US Pilots Labor Discussion

[cleardirect]

Before anyone commits suicide it was a decision about hotels that the grievance granny lost not LOA 93.

But ring up another arbitration loss for usapa. Answer this. With 500 backed up grievances why would grievance waste an arbitration on hotel selection and why would it take a year just to complete?

Remember that sinking feeling boys when LOA 93 comes out. It may be to much for some of your old hearts to take. Have an AED standing by for you.

 

[767jetz]

Here we go. REAL Us Airways pilots. You are not DAL or Eastern. Get over yourself. AWA NEVER wanted to be US Air pilots. So to us and most of the indusrty being a real Us airways pilots is a bad thing. Dishonest, failed airline, lack of integrity. So you keep being a REAL Us Airways pilot. The rest of will reluctantly say we were merged into this disaster. Being a REAL US Airways pilot is not something to be proud of.

BTW Frank left 10 years ago. Should we call you Wolf air?

Clear,

He is none other than the poster formerly known as Nostradamus, and then sumadarson. Who else would post articles from over 10 years ago to try to prove a point. By Eastern he's referring to US east, Western to AWA.

Ignore him. He has reincarnated himself and thinks people are fooled.

 

[nic4us]

Kasher arbitration award is released. usapa lost.

Gee...what a surprise.

On a scale of 1 to 10 I am at a number "very close to zero" on the gve a shoot meter.

 

[aquagreen73s]

Before anyone commits suicide it was a decision about hotels that the grievance granny lost not LOA 93.

To think that USAPA wasted time and money litigating a useless grievance but was all too happy to cut a deal with the company on the Distance Learning in order to screw the West pilots.

And the East wonders why the West is chuckling about the impending TRO.

This is going to be fun.

 

[mrbreeze]

That is okay,, I never had it anyway.

You just posted that I was screwing you out of something. It is that mentality that is the root cause here. The only thing I am screwing you out of is the ability to steal my job. Yours was protected just as much as mine. I did not "leap frog" anybody. Who is more greedy, me for wishing to retain my status, or you for being jealous of my status and wishing to take it from me?

You really screwed the pooch 4 years ago when you voted in usapa. You had 10 years from that time to greatly improve your income and working conditions, but instead you locked yourself into 10 years of LOA93, of which at least 4 so far have been in the right seat...ouch....you will never recoupe the money you tossed down the drain. I really think the east is heading to fleet min, and say goodbye to the 190s. There are enough 190 pilots to cover what 2 years of attrition that does not start for another 15 months. And that scenario is if the east takes the TRO seriously and stops the bullshit.

If usapa puts up a fight here, it is over. Merger complete. TA nullified by court order, and the east is gone.

Ok, I will take one more stab at this....

Here is how I see this effecting each of us. If the NIC is where this all ends up....

You will gain seniority over a bunch of East pilot when you claim your "company" position. It may even buy you a Cpt seat in the 767, as an example. You have nothing to lose from the NIC example. As for me, I would watch you guys leap frog me into Cpt seats, not allowing me back in the left seat until I retire.....damaging to me. The difference between the NIC and DOH is 1800 numbers for me.

However, if DOH is the rule, you get to retain your CPT status in PHX through C&Rs......protecting you from damage to your career, while I have the ability to regain something in this screwed up career. I have no desire to come to PHX and take your job.....all I want is a chance to finish out my career while not taking anything from another pilot.

However, your post indicates that you want to take as much as you possibly can from anyone that gets in your way.....the NIC is that avenue for you.

So, if you feel that you deserve to leap frog the East pilots through the NIC.....that is greed.

breeze

 

[luvn737s]

No one here cares about your personal life. If you even have one.

 

[mrbreeze]

No one here cares about your personal life. If you even have one.

Yeah, I know, my incestuous brother!

 

[NoYellowNeck]

An east guy talking about someone else's greed - now that's hypocrisy.

 

[cleardirect]

Ok, I will take one more stab at this....

Here is how I see this effecting each of us. If the NIC is where this all ends up....

You will gain seniority over a bunch of East pilot when you claim your "company" position. It may even buy you a Cpt seat in the 767, as an example. You have nothing to lose from the NIC example. As for me, I would watch you guys leap frog me into Cpt seats, not allowing me back in the left seat until I retire.....damaging to me. The difference between the NIC and DOH is 1800 numbers for me.

However, if DOH is the rule, you get to retain your CPT status in PHX through C&Rs......protecting you from damage to your career, while I have the ability to regain something in this screwed up career. I have no desire to come to PHX and take your job.....all I want is a chance to finish out my career while not taking anything from another pilot.

However, your post indicates that you want to take as much as you possibly can from anyone that gets in your way.....the NIC is that avenue for you.

