lost another $400 mil?"

Exactly where would that $400 million come from? Added to a $500 million loss the company had last year?

Should have negotiated an industry leading contract in 2006 when the company was in a position to offer a better contract.

Just water (and money) under the bridge.....

OK, I'm now even more confused than I usually am. :blink: Ummm...lemme' see if I have this right: An industry leading contract should have been obtained in 2006", which would magically be sustainable today without any BK procedings resulting...but..."Exactly where would that $400 million come from? Added to a $500 million loss...?"

I guess it also goes without saying that the east's efforts at regaining pay via the LOA arbitration's doomed to failure, especially since the company just can't possibly afford it (just ask them) 🙄 but....umm...All the east needs to do is immediately embrace the nic and we can all instantly "Move Forward" towards....ummmm...exactly what?..An "industry leading contract" perhaps? "Exactly where would that $400 million come from?" There's some pretty seriously cross-threaded "logic" being employed around here.............

 

[Black Swan]

Lets' talk dysfunction. You have the AWA chief pilot, vp of flight ops and a check airman busted in a DC-6 in Aruba filled with weed. This was a real goin' concern..........

Then we have you guys "helping" Ansett Airlines crack their union down. Real nice demonstration of "Integrity First......Justice Follows" I crack up every time I see that one.

 

[cleardirect]

Yo Mythbuster- you really don't have a handle on any of this, and you make it clear every time you try and "educate" us. You made the case as to why we smoked ALPA off the property. Not the blame game, It was right in your little edification. Bill Pollock handing the letters to Jerry Glass. Have you figured it out? Apparently not. Our own MEC chair was passing documents to the company negotiator! Blame Game? Wow, you really have no idea as to what was going on, and why we made ALPA a SMOKING HOLE. They sold us out.Why don't you worry about what little you have a grasp on, and let us deal with what we know happened. You have no idea, and it is clear every time you try to butt in.

You say that I don't have a handle on this yet you admitted to not even knowing what the Suzie arb or T/A 8 was. Have you read the companies opener?

Educate yourself before finding fault in others.

BTW how am I butting in? This is my union also correct? These are my union dues being spent to chase a wild goose right? It will be my union dollars that go to pay for any damages the company may file because of a dangerously frivolous grievance. I guess that makes it my business not butting into yours.

 

[Edward]

Lets' talk dysfunction. You have the AWA chief pilot, vp of flight ops and a check airman busted in a DC-6 in Aruba filled with weed. This was a real goin' concern..........

This is something that happened years ago. It has nothing to with this thread. Lets not bring it up again.

 

[inverted]

Better not count those chickens before they hatch...

Jim

You have made many good and logical points. This airline should be out of business. I hope it is soon to be out of friiggin business...weak airline and weak pilot group. It can only be a drag on the rest of the industry. Hope to see you in the unemployment line.

inverted

 

[BoeingBoy]

Hope to see you in the unemployment line.

You won't be seeing me there - the last thing I want to do is give up retirement and look for a job.

Jim

 

[snapthis]

(boeingplt @ Feb 6 2010, 01:17 PM)
Are you saying that if US Airways pilots had another $400 mil in their contract last year that US Airways would have lost another $400 mil?"



OK, I'm now even more confused than I usually am. :blink: Ummm...lemme' see if I have this right: An industry leading contract should have been obtained in 2006", which would magically be sustainable today without any BK procedings resulting...but..."Exactly where would that $400 million come from? Added to a $500 million loss...?"

I guess it also goes without saying that the east's efforts at regaining pay via the LOA arbitration's doomed to failure, especially since the company just can't possibly afford it (just ask them) 🙄 but....umm...All the east needs to do is immediately embrace the nic and we can all instantly "Move Forward" towards....ummmm...exactly what?..An "industry leading contract" perhaps? "Exactly where would that $400 million come from?" There's some pretty seriously cross-threaded "logic" being employed around here............

Maybe if we had an industry leading contract in 06, 07, 08, 09 would it be possible that employees might be a little happier? Instead , we'll show the company who is the boss by wasting fuel, slowing the operation down, etc. The cycle of dysfunction continues as it did prior to 05.

My logic says increasing the operating costs reduces the ability of the company to hand out a payraise.

 

[AWE Dog]

America West and industry leading is a oxymoron. Unless you talking about leading the industry to the bottom.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

America West and industry leading is a oxymoron. Unless you talking about leading the industry to the bottom.

And to think some people thought you were going to show us how it's done. 🙄 Yes, you're showing us allright. 😛h34r:

 

[EastUS]

Maybe if we had an industry leading contract in 06, 07, 08, 09 would it be possible that employees might be a little happier?

Most certainly, but that's clearly the very lowest concern (if it even exists at all as ANY "concern") at Rio Salado. We need look no further down that path than the CEO's comments regarding "Happy pilots equals no cost advantage." These people simply don't care, nor do they understand even the tiniest tenets of "leadership" at any level.

 

[nycbusdriver]

We in the east are 16 months from the attrition going wild from sick/LTD. 16 months from now we will have pilots in the east 63.5 years old with full sick banks..........the east will have to recall all furloughed pilots and will begin to hire off the street.

Allow me to respectfully disagree with this timeline.

Most of these geriatric pilots are full fledged "boy scouts," and would no more go on extended medical leave to burn up their sick banks than refuse the chance to "help out" when that POTA call comes.

They will retire at age 65 WITH their full sick bank, and send a personal thank you note to Doug Parker for the lump sum payment of $11(?) per hour of sick bank not used. There's nothing really wrong with that, but given the way this management treats them one must inevitably be reminded of W.C.Field's great line: "There's a sucker born every minute."

But their proud entry into retirement on the last day with full sick banks will certainly go a long way to covering the bar tabs in Tempe: "Thanks, guys, for your decades of loyal service...now, get lost (unless we can find more ways to screw you in retirement.)"

 

[nic4us]

America West and industry leading is a oxymoron. Unless you talking about leading the industry to the bottom.

Yes, you are correct. Although America West had better pay and work rules than most of their peers, such as ATA, Airtran, National, World, Braniff, Vanguard,Reno, etc...and a string of firsts for DOT accolades combined with JD Powers awards, for most of its life,( a very short life at the status of Major Airline) it was always too small to actually lead the industry.

It takes a real world class loser airline like USAir to lead the industry in lost shareholder equity, number of bankruptcies, passenger complaints and all around general lousy service. Oh, you pretty much lead the industry in biggest concession by a pilot group also. Talk about leading to the bottom.

 

[End of USAPA]

Yes, you are correct. Although America West had better pay and work rules than most of their peers, such as ATA, Airtran, National, World, Braniff, Vanguard,Reno, etc...and a string of firsts for DOT accolades combined with JD Powers awards, for most of its life,( a very short life at the status of Major Airline) it was always too small to actually lead the industry.

It takes a real world class loser airline like USAir to lead the industry in lost shareholder equity, number of bankruptcies, passenger complaints and all around general lousy service. Oh, you pretty much lead the industry in biggest concession by a pilot group also. Talk about leading to the bottom.

Oh, in interest in completing your tirade against your brothers in the east you forgot to mention your safety record ace card that you westies love to throw in our face!

Kids will be kids. ALl wee need is 1 in 3 guy, 1 in 3!