So, if you feel that you deserve to leap frog the East pilots through the NIC.....that is greed.

breeze

So if you have 1800 west pilots senior to you, you were furlough meaning you brought no job to the table. If US Airways stayed in business separate ops you would have been lucky to get called back or ever upgrade. Let alone capt on a 767. The Nicolau left you in your position and career expectation. Bottom of this list.

With DOH our junior CAPTAIN is placed behind every east captain, every active east F/O and 175 east furloughed pilots. That places west F/O's behind every east captain, every east active F/O and most of the furloughed east pilots. You say that west captains can keep their seats in PHX. What about the west F/O's when do they upgrade? You would have it after every east F/O active or furloughed. Nicolau did not see it the way. No one sees it that way except you.

DOH will never happen. usapa C&BL do not allow it. Your career expectation was to sit on furlough and reserve for a very long time. DOH places you senior to west captains that was never your career expectation. DOH of hire take from another pilot. You had better figure that out.

 

[goneflyin]

Thanks, I will take a look. How about the other question? Were you aware that Nicolau did that here? Brucias dissent? It good reading.

There's a PID and a fleet snapshot date in the Delta award. They're different dates, and the justification is in the text of the award. I read the Nicolau decision when it came out, but I would have read it again to refresh my memory.

 

[mrbreeze]

So if you have 1800 west pilots senior to you, you were furlough meaning you brought no job to the table. If US Airways stayed in business separate ops you would have been lucky to get called back or ever upgrade. Let alone capt on a 767. The Nicolau left you in your position and career expectation. Bottom of this list.

With DOH our junior CAPTAIN is placed behind every east captain, every active east F/O and 175 east furloughed pilots. That places west F/O's behind every east captain, every east active F/O and most of the furloughed east pilots. You say that west captains can keep their seats in PHX. What about the west F/O's when do they upgrade? You would have it after every east F/O active or furloughed. Nicolau did not see it the way. No one sees it that way except you.

DOH will never happen. usapa C&BL do not allow it. Your career expectation was to sit on furlough and reserve for a very long time. DOH places you senior to west captains that was never your career expectation. DOH of hire take from another pilot. You had better figure that out.

That 1800 number is a bit misleading, so your math is off. my fault. I don't have time to explain now...gotta head to work. I have never been furloughed and the only reserve time I have done is 2 months when I first came over to the 76....in my 25 yrs. The 1800 is the difference between where the NIC puts me as opposed to where DOH puts me...not just str8 west pilots above me.

 

[A320 Driver]

To think that USAPA wasted time and money litigating a useless grievance but was all too happy to cut a deal with the company on the Distance Learning in order to screw the West pilots.

And the East wonders why the West is chuckling about the impending TRO.

This is going to be fun.

Please explain to me how the West pilots got screwed on this deal other than the fact that your reps weren't present. I watched the crew news from PHX. Looks like the same outcome either way. So what is the big deal other than you got your feelings hurt?


Driver B)

 

[luvn737s]

Please explain to me how the West pilots got screwed on this deal other than the fact that your reps weren't present. I watched the crew news from PHX. Looks like the same outcome either way. So what is the big deal other than you got your feelings hurt?


Driver B)

Why should the grievance process be truncated on west grievances worth millions, rather than letting it run its course and determine if the company really can go back as far as it wants to collect money? Why didn't Parella invite full participation with west pilots? Did she ever come out to a West pilot meeting and even talk to them?

Is that how you think an effective union should be run?

 

[A320 Driver]

Why should the grievance process be truncated on west grievances worth millions, rather than letting it run its course and determine if the company really can go back as far as it wants to collect money? Why didn't Parella invite full participation with west pilots? Did she ever come out to a West pilot meeting and even talk to them?

Is that how you think an effective union should be run?

I don't remember being asked to weigh in on a grievance before. What IS an effective union anyway? I used to go to MEC meetings when we had ALPA. I didn't see much except arguing there either.

I honestly don't think there is any such thing as an effective union. You could turn this whole thing back over to ALPA tomorrow and it would be the same problems and the same players.

How come you guys could turn out in mass to be part of a grievance but you claim you can't organize a group to explore solutions to our current dilemma?

Driver B)

 

[Claxon]

Clear,

He is none other than the poster formerly known as Nostradamus, and then sumadarson. Who else would post articles from over 10 years ago to try to prove a point. By Eastern he's referring to US east, Western to AWA.

Ignore him. He has reincarnated himself and thinks people are fooled.

Yes, who would post 10 year old articles, when the same situation exists. Tell us what has changed for the better? The western has dragged the eastern pilots and employees into a larger swamp.The same mismanaged airline merged with another poorly managed one, and surprise, it is one BIG horrible airline! And you work for them! Just wait till you see how Southwest handles Airtran! That will be an example of how it should be done.